Can reason and spirituality coexist?

Discussion in 'Life After Brown' started by HubBub, Aug 3, 2013.

  1. HubBub

    HubBub Active Member

    I mean within one psyche, not just a rational person and religious person being friends. Reason-based "religions" like secular humanism have always seemed to me to be very forced, like a reasonably shaped peg in a faith-based hole, but I've increasingly felt a very profound and even spiritual connection to the universe, or reality, or whatever you want to call it (and no, I'm not on drugs).

    It seems to me that spirituality is a fundamental function of human consciousness, but is sorely lacking in rational individuals. Do you think that there will ever be a day that rationality and spirituality will be united? Personally, I really hope so. I think collectively we could achieve some amazing things if we stopped antagonizing each other and set our collective consciousness toward discovery and exploration.
  2. Brownslave688

    Brownslave688 You want a toe? I can get you a toe.

    How would everyone being spiritual and reasonable have anything to do with changing the world?

    People are crazy end of story.
  3. HubBub

    HubBub Active Member

    Because spirituality is one hell of a motivator. And people being reasonable keeps them from killing each other over stupidity, greed and superstition. Take away fear of "the other", add in reverence for what is real, and maybe we would be motivated to improve and expand ourselves beyond merely the highest order of primates.
  4. HubBub

    HubBub Active Member

    And by "order" I mean "species". Thank you.
  5. wkmac

    wkmac Well-Known Member

    First off, great question. Secondly, in full disclosure, I hold no belief in a god. The short answer to your question is yes, reason and spirituality can coexist. In fact, quite easily IMO but that's MO.

    Delving deeper into the question however could get to be a bit more complicated for and from both sides. I say that quoting the wikipedia article on spirituality as an example why it could prove problematic.

    The first hurdle would be to find a definition of spirituality those discussing the issue can agree. Maybe it's fair to do the same for the word reason to. Agreement to terms seems to me to be the first step.
  6. bbsam

    bbsam Moderator Staff Member

    For myself, the proposition was made that, "God either is or he isn't.". The choice to believe that he is is completely up to me. But when I chose to believe, something profound became evident. Spirituality is not something relegated to church, mass, synagogue, mosque, or any building or even set of rules. God and spirituality are evident in every relationship I have with others day in and day out. Why would what is rational negate the spiritual? The world is full of people who are both, hold very different views and still live peacefully. The exceptions will make the news more often, but I tthink that the coexistence of the rational and spiritual is more the rule than the exception.
  7. Integrity

    Integrity Binge Poster



    Some of the most reasonable members of the BC are the ones that profess belief in God.

    I have lived a large portion of my life against spiritual living. It was a complete and utter failure, I had many things but I was miserable.

    I have lived a large portion of my life in relationship with the God of the universe as revealed to man through the Holy Bible, I still have many things but I am full of the joy of the Lord.

    It was very irrational during my days of suffering when I would refuse to turn to God.

  8. PT Stewie

    PT Stewie "Big Fella"

    "I hold no belief in a god "(Reason) vs (spirtuality) belief in or search for the devine. IMO can be summarized like the atheist's funeral "all dressed up and no place to go"
  9. Integrity

    Integrity Binge Poster

    PT Stewie,

    As a professed Atheist do you concede that there is at least a spirit part of the human creature or are we just like the other creatures that inhabit the earth?

  10. moreluck

    moreluck golden ticket member

    I think you read Stewie's post wrong !!! There aren't too many Irish atheists.
  11. Integrity

    Integrity Binge Poster


    A person who does not believe in God is an atheist by definition.

    I think you must have read it wrong.

    Maybe he can clear this up in a follow up response.

  12. jumpman23

    jumpman23 Oh Yeah

    Politics and religion, 2 topics that i choose not to discuss. Too complicated because everyone is going to have different opinions enough said.
  13. PT Stewie

    PT Stewie "Big Fella"

    Thanks Mo you are the best ! I I was merely quoting WKMAC with the "hold no belief in God" phrase and replying with some Irish wit with the atheist funeral saying. I whole heartly believe in God as a not so devout Catholic or as the church describes "Cafeteria Catholic". I have been exposed to some atheist ways by by middle child who briefly belonged to the "Ethical Society" who's core belief was to treat fellow human beings with respect and dignity.He has since return to belief in God although not Catholic. What is so different from what a man born over 2000 year ago Who taught " Love Me and love one another"
    Go mbeannaí Dia thú
  14. wkmac

    wkmac Well-Known Member

    Perfectly content with that. Never gave it a moments concern about where I was at before I was born so why should I worry about returning to that?

    Before you think spirituality is exclusive to a search for the divine, you might consider the greek word pneuma which is also the same word translated spirit in the new testament. It has nothing to do with searching for the divine. It's also the root word of pneumatic and pneumonia and neither of those pertain to a divine quest. When you understand that, you'll then understand that even an atheist can be moved by spiritual things. Like a great symphony, a moving poem, good theater or the grandeur of a distant vista.

    Or in my case going 100's of feet deep under ground 100's of times and seeing first hand that the earth is a living organism.
  15. Monkey Butt

    Monkey Butt You can call me Chappy Staff Member

    ​Gala's vagina?
  16. wkmac

    wkmac Well-Known Member

    You mean Gaia's vagina?
  17. bbsam

    bbsam Moderator Staff Member

    You mean Gaea's?
  18. Monkey Butt

    Monkey Butt You can call me Chappy Staff Member

    Could be I meant Gaea ... could be I meant a gala in Gaia's vagina.
  19. DS

    DS Fenderbender

    I get something else out of the op's question.
    I was on Manitoulin Island last week.In the middle of lake Huron.
    No city lights.The milky way seemed almost touchable.
    Shooting stars,satellites,and a few questionable moving objects.
    I felt spiritually connected to the whole scene.
    Is this not God? I personally have no real link to the catholic one .
    What does rationality have to do with it?
    Everyone is different.You either get it or you don't.
    If we managed to have a collective consciousness
    they would find a way to charge us for it.
    I think WE are God.Everyone owns a little bit .
    ​Use him wisely.

  20. bbsam

    bbsam Moderator Staff Member

    Good question DS. Is the universe rational? Do the laws of physics apply? How do we as carbon based life forms fit into it and to what extent? This is precisely the relationship being explored, where the natural intertwines with the supernatural.