Cherry picking for easy warning letters...

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Re-Raise

Well-Known Member
No I did not have a heart attack.

So now you admit that you did and have had safety training during your time at UPS?

Everyone has and we still have accidents and injuries. The onus is on the drivers to be safe, we are the only ones who can really make a difference.

Management thinks signing papers in the morning will cover their ass if something happens.

Do you really believe Sober's warning letter will make him less likely to be in an accident?
 

Cementups

Box Monkey
I got a warning letter this week for looking at my DIAD as I was pulling out of the building.. Yes I did it, but a little silly all the same. Was wrote up for not following Space and Visibility guidelines.
 

tieguy

Banned
Everyone has and we still have accidents and injuries. The onus is on the drivers to be safe, we are the only ones who can really make a difference.

Management thinks signing papers in the morning will cover their ass if something happens.

Do you really believe Sober's warning letter will make him less likely to be in an accident?

I think the onus is on all of us management and drivers. The company believes we can control safety by controlling our methods.

to answer your last question I think the warning letters are overdone but I also think we have too many people that don't pay attention to the safety training they recieve. they decided the methods are bull**** and stop doing them as soon as the sup walks away.
 

Old International

Now driving a Sterling
All I know that is because the actions of two drivers, making the same dumb decision, made me spend 15 minutes in an office, reviewing how to place the dolly to make up a set of doubles. I really didn't want to do this on a Friday night, as I really wanted to finish my route, and go home to my wife.
I think that the supervisors time would have been better spent working with the two misfits that had the incident, and show them that cutting corners in building a set of doubles in not a wise decision.
 

Bubblehead

My Senior Picture
Its a simple answer that you obviously could not understand. If the guy has ever had any safety training ever in his career at ups then has had training that he can and probably has used to prevent injuries and accidents. I thank you for taking his idiotic rant and running with it.
I understand perfectly as I read the response for what it said.
Your reply read as if you didn't.
I am not of like mind with the post you were engaging.
I have and continue to learn safety methods.
Occasionally, bordering on rarely, from the rhetoric and jargon constantly disseminated from management.
The commentaries and buzz phrases do little for me, nor do meaningless warning letters that I know full well will never go any further than a warning letter.
I learn and develope my methods from real time experiences.
This notion that all accidents and injuries are avoidable is admirable, while being nothing more than pure fiction.
As long as human beings sit in the drivers seat of our trucks, we will continue to have accidents and injuries.
Everybody makes mistakes, it's an idiot that makes the same ones repeatedly.
So as far as I'm concerned, management can continue their little games.
They can scare the ones who scare, alienate the rest, and beat each other up via conference calls.
All the while I continue to hone my craft day by day, making the most of any and all information and experiences at my disposal.
Until one of these warning letters progress to the next level, I will write my protest letter and treat them as if they were printed on toilet paper.
 

tieguy

Banned
I understand perfectly as I read the response for what it said.
Your reply read as if you didn't.
I am not of like mind with the post you were engaging.
I have and continue to learn safety methods.
Occasionally, bordering on rarely, from the rhetoric and jargon constantly disseminated from management.
The commentaries and buzz phrases do little for me, nor do meaningless warning letters that I know full well will never go any further than a warning letter.
I learn and develope my methods from real time experiences.
This notion that all accidents and injuries are avoidable is admirable, while being nothing more than pure fiction.
As long as human beings sit in the drivers seat of our trucks, we will continue to have accidents and injuries.
Everybody makes mistakes, it's an idiot that makes the same ones repeatedly.
So as far as I'm concerned, management can continue their little games.
They can scare the ones who scare, alienate the rest, and beat each other up via conference calls.
All the while I continue to hone my craft day by day, making the most of any and all information and experiences at my disposal.
Until one of these warning letters progress to the next level, I will write my protest letter and treat them as if they were printed on toilet paper.

and thus we have management out there doing observations and giving out bull**** warning letters because rocket scientist like yourself have found a better way to do things. Thank you for continuing to highlight my point.
 
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tieguy

Banned
I was taught to keep my hands at 10 and 2 while driving down the road. The intent of the rule is to maintain control of the vehicle in the event of a blowout or sudden emergency maneuver.

The observation that resulted in my warning letter was done in the parking lot of a Taco Bell while I was pulling out of a parking spot.

the ten and two method is used to maintain control of the vehicle at all times not just when you're driving down the road.

The ten and two "push pull" method of steering was written specifically to shield the company from liability for carpal-tunnel and other injuries that resulted from its business decision to delete power steering from its vehicles. The method simply shifts the responsibility for these injuries back onto the employee and relieves the company of any responsibility for solving the underlying problem.

The push / pull method is also designed to afford you maximum control of the vehicle while making a turn. Carpal tunnel was not in the equation on this one.

Sober your post again shows that you think you have found a better answer on how to do the job. You have therefore rationalized reasons to do the job "your way". thats why you got the attention and response you did. If your center manager believes she could tell you to fix it and you would then you would not get the warning letter. Instead you rationalize reasons to violate the methods and your management knows this. They therefore give you formal discipline.
 

Bubblehead

My Senior Picture
and thus we have management out there doing observations and giving out bull**** warning letters because rocket scientist like yourself have found a better way to do things. Thank you for continuing to highlight my point.

Your welcome.
I am far more qualified to make the assertions that I have, than you cinder block desk jockeys.
 
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soberups

Pees in the brown Koolaid
and thus we have management out there doing observations and giving out bull**** warning letters because rocket scientist like yourself have found a better way to do things. Thank you for continuing to highlight my point.

Those who cant do it....manage it.

Those who cant manage it.....observe it and hand out warning letters.

Thank God we at least have enough people actually doing the work to carry the burden of those who dont.
 

soberups

Pees in the brown Koolaid
]the ten and two method is used to maintain control of the vehicle at all times not just when you're driving down the road.


When a package car is backed into a parking space and your front wheels are at full lock, it is necessary to turn the steering wheel in order to aim the tires in the direction you want the vehicle to go.

If you place your hands at the 10 and 2 position and then turn the steering wheel....your hands are not at the ten and two position any longer, are they?

The push / pull method is also designed to afford you maximum control of the vehicle while making a turn. Carpal tunnel was not in the equation on this one..

Thats a great theory from behind a desk. Those of us who are actually driving the trucks in the real world are aware of the fact that if you try to steer a power- steering vehicle in this manner...while trying at the same time to "keep your hands at the 10 and 2"....your hands will be frantically shuffling like a meth-addicted hamster on a wheel, and you will quickly lose control of the car. If you dont believe me....try it for yourself.

The method was written decades ago, when all UPS equipment had manual steering. It is not applicable on a modern vehicle. It would be like writing me a warning letter for "failure to properly use the clutch".... on a vehicle with an automatic transmission.

 

tieguy

Banned
Your welcome.
I am far more qualified to make the assertions that I have, than you cinder block desk jockeys.[/QUOTE


the shot does not mean anything to me other then the point I score for getting under your skin.

Your answer again is why management is out there doing the observations and giving the warning letters.
 

tieguy

Banned
When a package car is backed into a parking space and your front wheels are at full lock, it is necessary to turn the steering wheel in order to aim the tires in the direction you want the vehicle to go.

If you place your hands at the 10 and 2 position and then turn the steering wheel....your hands are not at the ten and two position any longer, are they?



Thats a great theory from behind a desk. Those of us who are actually driving the trucks in the real world are aware of the fact that if you try to steer a power- steering vehicle in this manner...while trying at the same time to "keep your hands at the 10 and 2"....your hands will be frantically shuffling like a meth-addicted hamster on a wheel, and you will quickly lose control of the car. If you dont believe me....try it for yourself.

The method was written decades ago, when all UPS equipment had manual steering. It is not applicable on a modern vehicle. It would be like we jriting me a warning letter for "failure to properly use the clutch".... on a vehicle with an automatic transmission.


again I see your rationalization process at work because you have found a better way to do things. I'm fine with your rationalization if your fine with the warning letters.
 

tieguy

Banned
Those who cant do it....manage it.

Those who cant manage it.....observe it and hand out warning letters.

Thank God we at least have enough people actually doing the work tcarry the burden of those who dont.

See your put down of management here again shows you have real emotional issues with those in charge. Serious hangups that knaw at you.

Again its your job to do the job by the methods they teach you. Its not your job to pick and choose or as your thread is titled "cherry pick" the methods you agree to use and to decide when you will use them.
Its up to you but more pain follows if you're hard headed. the good news is you can always get bubblehead to tell you its not your fault when you lose your job.
 

Bubblehead

My Senior Picture
See your put down of management here again shows you have real emotional issues with those in charge. Serious hangups that knaw at you.

Again its your job to do the job by the methods they teach you. Its not your job to pick and choose or as your thread is titled "cherry pick" the methods you agree to use and to decide when you will use them.
Its up to you but more pain follows if you're hard headed. the good news is you can always get bubblehead to tell you its not your fault when you lose your job.

He won't lose his job.
It's all smoke and mirrors.
Idle threats.
They won't take anybody to the panel over a 10 and 2 violation.
It will all calm down after half of them get whacked in early March.
 

over9five

Moderator
Staff member
They won't take anybody to the panel over a 10 and 2 violation..

Agree with that. They'd get laughed outta the place.

BUT....It will be in Sobers file to be used against him if he has an accident, or accidents. They are creating a paper trail.
 

Bubblehead

My Senior Picture
Agree with that. They'd get laughed outta the place.

BUT....It will be in Sobers file to be used against him if he has an accident, or accidents. They are creating a paper trail.

So will his harrassment/over supervision grievance.
Maybe he should make sure it goes to the panel so they know what he's dealing with at his center.
 

tieguy

Banned
So will his harrassment/over supervision grievance.
Maybe he should make sure it goes to the panel so they know what he's dealing with at his center.

the crap house lawyer giving his valuable guidance? Over 9 brings up a very good point. I hope you're not a steward giving that kind of advice.
 
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