S
speeddemon
Guest
And also, what are they going to do if the contrctors win thier lawsuit on being employees? FEDEX would have to pay a HUGE amount in back taxes on those employees. *TOAST*
FedEx bigger than UPS?
- Thread starter skir
- Start date
And also, what are they going to do if the contrctors win thier lawsuit on being employees? FEDEX would have to pay a HUGE amount in back taxes on those employees. *TOAST*
dilligaf
IN VINO VERITAS
Yea Trp, Chevy house here. LOL
skir
Los Angeles CA
So what happens if Fed Ex wins
Nothing really, theyll still be top heavy in debt and have the FAA reauthorization act and the EFCA to deal with....in which case those contractors could unionize independenly
For some reason I'm thinking FDX is hitting the panic button. Uncle Freddy threatening to cancel Boeing orders if this passes? Doesn't sound like they are taking this lightly. This might actually happen.
MrFedEx
Engorged Member
Fred has one too, and he has been pushing it like mad. It sounds like this..."We're going under if the RLA exemption goes away. We have to ground aircraft because the RLA exemption will put us out of business. We have to lay people off because the RLA exemption will create pigs with wings, and Socialist, Commie unions that will make us into the next USSR....I'm melting, I'm melting...Oh what a cruel world....I'm melting". Smith then dissolves into a waxy, smoking mass with his big black witch hat smoldering on top of the pile.
FDX needs to worry more about the amount of cargo they are carrying instead of what type of jets to carry it in. They just grounded a chunk of their fleet because of declining numbers. It will be interesting to see what happens to their pricing when they have to play on the same field as UPS. Right now they do enjoy a cost advantage due to the labor issues.
MrFedEx
Engorged Member
The real reason FedEx is grounding part of their fleet is politics. Yes, volumes are down, but Smith is trying to blow smoke up the collective asses of Congress by some deft maneuvering. By mothballing 14 aircraft, Smith hopes Congress will believe him when he says the end of the RLA exemption will "destroy" FedEx. If anyone involved in the UPS lobbying efforts against FedEx reads this, please forward it. This is just another of Smith's con jobs, and these planes will be right back in the air when traffic levels come back. All of a sudden, FedEx is in the market for new (Boeing) planes, a blatant attempt at blackmailing politicians into NOT eliminating the FedEx Express Carrier exemption. If you want a level playing field, I strongly suggest that you understand this move for what it is.....a lie.
FedEx seems to have a bit of a cash flow problem. Dropping 75% profit in the 3rd qtr, laying off thousands of employees, grounding planes, cutting hours and 401k contributions to the rest of the workforce then going into our customers and offering rates below the cost to deliver is basically playing the same game that DHL played. That may work for a while depending on just how long this recession lasts but long term could be more damaging to the FedEx infrastructure, factoring in their other labor issues etc.
Coldworld
60 months and counting
Dont underestimate Fedex, they are taking ups volume, I have seen it in my area. Ups has been dismissing them for years and for the last 30+ years they have gone from small vans to large trucks and mashers like ups has. There is so much riding on this NLRA ruling. Think of it in two ways, if fedex gets the ruling in their favor, ups is going to continue to erode volume to them and maybe not right away, but in the next 10+ years you might see fedex passing brown up. Second, if the ruling goes ups' way, it still doesnt mean squat, Fred S will just keep lawyering up and put the fear in it employees to not unionize...look how he has been the last few years about it.
Brownsuit, Im not sure where you set your facts about price structure, but Ups being cheaper than fedex on air sounds off...are these published rates or from large shippers doing ground and air with ups? If any of you have been noticing, fedex is going after ups' largest accounts, going in and getting ALL the volume, giving them one rate for all of a companies operating units. For example if company a used fedex for air and ups for ground, and the same for company b, c, d and e which company a also owns;now fedex gets all these companies under one pricing and gets ALL of the volume...this is disturbing.
Finally, I guess the thing that I find so negative in the whole scheme of things is how ups is running the company right now.Im not saying that the company cant cut fat, and do money saving things in this economy, but its their ATTITUDE that has been way off base and quite disturbing. Fedex as a whole has better employee relations with their employees and ultimately it shows in their dealings with customers. Its like someone else on this thread said, we only deliver a package from point A to point B.....period. If we continue to jack our great customers around this is an bomb waiting to go off considering we are a service industry...READ SERVICE. Customers do notice!!! If you haven't seen the fortune 500 stats on ups, please look them up, seems as if brown hasnt been hurting as bad as mgt has been saying. All this doom and gloom. Question for any mgt on here.. wouldn't ups want to have the best in employee relations, you know that happy employees are productive ones...anyone care to explain this along with the increased harassment that has been going on....including on the management side, from their boses...theres no need for it!
Brownsuit, Im not sure where you set your facts about price structure, but Ups being cheaper than fedex on air sounds off...are these published rates or from large shippers doing ground and air with ups? If any of you have been noticing, fedex is going after ups' largest accounts, going in and getting ALL the volume, giving them one rate for all of a companies operating units. For example if company a used fedex for air and ups for ground, and the same for company b, c, d and e which company a also owns;now fedex gets all these companies under one pricing and gets ALL of the volume...this is disturbing.
Finally, I guess the thing that I find so negative in the whole scheme of things is how ups is running the company right now.Im not saying that the company cant cut fat, and do money saving things in this economy, but its their ATTITUDE that has been way off base and quite disturbing. Fedex as a whole has better employee relations with their employees and ultimately it shows in their dealings with customers. Its like someone else on this thread said, we only deliver a package from point A to point B.....period. If we continue to jack our great customers around this is an bomb waiting to go off considering we are a service industry...READ SERVICE. Customers do notice!!! If you haven't seen the fortune 500 stats on ups, please look them up, seems as if brown hasnt been hurting as bad as mgt has been saying. All this doom and gloom. Question for any mgt on here.. wouldn't ups want to have the best in employee relations, you know that happy employees are productive ones...anyone care to explain this along with the increased harassment that has been going on....including on the management side, from their boses...theres no need for it!
Treegrower
Well-Known Member
I take it the talk radio is from Rush and Hannity and Levin and that ilk. The truth is that the UAW came to the table and gave up alot. Gave up a ton. The Ford employees just voted on a new deal that was vitally crucial to the long term health of Ford much to their own ( the employees) detriment. The gave up pay and benefits. Reduced work classifications, reduced or froze pay, gave up breaks and other paid "for time."
You could easily make the case that any new /future Ford hourly worker got screwed to death. The new workers will never get what the current workers do in relation to pay,benefits and retirement. Kinda of like in 1982 when all new UPS part-timers were hired for $8.00 an hour.
The 1 area where the union did balk and refused to conceed anything was in the area of retiree health care. The "legacy" costs. Those benefits were negotiated in good faith and taken in lieu of pay and cash in their paychecks. Medicare (after age 65) won't come close to covering the medical expenses and hospital costs and Doctors cost and pharmacy pills that a vast majority of those retirees have. It is a huge problem with no easy answers or choices.
Talk radio made a huge point (ad nauseum) about the total labor costs for a transplant auto company is about $ 53.00 per hr. vs about $75.00 for the Big Three. Under this new deal Ford's labor cost is going to come down to about $54--$55 hr. That is huge.
UPS is not immune from legacy cost either. Don't know about FEDEX and just what their retirement plans entails as far as health/medical benefits go after retirement.
trplnkl
555
There are other truths to the big three problems. One truth with GM is that the UAW (the workers) had alot they could give back. One of the big givebacks was already going to expire with the next contract, what a sacrifice. I know of one of their employees that returned after a 20 year stint in the armed services (receiving retirement) to a maintenance job at top pay for a line worker. He mowed grass on a $10K+ tractor w/closed cab and A/c in the summer and plowed snow in a heated truck in the winter. How much sense does that make, even in good times?
BTW, Ford has not taken any of the tax payers money.
As stated, this is from published rates. This is an important distinction between the two carriers. The rate information is below, each carrier display's their rates differently, so you'll either have to take my word for it or visit the websites below and dig for it.
Examples below from UPS Daily Rates - http://www.ups.com/media/en/daily_rates.pdf
NDA
Zone 2
Letter - $14.85
1# - $17.65
Zone 8
Letter - $23.45
1# - $38.45
FedEx Standard List Rates - http://images.fedex.com/us/services/pdf/Service_Guide_2009.pdf
Priority Overnight (NDA Equivalent)
Zone 2
Letter - $16.15
1# - $19.25
Zone 8
Letter - $26.40
1# - $4190
Each carrier also has "Retail" rate for internet shippers or people off the street who walk into Kinkos, UPS Store, or Customer counters.
OldUPSDriver
Well-Known Member
Coldword, how have you been personally harassed?
skir
Los Angeles CA
Fed Ex is stealing all our accounts and all we are doing is pissing all our customers with Edd. One day I will have one customer, the next I wont have them. Every driver is coming at different times, customers want to close accounts because of that.
UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)
Well-Known Member
BrownSuit, the one point you failed to mention is that with UPS NDA letter shippers can stuff as much as they can fit in to the envelope and as long as it tapes shut we will only charge them the letter rate whereas FedEx charges by the actual weight for their letters.
Treegrower
Well-Known Member
Look to the original post. How do things get so obscured here? The original post stated that he heard on talk radio that the UAW refused to bargain or give back at all and that was the source of GM's problems. I used Ford as an example beause number 1 , the UAW reopened their contract and renegotiated early saving the company tens if not hundresd of millions of dollars, the fact that 1 or more proviosions were going to end at the end of the current contract (a couple of years from now)is irrelevant. They came, they bargained and they gave back.
So ....some guy served his counntry in the military for 20 years and earned a pension???? Your point is what? A person can only earn 1 pension in his/her lifetime?
A maintenance worker has really nice equipmment to do his job? I suppose some union official held a gun to the head of the company maintenance dirctor's head and forced him to buy a certain piece of equipment. Again your point is....? I know a UPS feeder driver in a brand new $80,000Sterling who has A/C for the summer, great heat in the winter,power steering, ect.ect. and is making about $100,000 a year on a run that guys would kill for. He is sooo fat and out of shape I can't believe he actually passed a DOT physical. Also know a fulltime air driver in a brand spanking new dodge van ( no A/C ,but great heat) that has it soo cush that guys would just about kill for that run also. Again making big bucks. He does so little work compared to us package guys. He also is a former active duty military with 8 or 10 years fulltime served in the Army and now is Active duty reserves and he will at some point,
if he stays with he will also collect a pension from the Army. Your point about the pension is.....?
And the BTW comment, Yes I know Ford didn't take any taxpayer money. That isn't/wasnt the point. The point is the UAW who covers the Bg Three-including Ford came to the table and negotiated early and gave back and made huge concessions, irrespective that some provisions were due to expire in a couple of years.
Catatonic
Nine Lives
So you think you are something special and your thread should be treated differently than all others?
Feederdrivermack
Active Member
If the ground packages are so important, maybe UPS supervisors should think twice about cutting routes on Mondays and Fridays that have alot of commercial packages. When we first start PAS, the customers went nuts when we had to follow trace. They usually would get a 1130 am delivery so they could turn around the shipments and resend them out. Well, UPS had an answer for that problem, and it wasnt a good one. I think UPS really needs to open its eyes and see what is realy going on.
