Cherry picking for easy warning letters...

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Bubblehead

My Senior Picture
For those who the reference was lost, Sam and Ralph after beating each other up were always able to set aside their differences at the end of the day. Tie is alright in my book. He's just a dedicated member of the "other" team. At the end of the day we play in the same league in which we both share the spoils.


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grgrcr88

No It's not green grocer!
All those years I watched the TV shows that portrayed a boss. That boss always ruled by fear and intimidation. If you did not do the job that boss fired you. Now I find out that this boss apparently portrayed a ups boss and that all the bosses at all the other companies are apparently candy assed pushovers. How was I to know?...:)

You guys ever meet the real boss. the guy running the companies that ship with us? The ones I have to explain your screw ups to?

I would venture to guess that in my 20 years as a driver I have met many, many more owners of customers businesses than any member of management could ever possibly get around to, and not only met but made friends with, lifelong friends some of them. Thats what we do, its why our customers choose us, even when we may be the higher priced option.

The problem with your management style is that it reduces or eliminates the ability if not the desire to go the extra mile for our customers. Too damn busy worrying about which method you might write me up for if I accidentilly forget to do it once out of a million times.

Your not getting the big picture,angry or frustrated drivers, no matter how much they try, take that attitude with them out on the streets, and it shows.
 

brownmonster

Man of Great Wisdom
You guys ever meet the real boss. the guy running the companies that ship with us? The ones I have to explain your screw ups to?

I've met many of them. I spend much more time explaining YOUR screwups then any of my own. My screw ups are mistakes, yours are long term business plans.
 

tieguy

Banned
The problem with your management style is that it reduces or eliminates the ability if not the desire to go the extra mile for our customers. Too damn busy worrying about which method you might write me up for if I accidentilly forget to do it once out of a million times.

Your not getting the big picture,angry or frustrated drivers, no matter how much they try, take that attitude with them out on the streets, and it shows.

Again you are now part of the I'm guessing about your management style based on the points you argue on a message board. If you're going to lecture me on getting the big picture then please try to get it yourself.

I jumped on this thread for two reasons

One to explain the companies focus on individual behaviors. Individual behaviors is easily the biggest single cause of injuries. The company believes we can learn to control those behaviors and is holding your management team accountable for whether you yourself work safely on the route. If you have an accident as a result of not following all the safety training you recieve your supervisor and manager get their buts kicked for not knowing you were out working unsafely. Thus they are out there spying on you to make sure you actually work safely and don't take shortcuts.

I also made the point that with this process there can be a disconnect between intent and how its translated. Sober does give some good examples of how that can happen. Observations can be hit or miss when they should capture how someone actually works.

The second point I jumped on was reraises claim that all the safety training his management team has done in 25 years has not prevented any injuries and accidents. anyone who knows anything about what is smith system based safety training knows this point is just not possible. Reraise has serious management hate issues he needs to learn to deal with as well as some of the other lugheads that chimed in once they see a management free for all here. I also find it funny that posters here who have such serious hate trips going on with management also claim that they have never gotten a warning letter in 25 years. I think there is something dishonest about that point too. You avoid a warning letter for 25 years by retaining the good will of your management team. If he has never gotten one then he has done his share of sucking up and politicing at work. But here he is acting like he is some kind of management ball buster.

So now I've' given you the big picture let me know what you think.
 

soberups

Pees in the brown Koolaid
...If you have an accident as a result of not following all the safety training you recieve your supervisor and manager get their buts kicked for not knowing you were out working unsafely. Thus they are out there spying on you to make sure you actually work safely and don't take shortcuts....


But if you are like me and have 23 yrs without a lost time injury and 12 yrs safe driving....they will still spy on you and still write you a warning letter whether you are doing something wrong or not.

This was never about preventing injuries or accidents. This was about spewing forth a bunch of warning letters in order to meet a quota and look good for the suits.
 

Old International

Now driving a Sterling
The flavor of the day for me was posted today on the dispatchers window:
All feeder drivers must take the one hour lunch at the turnaround point. If you are not sure of your turnaround point, you must see management for a schedule of your run. This is subject to progressive discipline, up to and including dismissal.
You gotta be kidding me...........
 

soberups

Pees in the brown Koolaid
. You avoid a warning letter for 25 years by retaining the good will of your management team. If he has never gotten one then he has done his share of sucking up and politicing at work. .

Thank you for making my point for me, Tie. Its a lot more authentic when an actual management person confirms what the rest of us already knew.
 

tieguy

Banned
[/U][/I][/B]

But if you are like me and have 23 yrs without a lost time injury and 12 yrs safe driving....they will still spy on you and still write you a warning letter whether you are doing something wrong or not.

This was never about preventing injuries or accidents. This was about spewing forth a bunch of warning letters in order to meet a quota and look good for the suits.

I hate to disagree with someone so wise but it is about preventing accidents and injuries and along with your "BS warning letters" we also catch a lot of drivers driving without a seat belt and driving while yakking on the cell phone. At what point do we slap them on the wrist. the 10 and 2 positions is stressed on every safety ride yet its probably the most ignored safety method out there next to bending your knees when lifting. There are no quotas for warning letters. When you have that accident or injury management will be grilled on what they did to prevent it.
God help them if they do not have a recent observation on you. I find it interesting that I live this stuff and yet you guys keep trying to deny it exists.

Sober your point about being injury and accident free and not deserving the warning letter seems to me to be another reason to grab your manager and ask some good hard questions on how and why you were selected as well as why you a safe employee were targeted for discipline. A good question to ask then would be whether the manager feels you are receptive to training. There is a reason why this happened and its not some corporate conspiracy.

 

tieguy

Banned
Raw I can tell by your posts and attacks on management that you have some deep seated emotional issues that you need to deal with. Rational objective people don't think the way you do. For that reason staying off the thread and seeking professional help may be a better option.
 
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nerrollus

Well-Known Member
Anytime you see that you are being followed especially when they are being tacky like this, just call the cops. Explain that you are being followed and its possible that they are stealing your deliveries that you leave at the homes.

OK, this idea made me LOL. It would be very funny to see it happen. However, I hope no one actually does this. It would be such a horrible waste of time and money for the cops.
 

Raw

Raw Member
t
Raw I can tell by your posts and attacks on management that you have some deep seated emotional issues that you need to deal with. Rational objective people don't think the way you do. For that reason staying off the thread and seeking professional help may be a better option.
Thanks for the advice! :wink2: Anywho, I work safe because I have an active lifestyle away from my active job and I don`t need to limp around. I drive safe because UPS makes me drive a vehicle that catches the wind, can easily roll over and has open doors; I fear for my life and don`t want to die or get maimed! It is also very funny in the morning having an out of shape supe that can`t touch his toes have us do 30 seconds of "stretching" to "get us limber" after I had just spent an hour in a half at the fitness club before work because I , without supe help, know what I have to do to prepare myself for my job! :rofl:
 

tieguy

Banned
Thanks for the advice! :wink2: Anywho, I work safe because I have an active lifestyle away from my active job and I don`t need to limp around. I drive safe because UPS makes me drive a vehicle that catches the wind, can easily roll over and has open doors; I fear for my life and don`t want to die or get maimed! It is also very funny in the morning having an out of shape supe that can`t touch his toes have us do 30 seconds of "stretching" to "get us limber" after I had just spent an hour in a half at the fitness club before work because I , without supe help, know what I have to do to prepare myself for my job! :rofl:

You make that appointment yet?
:rofl:
 

tonyexpress

Whac-A-Troll Patrol
Staff member
I have an active lifestyle away from my active job and I don`t need to limp around. It is also very funny in the morning having an out of shape supe that can`t touch his toes have us do 30 seconds of "stretching" to "get us limber" after I had just spent an hour in a half at the fitness club before work because I , without supe help, know what I have to do to prepare myself for my job! :rofl:

Perhaps we can extend the healthy body attitude to a healthy more thoughtful attitude here and make posts by following the terms of service and not insulting others...:wink2:

Thanks in advance!
 

OVERBOARD

Don't believe everything you think
Again you are now part of the I'm guessing about your management style based on the points you argue on a message board. If you're going to lecture me on getting the big picture then please try to get it yourself.

I jumped on this thread for two reasons

One to explain the companies focus on individual behaviors. Individual behaviors is easily the biggest single cause of injuries. The company believes we can learn to control those behaviors and is holding your management team accountable for whether you yourself work safely on the route. If you have an accident as a result of not following all the safety training you recieve your supervisor and manager get their buts kicked for not knowing you were out working unsafely. Thus they are out there spying on you to make sure you actually work safely and don't take shortcuts.

I also made the point that with this process there can be a disconnect between intent and how its translated. Sober does give some good examples of how that can happen. Observations can be hit or miss when they should capture how someone actually works.

The second point I jumped on was reraises claim that all the safety training his management team has done in 25 years has not prevented any injuries and accidents. anyone who knows anything about what is smith system based safety training knows this point is just not possible. Reraise has serious management hate issues he needs to learn to deal with as well as some of the other lugheads that chimed in once they see a management free for all here. I also find it funny that posters here who have such serious hate trips going on with management also claim that they have never gotten a warning letter in 25 years. I think there is something dishonest about that point too. You avoid a warning letter for 25 years by retaining the good will of your management team. If he has never gotten one then he has done his share of sucking up and politicing at work. But here he is acting like he is some kind of management ball buster.

So now I've' given you the big picture let me know what you think.

Why, Tieguy you don't carry a big hammer, I thought it was mandatory:happy2:
 

UPS Lifer

Well-Known Member
I was taught to keep my hands at 10 and 2 while driving down the road. The intent of the rule is to maintain control of the vehicle in the event of a blowout or sudden emergency maneuver.

The observation that resulted in my warning letter was done in the parking lot of a Taco Bell while I was pulling out of a parking spot.

The ten and two "push pull" method of steering was written specifically to shield the company from liability for carpal-tunnel and other injuries that resulted from its business decision to delete power steering from its vehicles. The method simply shifts the responsibility for these injuries back onto the employee and relieves the company of any responsibility for solving the underlying problem.

The car I was in had power steering. There is no rational basis for using the push-pull method in a power-steering vehicle when turning the wheel 5 complete revolutions from one side to the other in order to maneuver out of a parking space. In the real word, nobody drives this way.

UPS is well aware of this fact but they cannot admit it; to do so would be to acknowledge that there is a difference between power and non-power steering vehicles in terms of injury risk, which would then require the company to spend $$ on fixing the unsafe equipment.

Based on your initial post ... I would whole-heartedly agree with you. However, there is always two sides to a story so I will refrain from passing judgment and validating your claim based solely on the post you wrote. We can't get the other side so this is all one sided.

Where it gets real interesting is the continued rant you go through. I highlighted the portion that I feel shows lack of credibility. A lot of your posts indicate you have some sort of "inside knowledge" of UPS subversive activity. You always have the "smoking gun"! Again, this is where I take you to task. Many of your posts send completely invalid information out to others and because you sound so confident I am sure there are those who hang on your every word. I happen to know better.

As for the 10-2 position on the steering wheel....

In the real world .... I use it most of the time in my personal cars.... and I use it pulling in and out of parking stalls. I went to feeder school, and this is where I picked up the habit. I have more strenght and control of the steering wheel when I use this method and I can make small adjustments when parking much easier and faster.

You only have to go so far as to look at the tires of a commercial vehicle. Most commercial tires have at least 6 to eight inches (or more) of clearance from the rim to the ground. If you have a sudden blowout and your hands are in the 10-2 position with THUMBS pushing parallel on the steering wheel (not wrapped under the steering wheel) you have the best opportunity to maintain control of the vehicle. If you have a blow out, the steering wheel will rapidly drop 6 to 8 inches in the direction of the blowout. In some cases, it has snapped the thumb because the column catches it.

This is why UPS adheres to this rule ... not the absurd conspiracy theory you put out there!

Sober - There are a lot of times that I understand and can agree with you but as I have told you before.... if I see these off the wall conspiracy theory rants that you insist are fact, I will call you on them every time.
 

UPS Lifer

Well-Known Member
Anytime you see that you are being followed especially when they are being tacky like this, just call the cops. Explain that you are being followed and its possible that they are stealing your deliveries that you leave at the homes.


Doesn't this promote the same bad behavior that Sober's manager allegedly imposed upon him? Two wrongs don't make a right. This only escalates a combative work atmosphere.

And when it comes to "spying".... Generally speaking, any instance should be used as training not discipline. Of course there may be instances where an employee is suspected of a cardinal sin and in those rare cases, you better be prepared to take the employee out of service immediately. I don't advocate "spying" on drivers.
 

dilligaf

IN VINO VERITAS
As for the 10-2 position on the steering wheel....

In the real world .... I use it most of the time in my personal cars.... and I use it pulling in and out of parking stalls. I went to feeder school, and this is where I picked up the habit. I have more strenght and control of the steering wheel when I use this method and I can make small adjustments when parking much easier and faster.

You only have to go so far as to look at the tires of a commercial vehicle. Most commercial tires have at least 6 to eight inches (or more) of clearance from the rim to the ground. If you have a sudden blowout and your hands are in the 10-2 position with THUMBS pushing parallel on the steering wheel (not wrapped under the steering wheel) you have the best opportunity to maintain control of the vehicle. If you have a blow out, the steering wheel will rapidly drop 6 to 8 inches in the direction of the blowout. In some cases, it has snapped the thumb because the column catches it.

This is why UPS adheres to this rule ... not the absurd conspiracy theory you put out there!
Lifer, I absolutely agree with you on this. Several years ago, when I was driving for a local trucking company, I very nearly broke my hand from a situation that was very similar to a blow-out. And to exacerbate the problem the tractor I was driving had no power steering. To have the steering wheel ripped out of your grip, grabbing your thumb bending it backwards at an angle that the thumb is not designed to move in is EXTREMELY painful. It is 100X worse with no power steering. I doubt even the strongest man would have an easy time controlling a steering wheel in such a situtaion. Add to that losing the extra strength in your hand by not having your thumb available to help with control. It's amazing how much strength your thumb adds to your grip.
 

screamin chicken

Well-Known Member
In 2 weeks we had a 20 + driver fired fo forgetting to delivered a misload , another 20 + driver issued a warning letter for scan a pkg twice, and another 20+ driver alsogetting a warning letter for something I am not sure of. And then a driver was told he left a Next Day pick up, and another driver had a misload that was not in edd and did not have a pal label so when it was scanned it never showed up being out of area. Then on top of this we are going out with 145-190 stops a day..... :angry::angry::angry::angry::gun_banda:gun_banda:gun_banda
 
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