An Appeal To UPSer's From FedEx Drivers

quadro

Well-Known Member
You'll have to admit that there are a lot of FedEx people that are "sheeple", and don't stand-up for their rights. Memphis pretty much makes dictates as it pleases, and we're just supposed to go along with it. How do you feel about going backwards every year in terms of your pay relative to the cost of living?
Unfortunately, this is such a weak argument. Again, as I've said, show me a group of people at any company who don't want to make more money. That's today's economy. I don't have to like it or live with it if I don't want to, but it is what it is. You are absolutely right about one thing; there are people who blindly believe their peers. And it goes both ways. When they are fed incorrect information about how much better they would be with a union, they believe it. They don't do the research and are not informed enough to make an educated decision.

The one group of employees who have been smart are the pilots. They initially agreed to an in-house union, which they rapidly realized wasn't going to work. Then they joined ALPA, which has done an excellent job of standing-up for their rights. Although upper management tries to play games wth them, the pilots can shut the company down if they don't get a fair deal. Their most recent contract was excellent.....wouldn't you like the opportunity to negotiate a better deal for you and your family? Or are you happy with the meager raises that are metered out every once in awhile that bring us to where we should have been 5 years ago?
It's not really apples to apples to compare yourself to the pilots. Entry level versus skilled position. I know that there are pilots who feel just as strongly against the union as those that want it, but that is mostly true for any group of employees. I'm not sure I would want the opportunity to negotiate. For me, things are decent. The overall benefits are good. Why roll the dice and take a chance on that. I could very easily end up with $5/hr more in pay and a benefit package that costs me on average $7/hour (just an example, but hopefully you get the point).

Where I work, overtime has basically been eliminated, which was the one area where you could try and make-up the difference. You say you've been around 20+ years....remember jumpseat, profit-sharing, no mandatory split-shifts? Jeez, at one station I worked at, the management would require 3 hour splits when volumes were down, or try and send you home early after about 4 hours on the clock. And I'm not talking post or pre-holiday periods either. I refused to take splits or go home early and was threatened each time. Since when is it our responsibility to take extra-long breaks just so productivity looks good and FedEx can save money? These are just a few examples of the way management takes full advantage of our inability to fight back. Oh yeah, we have PSP, Open Door, and GFT, all of which are a joke unless you're the member of a protected class. A union would provide a legitimate grievance process. Sure, it wouldn't be perfect, but it would be better than what we have now. And whatever retirement plan was negotiated would be better than what we have now too.
If you've got no overtime, you've got no volume. See, here's the thing, with a union, managers have the potential to layoff employees. That'll create your overtime at the expense of other employees. That's a nice thing to do. Current system protects ALL employees by providing at least a minimum of hours.
The fact that you bring up jumpseating as a lost benefit shows that you're not fully informed. I don't want to insult your intelligence, but you do know why there's no personal jumpseating, right? You do also know that when FedEx had a golden opportunity to stop it several years prior to 2001, they didn't?
Split-shifts. Again, show me a company that puts employees on the clock when there's no work and we can all go work there. Union in place means that there's a possibility that full-time employees would be layed off.
Have you ever used the GFT process? What makes you think that a Union grievance process would be any more beneficial?
Negotiated retirement plan? Are you listening to yourself? There is zero guarantee that you would have any type of retirement plan, let alone one that is better. You cannot possibly know that it would be better. If you do, then please tell me what the lottery numbers will be for next week.

Like I said, if I were younger I'd leave, and I should have seen the writing on the wall. That's on me, but it doesn't mean I'm going to sit back and keep on being abused. Talk to your peers and see how they feel about the direction the company has taken. Cutting costs to the bone isn't always smart, and de-contenting the Express division is starting to bear some bitter fruit. We have freight that misses the plane almost every day because the new breed of employee doesn't have the skills to get the job done or is so overloaded they can't get it done. No wonder we're losing market share to the competition in the overnight market.
A lot of my peers have a lot of different feelings. Some don't overspend and can live comfortably on today's paycheck. Some can't live on 55 hours. Doesn't mean a union would or would not benefit either of them. Unfortunately, your example of lesser skilled employees is indicative of the culture at FedEx. Give people a chance, help them succeed. Don't fire them for one mistake. Can't say that would happen with a union, it all depends on what is negotiated.

FedEx used to be a quality company that you could be proud to work for. Now it's just a job.
As I've said, don't be too sure that a union would be the best thing for FedEx and its employees. I'm sure it would help a lot of employees but I'm equally sure that it wouldn't help a lot of employees. That's why I encourage you to do your research, weigh all the facts, and make an educated decision. I hate to repeat myself more than I already have, but your jumpseat reference just amazes me. Why would you even bring that up? It discredits you and your arguments as it blatantly shows that your grasping at straws to prove your points. People that understand what's at stake will look at that and question what else you are throwing and hoping it sticks.

Again, no hard feelings, good discussion. Just do the research and stick to relevant facts. I hope that things work out for you. For me, I'm pretty happy with what I have. I'm proud to work for FedEx and don't think a union is for me.
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
Jumpseating is still available (and often required) for business travel. Personal jumpseating could (and should) be brought back ASAP as security procedures include both a search of any carry-on items and a background check of the employee. A ramp agent personally searches both you and your baggage before you get anywhere near the aircraft. If you want to jumpseat you have to submit to the same procedures it takes to get an airport badge (fingerprinting and the TSA/FBI background investigation). The current badge system has a provision for jumpseat-qualified people and such persons have a notation printed directly on the badge. So much for my ignorance of jumpseating. And for many employees who hail from Memphis it was a very big deal to lose the benefit, as MEM is an airline backwater that is difficult to get to without a bunch of transfers from most of the country.

The real reasons personal jumpseat was jettisoned were the cost of the reservation system and the fact that the pilots don't like to be seen reading Playboy or the Robb Report (or falling asleep) or telling each other who has the biggest tits among the female pilots.I've seen plenty of things happen while jumping (including near-misses and not being able to locate an airport) that could have cost a few people their jobs. 9-11 just made getting rid of it a lot more convenient.It's no secret that the pilots think hourly employees are beneath them. It's pretty ironic that the 1 real dangerous incident that has taken place actually involved an insane pilot, not an hourly.

Like I said, it's all about saving money and not about the employee. How is anyone supposed to contribute the max to their great new PPP when they cannot even afford to make ends meet? I'm glad it's working for you, but I really hate to see so many people being used and abused and not being able to do anything about it. I enjoy the debate too, but I wish more employees would wake up and see that they can create a better future. If we did go union, what makes you think that we're going to get a worse deal than what we already have? Sure, the company could make a crappy offer...that's what negotiations are for. And if they continue to make lousy offers, we walk out like UPS did in 1997 and bring them back to the table with an offer that works.
 

VTBrown

Well-Known Member
"And if they continue to make lousy offers, we walk out like UPS did in 1997 and bring them back to the table with an offer that works."

I for one would absolutely LOVE to see that happen!
 

quadro

Well-Known Member
Jumpseating is still available (and often required) for business travel. Personal jumpseating could (and should) be brought back ASAP as security procedures include both a search of any carry-on items and a background check of the employee. A ramp agent personally searches both you and your baggage before you get anywhere near the aircraft. If you want to jumpseat you have to submit to the same procedures it takes to get an airport badge (fingerprinting and the TSA/FBI background investigation). The current badge system has a provision for jumpseat-qualified people and such persons have a notation printed directly on the badge. So much for my ignorance of jumpseating. And for many employees who hail from Memphis it was a very big deal to lose the benefit, as MEM is an airline backwater that is difficult to get to without a bunch of transfers from most of the country.

The real reasons personal jumpseat was jettisoned were the cost of the reservation system and the fact that the pilots don't like to be seen reading Playboy or the Robb Report (or falling asleep) or telling each other who has the biggest tits among the female pilots.I've seen plenty of things happen while jumping (including near-misses and not being able to locate an airport) that could have cost a few people their jobs. 9-11 just made getting rid of it a lot more convenient.It's no secret that the pilots think hourly employees are beneath them. It's pretty ironic that the 1 real dangerous incident that has taken place actually involved an insane pilot, not an hourly.
I never said you were ignorant about jumpseating. I loved that benefit. Still love to do it when I get the chance for business. And I know the whole deal about security. But let me get this straight; according to you personal jumpseat was jettisoned, at least in part, due to the cost of the reservation system? Would this be the same reservation system that still exists with the same background checks and the same security checks that are required for business jumpseat? Not sure I see where the cost of it comes into play.
Also, what's your point about near misses and not being able to locate an airport? Anything you've seen jumpseating (and yes, I've seen them too) happens on any commercial flight. It's not specific to FedEx.
I know it was a big deal for MEM employees but it's not FedEx's fault that Northwest Airlines has a chokehold on Memphis.
And if 9/11 made it more convenient, why was it brought back after 9/11, albeit for a short period of time?
Anyway, enough about jumpseating. You didn't answer any of my other questions.

Like I said, it's all about saving money and not about the employee. How is anyone supposed to contribute the max to their great new PPP when they cannot even afford to make ends meet? I'm glad it's working for you, but I really hate to see so many people being used and abused and not being able to do anything about it. I enjoy the debate too, but I wish more employees would wake up and see that they can create a better future. If we did go union, what makes you think that we're going to get a worse deal than what we already have? Sure, the company could make a crappy offer...that's what negotiations are for. And if they continue to make lousy offers, we walk out like UPS did in 1997 and bring them back to the table with an offer that works.
Hmmm. Didn't know you had a choice of how much you contribute to the PPP. Oh wait, you don't. Good to be informed, though.
How can they see a better future if they don't see what is going on now.
And what makes you think that you're going to get a better deal? You are rolling the dice. You have to consider what you have now and is it worth wagering it all on red when black might come up.

Lastly, why do you think VTBrown would "love to see that happen"? Why would a UPSer LOVE to see FedEx go on strike? Maybe because they know that if FedEx went on strike, there may not be a table to come back to?

For some reason, you seem to be totally convinced that a union would give you a better deal at FedEx. There is one thing and precisely one thing that a union at FedEx would guarantee. More money for the Teamsters. Other than that everything is negotiated. Or should I say gambled. Is the whole package that bad that you are willing to give it up and roll the dice to see if you get a better deal? Are you willing to put other employees futures on the line to see if you get that better deal? Yes, number of jobs available are also part of the negotiation.
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
OK, here goes. My understanding of PPP is that FedEx will take a minimum 3.5% of your check whether you want it or not. It is your option to contribute a higher amount that is capped(and matched) by FedEx. This is straight off the FXTV presentation by one of the corporate talking heads. Please prove me wrong.

My point in discussing the pilots actions was to point out that they are elitists, and really don't want to associate themselves with the hourlies who fill-up their planes with packages. The same thing goes on at other airlines...I have several friends who fly for the passenger airlines who have shared similar stories. Business jumpseat saves the company big bucks and requires a much smaller reservation system than personal jumpseat. Eliminating personal jumpseat saved them a lot of money and the spectacle of 9-11 made protesting the loss of it futile.

If you need a great example of why we need a union, take a look at the FedEx injury policy that penalizes you for having a "preventable" injury. As it stands now, nearly every injury is judged preventable and you get dinged on your review. Let's say I fall down the stairs at a residence tomorrow while rushing to get my way too many P1's off on time. Unless I break something, I won't report it because I'll be penalized, knowing full well that management will say it could be prevented. So I continue to work while hurt, which is exactly what FedEx wants me to do. In a business where repetitive stress injuries and falls are to be expected, FedEx pretends they don't exist and then reams you if you dare to report that you are hurt. If I DO report it and go out on leave I lose my route after 90 days and may get stuck with an industrial bulk route that will accelerate the deterioration of my body. If a meteorite fell from the sky and hit me FedEx would call it preventable because I had not "anticipated" the risk of a meteor shower. It's ludicrous, unethical, and just plain wrong.

Vehicle accident policies are following the same line of reasoning. Now, "doing everything possible to prevent the accident" isn't enough and management is making a Spanish Inquisition of incidents that are clearly not the fault of the driver...rear enders, being T-boned at an intersection, or drivers swerving directly into your vehicle. It's more of the same BS that is designed to limit FedEx liability and put you one step closer to the door.

Perhaps you've led a charmed life at FedEx and have had good managers who have had the balls to look the other way regarding these and other policies. How many of your friends have been fired, harassed, or oherwise intimidated when they legitimately got hurt on the job? I can count dozens, and management is increasing the pressure with each new policy, none of which favor the employee.
 

quadro

Well-Known Member
OK, here goes. My understanding of PPP is that FedEx will take a minimum 3.5% of your check whether you want it or not. It is your option to contribute a higher amount that is capped(and matched) by FedEx. This is straight off the FXTV presentation by one of the corporate talking heads. Please prove me wrong.
I'm not here to prove you right or wrong. My whole point has been that you educate yourself and be informed. You are so convinced (evident by you first post in this thread) that FedEx is screwing you and a union would make things better, that you aren't paying attention to the facts. Please don't take this the wrong way, but I can see it now; you're watching the FXTV broadcast with your peers and complaining how you're getting screwed and that they'd be better off with a union and you're missing key points of the broadcast.
What you've sort of described is the 401K. It's certainly not the PPP and it's not a very accurate description of the 401K either. In a nutshell, if you are already contributing to the 401K, nothing will change except the company match will increase. If you are not, you will be autoenrolled (I don't have the % handy) but you can change that % up or down or totally opt out if you don't want to participate. So it's not "whether you want it or not". And the amount isn't necessarily matched, per se. It depends on how much you put in.
The PPP on the other hand is totally paid for by FedEx. How much is put in depends on your age and your years of service.
All of this info is available to you via your manager or the FedEx Intranet. Take the time to understand it before you dismiss it.

My point in discussing the pilots actions was to point out that they are elitists, and really don't want to associate themselves with the hourlies who fill-up their planes with packages. The same thing goes on at other airlines...I have several friends who fly for the passenger airlines who have shared similar stories. Business jumpseat saves the company big bucks and requires a much smaller reservation system than personal jumpseat. Eliminating personal jumpseat saved them a lot of money and the spectacle of 9-11 made protesting the loss of it futile.
Shared similar stories about filling up passenger planes with packages???? You can't make blanket statements about an entire group of employees. You don't know how most of the pilots feel.
So what if business jumpseat saves money. That's a good thing. And again, this is the same reservation system that was perfectly capable of handling personal jumpseat not only prior to, but also after, 9/11. And again, if the goal was to save money by eliminating personal jumpseat, they had an excuse to do that some 10-12 years ago.

If you need a great example of why we need a union, take a look at the FedEx injury policy that penalizes you for having a "preventable" injury. As it stands now, nearly every injury is judged preventable and you get dinged on your review. Let's say I fall down the stairs at a residence tomorrow while rushing to get my way too many P1's off on time. Unless I break something, I won't report it because I'll be penalized, knowing full well that management will say it could be prevented. So I continue to work while hurt, which is exactly what FedEx wants me to do. In a business where repetitive stress injuries and falls are to be expected, FedEx pretends they don't exist and then reams you if you dare to report that you are hurt. If I DO report it and go out on leave I lose my route after 90 days and may get stuck with an industrial bulk route that will accelerate the deterioration of my body. If a meteorite fell from the sky and hit me FedEx would call it preventable because I had not "anticipated" the risk of a meteor shower. It's ludicrous, unethical, and just plain wrong.

Vehicle accident policies are following the same line of reasoning. Now, "doing everything possible to prevent the accident" isn't enough and management is making a Spanish Inquisition of incidents that are clearly not the fault of the driver...rear enders, being T-boned at an intersection, or drivers swerving directly into your vehicle. It's more of the same BS that is designed to limit FedEx liability and put you one step closer to the door.
Actually, if you look at the policy, you are not penalized for a preventable injury. In fact, if I'm not mistaken, it's illegal to do that. What you are accountable for is the unsafe act that led to the injury. And before you say it's the same thing, you can commit an unsafe act and not be injured but the accountability is the same.
I'm not going to go into a lengthy discussion about accidents and injuries. I'll just say a couple of things. First, Federal Law protects some employees by requiring the employer to only hold the position for 84 days. FedEx protects all employees for at least 90 days. Second, just because a driver (any driver, not just FedEx employees) isn't at fault, doesn't mean that they couldn't have prevented the accident. Look up comparative negligence for more info. It's probably true that in most cases if the FedEx driver has any comparative negligence, then the accident is deemed to be preventable.
Also, repetative injuries I can see, but why should FedEx expect you to fall?

Perhaps you've led a charmed life at FedEx and have had good managers who have had the balls to look the other way regarding these and other policies. How many of your friends have been fired, harassed, or oherwise intimidated when they legitimately got hurt on the job? I can count dozens, and management is increasing the pressure with each new policy, none of which favor the employee.
Nope, not had a charmed life. And I think you've got balls and pusillanimous confused. A manager with balls, will do what's right no matter how unpopular the decision. None of my friends have been fired, harassed, or otherwise intimiated when they legitimately got hurt. I have to wonder what type of people you're hanging out with if you know dozens who are getting fired, harassed, or otherwise intimited when they get hurt and presumably some that aren't getting fired, harassed, or otherwise intimidated when they get hurt. That's a lot of people you know who get hurt. Hopefully you don't know me. :happy2:

You know, you accuse people of being sheeple but you want them to be sheeple only if they follow your ideals. Without being informed, they are more likely to be lemmings.
 

Sammie

Well-Known Member
Fedex drivers are independent contractors, which translates into
unregulated hours, no benefits and how much control over their
work environment?

None of these drivers are covered by the Civil Rights Act of 1964 nor any other protections created by the NLRB, because as independents, how do they prove they’re really Fedex employees?

Both companies rake it in but the driver in brown makes quite a bit more than the driver in blue. A Fedex driver can shell out 20+ grand a year of his own $ to maintain his truck while the UPS guy spends zip.

What does the Fedex guy do when he can’t file a grievance? Is everything resolved for him with a little sprinkling of Pixie Dust?

But there’s good news:

Fedex drivers from 36 states are being represented in separate class action lawsuits because of these sham independent contractor arrangements-

South Bend, Indiana (October 15, 2007) - In a major development, Judge Robert Miller of U.S. District Court for Northern Indiana, today granted class certification on behalf of approximately 14,000 current FedEx Ground/Home Delivery drivers – as well as upwards of 10,000 former drivers - across the nation who are challenging the company’s embattled independent contractor model.

Let The Games Begin. :hammer:
 
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quadro

Well-Known Member
Fedex drivers are independent contractors, which translates into
unregulated hours, no benefits and how much control over their
work environment?

None of these drivers are covered by the Civil Rights Act of 1964 nor any other protections created by the NLRB, because as independents, how do they prove they’re really Fedex employees?

Both companies rake it in but the driver in brown makes quite a bit more than the driver in blue. A Fedex driver can shell out 20+ grand a year of his own $ to maintain his truck while the UPS guy spends zip.

What does the Fedex guy do when he can’t file a grievance? Is everything resolved for him with a little sprinkling of Pixie Dust?

But there’s good news:

Fedex drivers from 36 states are being represented in separate class action lawsuits because of these sham independent contractor arrangements-

South Bend, Indiana (October 15, 2007) - In a major development, Judge Robert Miller of U.S. District Court for Northern Indiana, today granted class certification on behalf of approximately 14,000 current FedEx Ground/Home Delivery drivers – as well as upwards of 10,000 former drivers - across the nation who are challenging the company’s embattled independent contractor model.

Let The Games Begin. :hammer:
We were talking about FedEx Express, not FedEx Ground. I don't know enough about the law regarding independent contractors, etc., to make an informed comment about the Ground drivers' situation.
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
Quadro, I'm aware that the 3.5% is a 401k, but it must be considered part of your "PPP" retirement because you are REQUIRED to contribute a minimum of 3.5% by FedEx....there is no choice. You are now helping FedEx fund a portion of your retirement, a defacto subsidy. I'm also aware that FedEx contributes a pittance to my retirement that will vary according to my years of service etc.

You've got to be in management to keep spouting the company line this way. Many, many FedEx people get shafted by the injury policy every day, and to claim you don't know anyone who has been screwed over is bunk. I've had several close friends be displaced because of injuries, and dozens harassed over legitimate claims for treatment. These were all safe, hard-working couriers who were 6.5 employees and had the world come crashing down on them when they got hurt. They busted their ass for FedEx for years and then got treated like dirt because they happened to get injured. It's amazing how quickly a great employee becomes a burden to FedEx when they get hurt.The whole concept of "Unsafe Acts" is BS because management arbitrarily determines what an unsafe act is. GFT it and the next level of management will simply uphold the decision of lower management.And please at least grant me the fact that the repetitive stress of this job will eventually get you in one way or another. Maybe your knees will give out, or perhaps your back, but you cannot go forever without having health problems being a courier. There's a good reason you don't see many 50+ UPS drivers...they've burnt out.

Maybe you're just a Boy Scout who bleeds purple and thinks FedEx always has the best interests of it's employees in mind. They don't, and neither does UPS. It's all about making money. I don't claim to speak for Mr Brown, but perhaps he is alluding to the fact that FedEx drivers and UPS drivers are in the same boat when it comes to protecting our interests in dealing with management. Whatever you might think, it IS "Us versus Them", and management is kicking us while we are down right now. A unionized FedEx might make UPS corporate management happy because it eliminates a competitive advantage for FedEx, but it might also make the rank and file happy because they would be more strongly represented by a Teamsters Union that included FedEx drivers. More members = more power and an ability to negotiate from a position of strength.
 

quadro

Well-Known Member
Quadro, I'm aware that the 3.5% is a 401k, but it must be considered part of your "PPP" retirement because you are REQUIRED to contribute a minimum of 3.5% by FedEx....there is no choice. You are now helping FedEx fund a portion of your retirement, a defacto subsidy. I'm also aware that FedEx contributes a pittance to my retirement that will vary according to my years of service etc.
Apparently you aren’t aware because, quite simply, you are wrong. I’m not trying to talk you out of your belief in unionization, I’m trying to convince you to educate yourself. I know I sound like a broken record. Go do your homework before you screw up someone’s life by giving them bad info. The 401K has nothing to do with the Portable Pension Plan. They are two distinct and different plans. The only commonality is that they both help you save for retirement. As I’ve already pointed out, but you’ve chosen not to confirm, you are not REQUIRED to contribute a minimum of 3.5%. You are not required to contribute anything. If you are not contributing to the 401K as of 1/1/08, you will be auto-enrolled, but you have 90 days to opt out and get any and every penny back that might get deducted before you opt out. However, you would be crazy to not put at least 1% in as you will get 100% match on that. The 3.5% you are referring to is the maximum company match for the 401K. The PPP is completely funded by FedEx. You can't put anything into it even if you wanted to.

You've got to be in management to keep spouting the company line this way. Many, many FedEx people get shafted by the injury policy every day, and to claim you don't know anyone who has been screwed over is bunk. I've had several close friends be displaced because of injuries, and dozens harassed over legitimate claims for treatment. These were all safe, hard-working couriers who were 6.5 employees and had the world come crashing down on them when they got hurt. They busted their ass for FedEx for years and then got treated like dirt because they happened to get injured. It's amazing how quickly a great employee becomes a burden to FedEx when they get hurt.The whole concept of "Unsafe Acts" is BS because management arbitrarily determines what an unsafe act is. GFT it and the next level of management will simply uphold the decision of lower management.And please at least grant me the fact that the repetitive stress of this job will eventually get you in one way or another. Maybe your knees will give out, or perhaps your back, but you cannot go forever without having health problems being a courier. There's a good reason you don't see many 50+ UPS drivers...they've burnt out.
I don’t have to be in management just because I’m informed. And now you’re back to the name calling. I am not a liar, I’m telling you what I have experienced. I’ve worked in a number of different locations over the last 20+ years and I don’t think I know dozens of people who’ve been hurt, let alone harassed.
I have seen people get hurt through no fault of their own and I’ve seen people do something stupid and get hurt. Funnily enough, in all cases, FedEx still paid them, paid their medical bill, held their position for at least 90 days, if not longer, etc, etc. I’ve seen people have GFT’s upheld, overturned, and modified. In each and every case, if I didn’t step back and take a non-emotional, rational look at the facts, I would probably think that the employee was getting screwed. Sometimes it definitely seems that way. However, when I took the time to really understand the issues I felt that the outcomes were pretty fair. Does that mean that I agreed with managements decisions? Not always, but I understood where they were coming from. For every employee who seemed to have a decision go against them, there was one who I thought got the better end of the deal. It’s not a perfect system and I never said it was. I’m just not willing to give up the system that I have to risk getting a system that might be worse than this one.
I already said that repetitive stress injuries are very real, but I won’t give you that everyone will suffer from them. Everyone’s different and you cannot make that blanket statement. I do know dozens of people who have been couriers their entire career and haven’t suffered from repetitive stress injuries. And, er, why would I want to vote for a union to make FedEx more like UPS if that means I won’t make it past 50? So FedEx doesn’t work you as hard, is that what you’re saying???? I would 100% agree with that.

Maybe you're just a Boy Scout who bleeds purple and thinks FedEx always has the best interests of it's employees in mind. They don't, and neither does UPS. It's all about making money. I don't claim to speak for Mr Brown, but perhaps he is alluding to the fact that FedEx drivers and UPS drivers are in the same boat when it comes to protecting our interests in dealing with management. Whatever you might think, it IS "Us versus Them", and management is kicking us while we are down right now. A unionized FedEx might make UPS corporate management happy because it eliminates a competitive advantage for FedEx, but it might also make the rank and file happy because they would be more strongly represented by a Teamsters Union that included FedEx drivers. More members = more power and an ability to negotiate from a position of strength.
I got out the magnifying glass but I just don’t see the “non-profit” next to the FedEx logo. It’s only Us vs. Them if you buy in to that philosophy. Personally, I don’t. And since when is a union negotiating from a position of strength? The union can only get what a company is willing to give. Worst case scenario is that the company goes out of business. Obviously not either side’s goal.
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
Isn't auto-enrollment a case of FedEx mandating participation? If only for a limited time, it's still REQUIRED, even if you can get your investment back. Of course it's dumb not to participate in the 401k...I've maxed it out from the get-go. My point is that FedEx has sucessfully shifted the bulk of retirement funding onto the employee, when it should be the other way around. I don't deny that there is a PPP that the company DOES contribute to....I just maintain that it's a joke. Your 401k will become the bulk of your retirement plan, and that's just what the company wants. If you're happy with what's being offered, good for you. The next time you encounter a UPS driver, ask him what his projected monthly payout will be upon retirement. You might be unpleasantly surprised. And if you think the company has your best interests at heart, you are truly delusional. You are simply a number that is disposable at their whim. Go ahead and whip yourself into a froth trying to fulfill the Purple Promise while Fred schemes to make you less of an expense item at the same time. They expect 110% effort on our part, but they don't want to pay for it. It's kind of like buying a Chevette and expecting it to be a Ferrari.

It's obvious we will never agree, and that's fine. Eventually something will happen during your FedEx career when you are on the wrong end of the stick and fully at the mercy of policy. Maybe you'll have to hire a lawyer, or perhaps you'll lose your job over some trivial violation that would be a non-issue elsewhere.

Until about 1985, FedEx had it right. They stayed close to UPS in terms of wages and benefits, and still paid fairly close attention to the PSP philosophy.A union wasn't necessary. Then it changed, and the laser-like focus on profit became paramount. From that point onward, the downward trend against the employee has been accelerating in a free-fall. It's truly demoralizing to see what used to be an excellent company become mediocre. It's probably too late to keep it from truly going into the toilet at this point.

A union is a last resort when upper management is not responsive to it's employees and treats them as a liability instead of an asset. I've been a Teamster before,and it's far from perfect, but something needs to change.

You can be blind as long as you like. Eventually, you'll see the light and wake-up.
 

quadro

Well-Known Member
Isn't auto-enrollment a case of FedEx mandating participation?
No, it's not. Look up the definition of mandate. Auto-enrollment with no opportunity to opt out would be mandating participation.
If only for a limited time, it's still REQUIRED, even if you can get your investment back.
Holy cow! How bitter do you have to be to put a negative spin on this? If you don't want to participate, you opt out. If any money was withheld, it's returned. You end up exactly where you were before 1/1/08. It's a non-event. Why bother getting worked up about it? Now, why have the auto-enrollment in the first place? Because employees (not just FedEx employees, as this occurs at other companies too) are too lazy, uneducated, not informed enough, not looking down the road far enough, etc, etc, to start saving enough on their own. It's human nature and not specific to FedEx. Whether you agree that the PPP is good or bad, relying on a sole pension to take care of your golden years, isn't good fiscal responsibility. A 401K can be a good savings vehicle as you've pointed out. FedEx is just trying to encourage employees to save and giving you up to 3.5% of your gross salary just for participating.
It's obvious we will never agree, and that's fine. Eventually something will happen during your FedEx career when you are on the wrong end of the stick and fully at the mercy of policy.
Been there, done that. Accepted responsibility for what I did wrong, paid the price, and I'm still here, thankful that I was given a chance to prove that I deserved to keep my job.
Maybe you'll have to hire a lawyer, or perhaps you'll lose your job over some trivial violation that would be a non-issue elsewhere.
I always encourage my peers to avail themselves of the systems in place to challenge management decisions if they feel they've been treated unfairly. I would equally encourage them to hire a lawyer, where appropriate, if they weren't able to resolve the issue to their satisfaction. That would be true no matter where I worked. I can also tell you that I've never seen a business where it is so hard to fire someone as at FedEx. You have to really, really suck at what you do over and over again to lose your job over a performance issue. Conduct issues are another matter, as they should be. Give me an example of a non-issue that you know someone has been fired for.

Until about 1985, FedEx had it right. They stayed close to UPS in terms of wages and benefits, and still paid fairly close attention to the PSP philosophy.A union wasn't necessary. Then it changed, and the laser-like focus on profit became paramount. From that point onward, the downward trend against the employee has been accelerating in a free-fall. It's truly demoralizing to see what used to be an excellent company become mediocre. It's probably too late to keep it from truly going into the toilet at this point.

A union is a last resort when upper management is not responsive to it's employees and treats them as a liability instead of an asset. I've been a Teamster before,and it's far from perfect, but something needs to change.

You can be blind as long as you like. Eventually, you'll see the light and wake-up.
Unlike you, I'm not trying to convince you that you'll come around and see things my way. All I've tried to do was show you that you're not fully informed and that will hurt your credibility when you try to convince others. And living in the past doesn't help much either. The industry and the world has come a long way in the last 22 years. Having a union isn't going to bring back double digit growth that we experienced back then. We could do nothing wrong back then. The money couldn't be spent as fast as it was coming in. It just isn't that way any more.

Again, it comes down to this: I'm not willing to give up everything I have and hope that I get something better. You are and there's nothing wrong with that. I'm not calling you names, I'm not belittling you. I'm just encouraging you to get your facts straight so that you can make an informed and educated decision and you don't mislead others.
 

Coldworld

60 months and counting
oh :censored2::censored2::censored2::censored2:, just stop already. maybe cheryl should start a "purple cafe" for the fedexers on here and quadro can be the tie on that site:blahblah::blahblah::wheelchai:wheelchai:sailor::sailor::surrender:surrend
 

Coldworld

60 months and counting
Ok, Im Going To Go Out On A Limb, But I Really Think That Quadro Is Tie, Yes, They Are The Same Person.read What Hes Saying, It Sounds Just Like Tie.
 

Braveheart1

New Member
I have never been a fan of the Unions like the Teamsters specifically in how they lean to the democratic communist left, embrace a socialistic form of government. When they take monthly dues moneys from hard working members and give it to political forces like the Obama Campaign I have to say, STOP IT!
Stop supporting a form of government that is hell bent on controlling people like stupid Lemmings!
Having said that, if the Unions would recognize they are wrong and are playing fiddle to the trade guilds and political Communists trying to control the world, it they would turnaround and go in a new direction adopting the American "WE THE PEOPLE" mindset, and when we see the FAT CAT UNION BOSSES GIVE UP THEIR HUGE SALARIES AND BECOME MORE OF A SERVANT TO THEIR MEMBERS THAN A KING.....only then could I change my opinion of the Unions.

Having said that, I recently picked up a job driving Over The Road for FedEx hopping for what was represented to me as being an American Company. I have quickly learned FedEx is NOT a company based upon American Values or the US Constitution. They are a corporation carbon copy of a Socialist company using every loop hole their filthy lawyers can find to horde a buck for themselves and screw the contractor drivers and contracted help! I have seen it first hand when Management to Dispatchers will dispatch prepaid power to outside trucking companies like SWIFT, C.R. ENGLAND, and CRST then force dedicated teams to sit and wait at a terminal like Denver, Phoenix, Portland and Chicago for over 16 hours. Their is NO compensation for the wait and the condescending attitude that comes down line to the OTR drivers from FedEx Management and Dispatchers is be thankful you have a job I have the authority to have you fired. They want people to simply do the work and never question authority.

Now for most CDL drivers considering a job with a FedEx contractor do the math!
If the contractor is offering you .22 cents per every mile that the truck runs, at first glance that sounds like a competitive rate. A truck could drive as much as 1200 miles per day, you could earn $264.00 per day.
But here is the harsh reality, a driver departs from Sacramento at 4pm and it takes 6.25 hours to get to Reno because of Snow Chaining up etc., the miles driven are 146 that works out to each driver earning $5.13 per hour. Then in Reno they are delayed 6 hours waiting for a load and then getting a loaded trailer with faulty lights, then waiting for a service truck to make the necessary repairs.
Now the drivers have earned a whopping $2.62 per hour.
Then next driver gets into the drivers seat and hammers down the throttle he is able to pick up some time averaging the truck at 68 mph in 9.75 hours he has driven 664 miles the driver has earned $146 dollars that works out to being $14.98 per hour
The drivers switch and the first driver resumes driving to the Denver hub at an average speed of 62 PMH. Once arriving they drop the two trailers then go into the line-hall office to get a new hook slip. They are told they will have to wait until they get two trailers loaded, when asked how long will that take they are told it will be some time in the morning around 6AM. That will be and 12.5 hour wait!
Here is another issue that Safety managers, Management and Drivers fail to consider, the drivers are already acclimated to a sleep schedule having a delay like this causes the drivers to interrupt their sleep schedule forcing a driver to either work a back to back shift or the other driver gets into the drivers seat to do the driving when he has been in a sleeping mode.
I recently did a loop with a team driver where I drove 1927 miles and my co-driver drove 1113 miles yet we both get paid equally what the truck drives it took us 76 hours to complete this loop due to the FedEx delays and weather. that works out to earning $8.80 dollars per hour! (being a greater at Wal-Mart seams to be more appealing to me that risking my life out here on the road with all the inexperienced drivers out here driving Swift, CR England, Pride, Central Refrigerated and Warner drivers.)

This is the biggest issue I have with the Trucking industry at large is a driver is responsible for the operation of a truck from start to finish of each load, then the driver should be compensated properly for his time! NOT paying simply from point A to point B, but paying the driver for his mandatory DOT pre-trip inspection, time fueling, loading and unloading time etc. My attitude is I'm on the clock from the moment I get into the truck to the point I am finished with the load and I'm heading home to see my lovely wife and kids. Sleeping in a truck is NOT my idea of a good time, especially when its bouncing down the rough roads in Communist Controlled California!
 
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