fair minimum wage
- Thread starter 804brown
- Start date
brett636
Well-Known Member
I find it interesting how those who support minimum wage increases ignore the fact that minimum wage laws increase unemployment, especially for low skilled workers. First off all increasing the minimum wage does is squeeze the employer to the point where he/she may not be able to afford to keep as many employees at the wages the government sets. Secondly even if they can afford to keep them they are going to expect higher quality workers in exchange for a higher wage thus relegating low skilled workers who otherwise might be employed to the unemployment office. Lets not also allow the fact that this is an election year and my bet is the timing of this proposal wasn't really to help out the poor workers who make minimum wage, but to allow the politicians, mainly democrats, to buy votes using the money of private businesses.
UnconTROLLed
perfection
There should be no wage setting, period. jmo 
wkmac
Well-Known Member
There are people who parade that the minimum wage should be raised, one figure I hear is $15 dollars an hour. These same people blame others as standing in the way and doing nothing to help the less fortunate. However, those who tend to oppose minimum wage increases are in favor of tax cuts as deep as they can get them so on that note I think I have a solution.
Those who want to raise the minimum wage claim it's a human issue of empathy, compassion, even charity. The other side say that taxation is harsh, cruel and restrictive and both have arguments. However the solution then seems to me would be to make anyone making minimum wage or for that matter anyone under say $12 an hour a tax free worker. No federal or state taxes period. These workers draw their full gross pay and they file no income tax whatsoever. Taking a claim from the Fair Tax folks, the other part of the FICA tax paid by employers might even go to the employee as a raise thus making for a much happier employee and likely further stimulating the economy as said employee has more discretionary income. Business owner benefit is the reduced record keeping costs of these employees puts some money in the employers pockets. And those who cry about helping the working poor? Just sayin'!
To further stimulate the economy, why not end taxes on wages over 40 hours. Overtime pay becomes tax free. The blue collar working folk who do get OT would likely use such money by spending and thus further stimulate the economy or pay down personal debt potentially opening the door for new borrowing for big ticket items like cars and homes, again stimulating the economy.
Now I'm not pretending this doesn't violate economic laws or principles of political economy nor am I ignoring the fact that this idea could have unintended consequences elsewhere. But being the fact that the people in Washington ignore these very same things themselves all the time, I figure if I can offer a compromise that satisfies both sides with their "claimed passions" while to serve my own self interests by completely removing more people from the tax roles ending theft of their productivity, I see this as a win/win. Other than the OT part, I won't directly benefit but if I can just get the party started!
Now, offer up that idea to both sides in Washington and watch both of them scream and pull out their hair in rejecting it. There again will be a teaching moment.
Those who want to raise the minimum wage claim it's a human issue of empathy, compassion, even charity. The other side say that taxation is harsh, cruel and restrictive and both have arguments. However the solution then seems to me would be to make anyone making minimum wage or for that matter anyone under say $12 an hour a tax free worker. No federal or state taxes period. These workers draw their full gross pay and they file no income tax whatsoever. Taking a claim from the Fair Tax folks, the other part of the FICA tax paid by employers might even go to the employee as a raise thus making for a much happier employee and likely further stimulating the economy as said employee has more discretionary income. Business owner benefit is the reduced record keeping costs of these employees puts some money in the employers pockets. And those who cry about helping the working poor? Just sayin'!
To further stimulate the economy, why not end taxes on wages over 40 hours. Overtime pay becomes tax free. The blue collar working folk who do get OT would likely use such money by spending and thus further stimulate the economy or pay down personal debt potentially opening the door for new borrowing for big ticket items like cars and homes, again stimulating the economy.
Now I'm not pretending this doesn't violate economic laws or principles of political economy nor am I ignoring the fact that this idea could have unintended consequences elsewhere. But being the fact that the people in Washington ignore these very same things themselves all the time, I figure if I can offer a compromise that satisfies both sides with their "claimed passions" while to serve my own self interests by completely removing more people from the tax roles ending theft of their productivity, I see this as a win/win. Other than the OT part, I won't directly benefit but if I can just get the party started!
Now, offer up that idea to both sides in Washington and watch both of them scream and pull out their hair in rejecting it. There again will be a teaching moment.
phox1515
Well-Known Member
you know the sad part about raising min wage... cost of living follows behind very quickly... so while $15 p/h sounds nice right now... you can take it to the bank that everything else will rise in price very soon after. an apartment that cost $500 a month will now cost 900+ for example... so in reality you're not really making that much more money. it's a balances game and until something is done to stop the cost of living from rising with and or faster than wages it will never be enough.
Catatonic
Nine Lives
The cost of living goes up because the cost of goods and services goes up since wages are usually a major component of the cost to provide those goods or services.
The major impact is on the middle income wage earners whose wages do not go up but their cost of living does.
Thinking back to Jimmy Carter and his admonitions to Americans to be more frugal, if minimum wages goes up, Americans may stop eating out as much and purchasing other minimum wage provided goods and services.
island1fox
Well-Known Member
Apply that example to any Company --UPS ??
ChickenLegs
Safety Expert
Walmart may have 2 million employees, but they sure aren't working the check out isles!!! Geez
This is a blatant lie.
For a less cartoonish look, read this:
http://finance.fortune.cnn.com/2013/11/12/wal-mart-pay-raise/
and this:
http://www.businessinsider.com/walmart-employees-pay
and from Walmart's own site:
Today, Walmart employs more than 1.3 million U.S. associates at more than 4,700 stores and clubs nationwide. Every year, we promote about 160,000 people globally to jobs with more responsibility and higher pay. In the U.S., the average, full-time hourly wage is $12.81.
phox1515
Well-Known Member
anyone CAN give raises... it's their choice if they do or not. Sadly if they do, most of the time it also has a ripple effect on the price of their product... that tends to go up too, to match the new salary. that's why despite our wages being 50x more than it was 50 years ago, we STILL can't afford to live on min wage.... because the cost of living goes up with it.
unless govt is willing to step in and put a stop to the cost of living rising everytime min wage does, raising min wage will never be enough.
unless govt is willing to step in and put a stop to the cost of living rising everytime min wage does, raising min wage will never be enough.
Not really.
All Norwegians become crown millionaires, in oil saving landmark
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/01/08/us-norway-millionaires-idUSBREA0710U20140108
oldngray
nowhere special
That money is all held by the government so not in the individual people's hands. It will just mean that the country will be funded for programs in the future. And even if all Norwegians WERE millionaires, that is not everybody. There are many other people in the world.
