6 Years And.......

stevetheupsguy

sʇǝʌǝʇɥǝndsƃnʎ
I've been on the old route for just over a week now and someone junior is whining about how the center manager is not going according to the contract. The fact that the driver next in seniority to me, and I have swapped routes doesn't affect anyone in the whole building, nor would anyone have chosen either route, when the bids came up. The center manager, Shop Stewards and BA are all okay with the swap, since it doesn't adversely affect anyone, but this guy is running his mouth, and not at me, mind you, but at the center manager, threatening to file a grieveance. I would like to know what he intends to file a grieveance for, since no deals were made with the center manager. All this move does, is help out a couple of fellow driver's. It's good, all around.
 

UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)

Well-Known Member
I have thought about this swap since you first mentioned it and IMO the fair thing to do would have been for anyone senior to you and the other driver be given the opportunity to bid on either area. Drivers junior to either of you would not have been able to bid on either area when the bids were done so should not be afforded the opportunity to do so at this time. The junior driver needs to forget it as he has no basis for a grievance.
 

Jones

fILE A GRIEVE!
Staff member
Even though what you guys did didn't effect anyone else because you're right next to each other in seniority, technically it's not proper bid procedure so I suppose he could file a grievance over that. Given the fact that there is no way he can benefit directly even if he wins the grievance, I'm guessing that he's really angling for something else and is using this situation to gain a little leverage.
 

over9five

Moderator
Staff member
I agree. Even if the junior driver cannot benefit from this, it is still improper to trade routes. A bid was held, routes were picked. You live with what you got till the next bid. Everyone who let you guys do this did you an under the table favor.

That being said.......Hope you guys get to keep the routes you want!
 

menotyou

bella amicizia
Sorry, Steve. Fair is fair. What happens the next bid cycle and the guy you traded with hates that new bid?

Now, I agree with Jones that the junior driver is using the situation for something. Curious for what? Let us know.
 

Cementups

Box Monkey
The center manager could just put your names back on the unwanted routes and just have you covering each others routes for the next two years..
 

barnyard

KTM rider
The center manager could just put your names back on the unwanted routes and just have you covering each others routes for the next two years..

That happened in our center until someone grieved it. Bids were hung and the only people that signed were the original 2 and a bunch of drivers that were junior to them. Turned out, some higher seniority drivers baited the lower guys.
 

stevetheupsguy

sʇǝʌǝʇɥǝndsƃnʎ
I have thought about this swap since you first mentioned it and IMO the fair thing to do would have been for anyone senior to you and the other driver be given the opportunity to bid on either area. Drivers junior to either of you would not have been able to bid on either area when the bids were done so should not be afforded the opportunity to do so at this time. The junior driver needs to forget it as he has no basis for a grievance.
No senior driver's care, as these 2 routes are really heavy. The junior driver is whining because he got bumped from his cushy route and chose one that he doesn't like. He ALWAYS cries when things don't go his way.

Even though what you guys did didn't effect anyone else because you're right next to each other in seniority, technically it's not proper bid procedure so I suppose he could file a grievance over that. Given the fact that there is no way he can benefit directly even if he wins the grievance, I'm guessing that he's really angling for something else and is using this situation to gain a little leverage.
Agreed, there would be no benefit for him, unless!

I agree. Even if the junior driver cannot benefit from this, it is still improper to trade routes. A bid was held, routes were picked. You live with what you got till the next bid. Everyone who let you guys do this did you an under the table favor.

That being said.......Hope you guys get to keep the routes you want!
Agreed, they helped us out, but with no promises, just 2 guys that benefitted by being on different routes. Agreed on the latter part, as well.

I totally agree that this is not done according to contract. That being said, there's really nothing and no one being adversely affected by us swapping routes. I was actually supposed to swapped routes with the mall guy, back a couple months ago. There were 7 guys in between us, and the BA said that if any of those guys griped, the deal could not be made. 1 guy griped (The same junior guy), and that deal was squashed. NOW, we have this situation, and the same junior driver is crying. What for? Just go pick up your UPS store and shut it, already!:surprised:
 

outta hours

Well-Known Member
If the jr driver files a grievance it will be ruled that you return to the routes you both bid on. That is what the contract is for, rules and guidelines. There has to be some sense of order amongst the chaos. I know that you feel it is hurting no one. But the truth is it hurts everyone whenever we make "deals" to get or do what "we" want. Your rationalization to benefit yourself is way off. You say he is "crying" but from where I sit, it looks like you are "crying" also trying to weasel out of your bid route.

In your logic what would prevent drivers from switching routes everyday? The higher guys could come in and see what was light and run it. Everyone would squawk then because they are not on their bid route. You bid the route, you keep it till the next bid. End of story. Shame on your local or BA for allowing this to go on for one day. If the route you guys chose sucks, then so be it. Take something else next time. We have all bid routes that were not as we expected once we got on them. Man up and run it and quit looking for ways out of it, or making "deals" not to run it. Its wrong. Ask yourself if the other driver wanted to switch but you didn't would it still be OK? Its still the same contract violation.

As a union member ( if you are) we are expected to do the job and follow the contract to the best of our abilities. Management violates it daily I know. Hold yourself to a higher standard. Every time we make a "deal " to help them or ourselves we weaken the agreement and our union. It shows them we don't care about, or follow the contract either. Don't be foolish enough not to realize that they will use that to their advantage. Next time you have an issue this "deal" will be in play and brought up.

The union is bigger than each of our own selfish desires. I get so tired of hearing that " well it worked for me that's all i care about" . Trust me the company loves that attitude. Go in Monday and run the route you bid on. It's the right thing to do.
 

stevetheupsguy

sʇǝʌǝʇɥǝndsƃnʎ
If the jr driver files a grievance it will be ruled that you return to the routes you both bid on. That is what the contract is for, rules and guidelines. There has to be some sense of order amongst the chaos. I know that you feel it is hurting no one. But the truth is it hurts everyone whenever we make "deals" to get or do what "we" want. Your rationalization to benefit yourself is way off. You say he is "crying" but from where I sit, it looks like you are "crying" also trying to weasel out of your bid route.

In your logic what would prevent drivers from switching routes everyday? The higher guys could come in and see what was light and run it. Everyone would squawk then because they are not on their bid route. You bid the route, you keep it till the next bid. End of story. Shame on your local or BA for allowing this to go on for one day. If the route you guys chose sucks, then so be it. Take something else next time. We have all bid routes that were not as we expected once we got on them. Man up and run it and quit looking for ways out of it, or making "deals" not to run it. Its wrong. Ask yourself if the other driver wanted to switch but you didn't would it still be OK? Its still the same contract violation.

As a union member ( if you are) we are expected to do the job and follow the contract to the best of our abilities. Management violates it daily I know. Hold yourself to a higher standard. Every time we make a "deal " to help them or ourselves we weaken the agreement and our union. It shows them we don't care about, or follow the contract either. Don't be foolish enough not to realize that they will use that to their advantage. Next time you have an issue this "deal" will be in play and brought up.

The union is bigger than each of our own selfish desires. I get so tired of hearing that " well it worked for me that's all i care about" . Trust me the company loves that attitude. Go in Monday and run the route you bid on. It's the right thing to do.
I get you outta, and respect your post. I wasn't saying all driver's on any bid routes, I was saying the driver that is just senior, to me. He bid the route I was on, bumping me and leaving me with plenty of choices. I chose his old route, and was willing to suck it up for the next 2 years, till next bid. HE approached me, saying how he hated the route he was currently doing, and would I be willing to switch/swap. I thought he was pulling my chain, till I was approached by my On-Road.

Prior to this, it was known that I was on a route I did not want to be on, so someone came up with the idea of switching me to the mall route. I think the parties involved thought I would smoke that route, seeing as I want to get off the clock and home to my girls, as soon as capable. The problem in that trade was there were 7 guys in between us, and the Union and MGMT were cool with the trade, as long as no one complained. NOW, if they were all cool with THAT plan, how much more this one, that didn't involve anyone, but the 2 driver's swapping routes? So now, this driver that's making noise, has no basis for that noise. If the first "deal" was okay, the second "deal" should be even MORE okay.

I am more than willing to go back to the bid route, IF I MUST! But, why would one "deal, be okay, yet another, even better one, not?
Like I said, outta, I respect your opinion and honesty. I respect the talking to you gave me, above. Please be nice, because I'm sensitive and at a weird juncture in life that has me confused.
 

outta hours

Well-Known Member
I meant no disrespect or meanness to you or your personal situation. But you touched on the reason that "deals" are bad. Once you or anyone else starts making them, where do you draw the line? That's exactly why they hurt everyone, even if they are not involved directly at the time. It becomes a free for all and chaos ensues.

The "original deal" with the mall route should not have been allowed either. This is a clear cut issue, that needs no interpretation. Bid drivers reamin on bid routes until they are bumped or bid off of them. End of story. You say you will run your bid route if you "MUST". Well you "MUST" because contractually you are obligated to do so.

If you cave on this how can management or your fellow drivers, respect you? How could you respect yourself? Doing the right thing is often painful, inconvenient, and difficult. In life and also at UPS. Especially when others around you seem to be getting away with doing the wrong thing and benefiting from it. It happens to me too, I get that. But I also know where I stand and that no one will ever question my motives, or integrity. Lots of my fellow stewards make "deals" that they benefit from. That "me " first attitude is a huge part of the problem we face daily as employees and society in general.

I wish you luck in your situation. This is only my opinion/view on the topic. If you ask 100 people, you will get many different responses. If I made you think just a bit about the "whole" situation then that's great. We are so caught up in the moment, we lose sight of the dominoes down the line that will also fall....... Take care
 

themidnightoil

Well-Known Member
we bid every 2 years here. I was on the same bid route for 10 years. not a great route but knew everything about it. was a runner for the first 7-8 years but was tired of getting more and more stops added to me and having 11 hour planned days all the time so I started taking lunch and work safer and making a ton of overtime. so instead of running 21-23 sporh, was down to 17-18. center manager ask me what wrong with my numbers. he want me to run 21 sph again. my reply was I am not running all day and skipping my lunch anymore for you. I will only skip my lunch for me when I want to get done early. so on the next bid that route became and unassigned route. the center manager told me it's my turn to bid and since the old route I was on is not a bid route any more, what are you going to do now with a cocky voice. I told him I will take this route. why do you want that route asked the center manager. my reply was " I live on that route. now I can have lunch at home every day"... the look on his face looked like I kneed him in the grion. 2 year later my that route was unassigned. I am now on an extended "oldman's" route that has been mine for the last 8 years. when I first bid this route, I made sure I told some onroads that if this route was changes from a bid route to unassigned I was going to file an harassment grievance. had no more problems and that center manager took the buyout a few years ago.

it's funny because now sometimes I am done at 5 and other days with the same stops I am not done until 8. now it's "why are your miles so off from one day to the next"? 100 on fast days and 130 to 150 on others. they did a production ride the other day and found out. my reply to their question was that if my day was light and I skipped my lunch and busted the stops off and do not have long runners or break trace on those days, yes I can get done early and with low miles. if I have days like I had when you did your ride and I have tons of bulk and having to break trace to get extended airs done and get back to trace and have lots of long runners and run misloads, my miles will jack-up like that day to 142. was told by my onroad that I did a great job and ran scratch in his eyes that day with what I had. wonder if my route will still be up for bid the next time around?
 
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