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<blockquote data-quote="The Other Side" data-source="post: 641847" data-attributes="member: 17969"><p>TIEGUY,</p><p></p><p>Your position on this thread is one of the reasons the republicans are no longer in power.</p><p></p><p>You JUST DONT GET IT.</p><p></p><p>You were sold on this concept of "war on terror", even though it was merely a slogan with NO TEETH. Many of our youngest hard working americans have paid with their lives defending this slogan.</p><p></p><p>It has all been in vain.</p><p></p><p>You in particular, buy into the concept of snatching up people off the streets of foriegn countries and taking them to a secret prison in some country that ISNT a member of the Geneva Convention, beating and tortuing them for months, transferring them to GITMO when the heat starts to rise and then holding them without trials for YEARS, only to let them go seretly without ever being charged.</p><p></p><p>This is a war against terror? Sounds more like we are pissing people off even moreso than before. Do you think these men who are held for years dont return to their host countries and join a group who hates america?</p><p></p><p>BUSH and CHENEY have violated the Geneva Conventions and used the excuse that the prisoners captured were enemy combatants and that they were held in countries where the Geneva convention rules didnt apply.</p><p></p><p>One thing you dont hear on FOX news, or hear on Rush Limbaugh, is the reality of what is happening to GITMO prisoners. How about this case where the convictions were overturned?? I am sure you dont have the first clue that this is happening in many cases regarding GITMO prisoners.</p><p></p><p><strong>The terror convictions of five former Guantánamo Bay detainees have been overturned in France after the high court ruled the evidence of their guilt was obtained in a manner that violated French rules of evidence and the </strong><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20090629061517/http://www.unhchr.ch/html/menu3/b/91.htm" target="_blank"><span style="color: #bf8800"><strong>terms of the Geneva Convention</strong></span></a><strong>.</strong></p><p><strong>Mourad Benchellali on Guantánamo Bay Interrogations</strong></p><p></p><p></p><p style="margin-left: 20px">"I can not describe in just a few lines the suffering and the torture."</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p><p>Mourad Benchellali, 26, former detainee</p><p>Source: <a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/25/world/europe/25france.html?_r=1&partner=rss" target="_blank"><span style="color: #bf8800">http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/25/world/europe/25france.html?_r=1&partner=rss</span></a></p><p></p><p></p><p><strong>Mourad Benchellali</strong>, 26; <strong>Brahim Yadel</strong>, 37; <strong>Nizar Sassi</strong>, 27; <strong>Khaled Ben Mustapha</strong>, 35; and <strong>Redouane Khalid</strong>, 39; were detained at the Guantánamo Bay after their individual captures in Afghanistan in 2001 and 2002.</p><p></p><p><strong>While at the Guantánamo Bay facility the men claimed they were tortured</strong> until they offered confessions which were then used to convict them. The French court agreed that the <strong>interrogations of the men while at Guantánamo were not in accordance with international law</strong>.</p><p></p><p>The confessions were the only evidence supporting the terror convictions. The French high court determined that <strong>without the shakey confessions there was no evidence of wrong doing</strong> by the defendants.</p><p></p><p><strong><span style="font-size: 12px">Maybe TIEGUY, you should learn to set aside your party rhetoric, and actually learn what is happening at GITMO.</span></strong></p><p></p><p>How many soldiers lost their lives so we could detain these men for 8 years, torture them, convict them in our MILITARY TRIBUNAL Kangaroo Court, only to have the convictions overturned because we violated international law?</p><p></p><p>Then again, you said you didnt care.</p><p></p><p>If they were convicted in a federal court, given a fair trial and sentenced to either death or life, this would have never happened.</p><p></p><p>The overturning of GITMO convictions is only growing each month and the OBAMA administrations position of bringing these trials to federal court is the ONLY way to justify, prosecute and convict GITMO prisoners and eliminate another country from overturning a CONVICTION.</p><p></p><p>The BUSH detainee program is over, AMERICA can no longer violate international law and OBAMA will see to it.</p><p></p><p>Party Rhetoric will never subsitute for american jurisprudence.</p><p></p><p>One thing to remember TIE, the men at GITMO have not been charged with anything, they were simply snatched up somewhere in the middle east and eventually brought to GITMO and tortured for information.</p><p></p><p>They were not captured while fighting in IRAQ or AFGHANISTAN, some were captured in yemen, somalia, pakistan, saudi arabia, egypt,jordan and algeria.</p><p></p><p>Hardly the "field of battle" as claimed by the republicans. This is another exagerated term. The BUSH administration used the term and extended it to the whole middle east to justify the capture of most of the prisoners at GITMO. Just another wonder of the "war on terror".</p><p></p><p>Do some research TIEGUY. Tell us how many prisoners at GITMO came from IRAQ or AFGHANISTAN? I wont hold my breath.</p><p></p><p>GITMO is nothing more than another failed project by the BUSH administration left on the desk of president OBAMA to handle.</p><p></p><p>The one thing President OBAMA has done for America, is to restore our credibility around the world. During BUSH, there wasnt <strong>ONE COUNTRY</strong> he could visit where he wasnt greeted by thousands of protesters and his image burned in effigy.</p><p></p><p>Today, OBAMA is welcomed around the world. I suggest you embrace the redefining of our country to the world, and take your blinders off.</p><p></p><p><img src="/community/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/emoticons/woohoo.gif" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":woohoo:" title="Woohoo :woohoo:" data-shortname=":woohoo:" /></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>p.s. TIEGUY, for 8 years, BUSH was the most hated leader in the world, his image burned in effigy and he was condemned by thousands of people around the world.</p><p></p><p>Today, BUSH is gone, the world is thankful and our new president is once again a respected leader of the free world.</p><p></p><p>However, the only place where OBAMA is mocked and protested is right here in rural USA by the republicans.</p><p></p><p>I wonder who has it wrong?? The hundreds of millions of people around the world and the 52 million who voted for OBAMA or the 49 million republicans who believe BUSH was right??</p><p></p><p>Do the math.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="The Other Side, post: 641847, member: 17969"] TIEGUY, Your position on this thread is one of the reasons the republicans are no longer in power. You JUST DONT GET IT. You were sold on this concept of "war on terror", even though it was merely a slogan with NO TEETH. Many of our youngest hard working americans have paid with their lives defending this slogan. It has all been in vain. You in particular, buy into the concept of snatching up people off the streets of foriegn countries and taking them to a secret prison in some country that ISNT a member of the Geneva Convention, beating and tortuing them for months, transferring them to GITMO when the heat starts to rise and then holding them without trials for YEARS, only to let them go seretly without ever being charged. This is a war against terror? Sounds more like we are pissing people off even moreso than before. Do you think these men who are held for years dont return to their host countries and join a group who hates america? BUSH and CHENEY have violated the Geneva Conventions and used the excuse that the prisoners captured were enemy combatants and that they were held in countries where the Geneva convention rules didnt apply. One thing you dont hear on FOX news, or hear on Rush Limbaugh, is the reality of what is happening to GITMO prisoners. How about this case where the convictions were overturned?? I am sure you dont have the first clue that this is happening in many cases regarding GITMO prisoners. [B]The terror convictions of five former Guantánamo Bay detainees have been overturned in France after the high court ruled the evidence of their guilt was obtained in a manner that violated French rules of evidence and the [/B][URL='https://web.archive.org/web/20090629061517/http://www.unhchr.ch/html/menu3/b/91.htm'][COLOR=#bf8800][B]terms of the Geneva Convention[/B][/COLOR][/URL][B]. Mourad Benchellali on Guantánamo Bay Interrogations[/B] [INDENT]"I can not describe in just a few lines the suffering and the torture." [/INDENT] Mourad Benchellali, 26, former detainee Source: [URL='http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/25/world/europe/25france.html?_r=1&partner=rss'][COLOR=#bf8800]http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/25/world/europe/25france.html?_r=1&partner=rss[/COLOR][/URL] [B]Mourad Benchellali[/B], 26; [B]Brahim Yadel[/B], 37; [B]Nizar Sassi[/B], 27; [B]Khaled Ben Mustapha[/B], 35; and [B]Redouane Khalid[/B], 39; were detained at the Guantánamo Bay after their individual captures in Afghanistan in 2001 and 2002. [B]While at the Guantánamo Bay facility the men claimed they were tortured[/B] until they offered confessions which were then used to convict them. The French court agreed that the [B]interrogations of the men while at Guantánamo were not in accordance with international law[/B]. The confessions were the only evidence supporting the terror convictions. The French high court determined that [B]without the shakey confessions there was no evidence of wrong doing[/B] by the defendants. [B][SIZE=3]Maybe TIEGUY, you should learn to set aside your party rhetoric, and actually learn what is happening at GITMO.[/SIZE][/B] How many soldiers lost their lives so we could detain these men for 8 years, torture them, convict them in our MILITARY TRIBUNAL Kangaroo Court, only to have the convictions overturned because we violated international law? Then again, you said you didnt care. If they were convicted in a federal court, given a fair trial and sentenced to either death or life, this would have never happened. The overturning of GITMO convictions is only growing each month and the OBAMA administrations position of bringing these trials to federal court is the ONLY way to justify, prosecute and convict GITMO prisoners and eliminate another country from overturning a CONVICTION. The BUSH detainee program is over, AMERICA can no longer violate international law and OBAMA will see to it. Party Rhetoric will never subsitute for american jurisprudence. One thing to remember TIE, the men at GITMO have not been charged with anything, they were simply snatched up somewhere in the middle east and eventually brought to GITMO and tortured for information. They were not captured while fighting in IRAQ or AFGHANISTAN, some were captured in yemen, somalia, pakistan, saudi arabia, egypt,jordan and algeria. Hardly the "field of battle" as claimed by the republicans. This is another exagerated term. The BUSH administration used the term and extended it to the whole middle east to justify the capture of most of the prisoners at GITMO. Just another wonder of the "war on terror". Do some research TIEGUY. Tell us how many prisoners at GITMO came from IRAQ or AFGHANISTAN? I wont hold my breath. GITMO is nothing more than another failed project by the BUSH administration left on the desk of president OBAMA to handle. The one thing President OBAMA has done for America, is to restore our credibility around the world. During BUSH, there wasnt [B]ONE COUNTRY[/B] he could visit where he wasnt greeted by thousands of protesters and his image burned in effigy. Today, OBAMA is welcomed around the world. I suggest you embrace the redefining of our country to the world, and take your blinders off. :woohoo: p.s. TIEGUY, for 8 years, BUSH was the most hated leader in the world, his image burned in effigy and he was condemned by thousands of people around the world. Today, BUSH is gone, the world is thankful and our new president is once again a respected leader of the free world. However, the only place where OBAMA is mocked and protested is right here in rural USA by the republicans. I wonder who has it wrong?? The hundreds of millions of people around the world and the 52 million who voted for OBAMA or the 49 million republicans who believe BUSH was right?? Do the math. [/QUOTE]
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