Fred Z to endorse the L-396 Richard G Slate

Hawfuh Sux

Old Guard Assassin!
If the two 952 anti Kelly movements unite they will beat him in a landslide, but it's to much about Hoffa, reform and TDU.

Unite slates and get rid of those scumbags and please do not listen to Al A (Albertsons) and the people that turned on Kelly because he didn't offer them a BA job.

The reformers have never sold out to that garbage.
 

Time4Change

TRuth HuRts
Well, I see everyone here is concern about the future of our Local 396 and everyone has the right to their own opinion. Many changes have happened over the tenure with H and his officers, some good and some bad. With that being said the question is "do we choose to live another 3 years with H"? Experience is what seems to be the concern, Now has H done good for us at the beginning, Yes. Has he done any Good for the membership in the last 6 years, I think Not. If the only thing H has experience is in Arbitration and Panels then i do Not think its enough to persuade my vote in his direction. Leadership is established by measure of quality of work recognized by the membership. Respect is Earned, Honesty is appreciated, Trust is gained and Loyalty is Returned. The absence of Mr. H has derailed him through the road of selfishness, ignorance and lack of self discipline. At the end, he lead himself to the end of his own tenure. If this is the experience of Poor contract, lack of leadership to protect the membership, out sourcing work, delayed grievance hearing and just the simple fact to show his Face in our yards to show us he is Here for us. Then he can keep his experience and take it else where.

Now Mr G, does he have what it takes to Lead the local with integrity, discipline and enforce the contract? Yes if he opens his eyes and ears to those who are knowledgeable including you TOS. Ego's are flaring with passion because we all want change to the current officers that run our local. Hard to swallow that H attempted to fire you and yet your willing to keep him in office? G has the choice and momentum to make these changes with specific attributes which can make his Slate strong enough to overcome the odds. Without mentioning names you know who they are. As for Sal Z, he stepped a side on certain reasons that are private and He and Mr G could not agree on. Though he has an opportunity to create a separate Slate, it only will divide the votes, He will not allow that. Mr G has asked for support for change and yet Sal Z set his Ego and pride a side to allow Change to Happen. So TOS and Evil this will be the only time publicly asked that you Do not Post and personnel comments related personnel lives without consent respectively. These info regarding Sal Z came direct from him and was allowed to be posted.
 

Evil

Well-Known Member
I think we all need to go in united in getting rid of H. If G doesn't do his job we'll vote for Sal and TOS in three years. The united goal this time should be to defeat that no good sell-out Ron H. TOS, how can you vote for someone that fired you. Leave your ego out of this one and tell people to vote for G.

Look at 952, they had the chance to beat Kelly twice but egos got in the way and split the vote. Hope they don't pull that next time around.
 

The Other Side

Well-Known Troll
Troll
I think we all need to go in united in getting rid of H. If G doesn't do his job we'll vote for Sal and TOS in three years. The united goal this time should be to defeat that no good sell-out Ron H. TOS, how can you vote for someone that fired you. Leave your ego out of this one and tell people to vote for G.

Look at 952, they had the chance to beat Kelly twice but egos got in the way and split the vote. Hope they don't pull that next time around.


First and foremost, lets start with the "being fired" premise. I was an elected Executive Officer and RON could not FIRE me. I completed my term in office, and that rumor that I was fired is something started by the H administration once I left the administration.

To the inside story, if you looked at the Eboard votes, Ron and Jay didnt not like the 6 to 1 votes on issues, with the ONE NO vote being MY VOTE.

Lots of money being sent out where it shouldnt have, but that politics. Golfing and trips has been the key to Ron bringing in members who were against him for years, only to suck up to him now.

I wouldnt go down that path. Some will sell out for a leather bag, a jacket, a watch, a trip to DC, an article 16 removal from work (ups) fully paid by the members union dues.

I had issues with Phillips using the locals office to run his law practice. The phone, fax machine stamps and such are the locals property, and Phillips illegally used these things for his personal use. Having the girls answer the phone for his law issues and the use of local equiptment is a major violation of federal statutes.

We came to logger heads over these issues, and I completed my elected term and didnt not run with them again.

Over the years, "I" have pointed out many times over where Ron and co. have derailed from the original gameplan and moved towards playing the "union" game that exists behind the scenes.

My issue with making a change with G is pretty simple, he ran already, he failed to gain any traction in that election and he made a mockery of the election process the last time out. He surrounded himself with "trouble makers" who caused him votes and his actions and those of his spouse in Las Vegas havent gone away.

G isnt well liked by members "outside" of his home base in San Gabe. But thats not the "like" as in he is a bad person. Its the kinda "like" in a football game where you have a starter and a second stringer crying that he wants to be the starter.

Local elections are really simple, there are not that many "new" votes to change the landscape of an election. Those that dont vote, wont, and those that do vote usually vote the same way.

This means that G, has to be able to CHANGE peoples minds, and so far, from the chatter amongst feeder drivers & package drivers, this isnt happening.

Lets look at this another way. On a national scale, Mitt Romney ran for office and spent a ton of money. He failed on a grand scale to come even close to winning the white house. Now, in 2016, "some" people want him to run again, he definately has the money and time to do so, but he understands clearly, through the prior votes, that another campaign would be in vain, despite ALL the talk for him to do so. He knows he failed to make a good first impression on the voters and even though there are calls for him to run, he also knows he would be better suited as an advisor to another candidate. His role, while diminished on a grand scale, doesnt mean he cant be an asset to another candidate seeking office.

Same in local politics. L. A ran 4 times. Each time changing up his lineup hoping each member would bring in votes, only to find out he was operating at a deficit before the election ever took place. He lost all four times despite dragging in people from sanitation, anderson press and UPS. Local 396 election history doesnt bode well for G and regardless of his personal passion to want to make change, like Romney, he needs to understand his future role with local politics.

As I said before, My team discussed this at length, and while dissapointed with Galvans attempt to run again because he believed he brought in people who could help him win vs. impressing the membership on his own efforts, we have chosen to sit out.

I have discussed with Sal Z. the prospects of uniting in 2016 and in that same conversation, explained the "in's and out's" of local politics. The excuse given for Sal's departure is BOGUS, and let me be absolutely clear about that.

This was a "pushout" by G and his "team".

Sal's personal business has nothing to do with the election, his qualifications, his experience and RON would never include this in a campaign. RON may be plenty of things, but a dirtbag isnt one of them. RON has become a professional politician in union politics, this to his credit. He is also man enough to run on his own record and wouldnt dive into a mud slinging contest about someones personal business. Everyone has garbage in their personal lives.

This kind of information is "off base" in local politics, and any suggestion by the G team, that Sal's personal business got in the way is pure B.S. This alone takes away the credibility of G and his team.

I spoke directly to Sal, and i can assure you, your description of the event is INACCURATE. It may be the spin they are putting on it, but Sal deserves better respect than that.

Our team stepping aside gives G, the best opportunity to run this time around, if our team ran, we would split the vote and both lose, only accomplishing one thing, not knowing which team had the best chance of winning.

Allowing G to do it alone, the votes will speak volumes, and in 2017, he should "listen" to those votes and get out of the way.

There are many talented people in our local, and rather than attempting another do'over with the same strategy, assembling a winning team with a hybrid of G/TOS personnel would have insured victory this time around, but as I said, G has his own sights set on stardom. G and I have spoken before about this, but there was no reconciliation of the minds.

We will just have to see how it plays out in 2014.

I have made my predictions, and I am on the record.

As for RON. Yes, i think we can be in full agreement of your assessment of where he stands today. From sitting on mulitple boards and being "connected" ( in union terms) took years to create. Ron and I sat one day before the election that put us in office, and we agreed that "WE" would never become union politicians, and we would never spend our time attempting to hob nob with the IBT and get distracted.

I kept my word, Ron did not. On the other hand, its hard not to get involved. There is an old saying:

"power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely".

For Ron, this is where he stands today.

Does this mean we toss him out and give G three years to affect peoples lives? No. We tried that already with another unproven, lack of experienced leader in D. Bruno.

In three years, he racked up over 300 terminations, wasted local funds, committed illegal acts against the local in which charges were brought up at the JC, stole local equiptment and finances, misrepresented the members in all fields covered by our local and left THOUSANDS of unsettled greivances on the desks of the local when we took over.

It was a disaster from the start, but like now, we had an encumbent in office for nearly 15 years in Raul Lopez, as a part of that administration, Lopez didnt believe he needed to campaign or change the direction he was going in.

Nobody in the administration believed Bruno could defeat us, but people wanted to "give him a chance" and they did and everyone paid for it.

Now you want to try that again?

Bad things can happen, its a tough job, there are lots of things to do. Its just not walking around the yards in fancy shirts. Its a management job that wears many hats, and those hats can get heavy if you dont know how to wear them.

I personally do not want to revisit the Bruno era in an administration that consists of NOT ONE candidate having ANY executive experience whatsoever.

Thats "the other side".

TOS.
 

Johney

Well-Known Member
First and foremost, lets start with the "being fired" premise. I was an elected Executive Officer and RON could not FIRE me. I completed my term in office, and that rumor that I was fired is something started by the H administration once I left the administration.

To the inside story, if you looked at the Eboard votes, Ron and Jay didnt not like the 6 to 1 votes on issues, with the ONE NO vote being MY VOTE.

Lots of money being sent out where it shouldnt have, but that politics. Golfing and trips has been the key to Ron bringing in members who were against him for years, only to suck up to him now.

I wouldnt go down that path. Some will sell out for a leather bag, a jacket, a watch, a trip to DC, an article 16 removal from work (ups) fully paid by the members union dues.

I had issues with Phillips using the locals office to run his law practice. The phone, fax machine stamps and such are the locals property, and Phillips illegally used these things for his personal use. Having the girls answer the phone for his law issues and the use of local equiptment is a major violation of federal statutes.

We came to logger heads over these issues, and I completed my elected term and didnt not run with them again.

Over the years, "I" have pointed out many times over where Ron and co. have derailed from the original gameplan and moved towards playing the "union" game that exists behind the scenes.

My issue with making a change with G is pretty simple, he ran already, he failed to gain any traction in that election and he made a mockery of the election process the last time out. He surrounded himself with "trouble makers" who caused him votes and his actions and those of his spouse in Las Vegas havent gone away.

G isnt well liked by members "outside" of his home base in San Gabe. But thats not the "like" as in he is a bad person. Its the kinda "like" in a football game where you have a starter and a second stringer crying that he wants to be the starter.

Local elections are really simple, there are not that many "new" votes to change the landscape of an election. Those that dont vote, wont, and those that do vote usually vote the same way.

This means that G, has to be able to CHANGE peoples minds, and so far, from the chatter amongst feeder drivers & package drivers, this isnt happening.

Lets look at this another way. On a national scale, Mitt Romney ran for office and spent a ton of money. He failed on a grand scale to come even close to winning the white house. Now, in 2016, "some" people want him to run again, he definately has the money and time to do so, but he understands clearly, through the prior votes, that another campaign would be in vain, despite ALL the talk for him to do so. He knows he failed to make a good first impression on the voters and even though there are calls for him to run, he also knows he would be better suited as an advisor to another candidate. His role, while diminished on a grand scale, doesnt mean he cant be an asset to another candidate seeking office.

Same in local politics. L. A ran 4 times. Each time changing up his lineup hoping each member would bring in votes, only to find out he was operating at a deficit before the election ever took place. He lost all four times despite dragging in people from sanitation, anderson press and UPS. Local 396 election history doesnt bode well for G and regardless of his personal passion to want to make change, like Romney, he needs to understand his future role with local politics.

As I said before, My team discussed this at length, and while dissapointed with Galvans attempt to run again because he believed he brought in people who could help him win vs. impressing the membership on his own efforts, we have chosen to sit out.

I have discussed with Sal Z. the prospects of uniting in 2016 and in that same conversation, explained the "in's and out's" of local politics. The excuse given for Sal's departure is BOGUS, and let me be absolutely clear about that.

This was a "pushout" by G and his "team".

Sal's personal business has nothing to do with the election, his qualifications, his experience and RON would never include this in a campaign. RON may be plenty of things, but a dirtbag isnt one of them. RON has become a professional politician in union politics, this to his credit. He is also man enough to run on his own record and wouldnt dive into a mud slinging contest about someones personal business. Everyone has garbage in their personal lives.

This kind of information is "off base" in local politics, and any suggestion by the G team, that Sal's personal business got in the way is pure B.S. This alone takes away the credibility of G and his team.

I spoke directly to Sal, and i can assure you, your description of the event is INACCURATE. It may be the spin they are putting on it, but Sal deserves better respect than that.

Our team stepping aside gives G, the best opportunity to run this time around, if our team ran, we would split the vote and both lose, only accomplishing one thing, not knowing which team had the best chance of winning.

Allowing G to do it alone, the votes will speak volumes, and in 2017, he should "listen" to those votes and get out of the way.

There are many talented people in our local, and rather than attempting another do'over with the same strategy, assembling a winning team with a hybrid of G/TOS personnel would have insured victory this time around, but as I said, G has his own sights set on stardom. G and I have spoken before about this, but there was no reconciliation of the minds.

We will just have to see how it plays out in 2014.

I have made my predictions, and I am on the record.

As for RON. Yes, i think we can be in full agreement of your assessment of where he stands today. From sitting on mulitple boards and being "connected" ( in union terms) took years to create. Ron and I sat one day before the election that put us in office, and we agreed that "WE" would never become union politicians, and we would never spend our time attempting to hob nob with the IBT and get distracted.

I kept my word, Ron did not. On the other hand, its hard not to get involved. There is an old saying:

"power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely".

For Ron, this is where he stands today.

Does this mean we toss him out and give G three years to affect peoples lives? No. We tried that already with another unproven, lack of experienced leader in D. Bruno.

In three years, he racked up over 300 terminations, wasted local funds, committed illegal acts against the local in which charges were brought up at the JC, stole local equiptment and finances, misrepresented the members in all fields covered by our local and left THOUSANDS of unsettled greivances on the desks of the local when we took over.

It was a disaster from the start, but like now, we had an encumbent in office for nearly 15 years in Raul Lopez, as a part of that administration, Lopez didnt believe he needed to campaign or change the direction he was going in.

Nobody in the administration believed Bruno could defeat us, but people wanted to "give him a chance" and they did and everyone paid for it.

Now you want to try that again?

Bad things can happen, its a tough job, there are lots of things to do. Its just not walking around the yards in fancy shirts. Its a management job that wears many hats, and those hats can get heavy if you dont know how to wear them.

I personally do not want to revisit the Bruno era in an administration that consists of NOT ONE candidate having ANY executive experience whatsoever.

Thats "the other side".

TOS.
Yawn.
 

Hawfuh Sux

Old Guard Assassin!
First and foremost, lets start with the "being fired" premise. I was an elected Executive Officer and RON could not FIRE me. I completed my term in office, and that rumor that I was fired is something started by the H administration once I left the administration.

To the inside story, if you looked at the Eboard votes, Ron and Jay didnt not like the 6 to 1 votes on issues, with the ONE NO vote being MY VOTE.

Lots of money being sent out where it shouldnt have, but that politics. Golfing and trips has been the key to Ron bringing in members who were against him for years, only to suck up to him now.

I wouldnt go down that path. Some will sell out for a leather bag, a jacket, a watch, a trip to DC, an article 16 removal from work (ups) fully paid by the members union dues.

I had issues with Phillips using the locals office to run his law practice. The phone, fax machine stamps and such are the locals property, and Phillips illegally used these things for his personal use. Having the girls answer the phone for his law issues and the use of local equiptment is a major violation of federal statutes.

We came to logger heads over these issues, and I completed my elected term and didnt not run with them again.

Over the years, "I" have pointed out many times over where Ron and co. have derailed from the original gameplan and moved towards playing the "union" game that exists behind the scenes.

My issue with making a change with G is pretty simple, he ran already, he failed to gain any traction in that election and he made a mockery of the election process the last time out. He surrounded himself with "trouble makers" who caused him votes and his actions and those of his spouse in Las Vegas havent gone away.

G isnt well liked by members "outside" of his home base in San Gabe. But thats not the "like" as in he is a bad person. Its the kinda "like" in a football game where you have a starter and a second stringer crying that he wants to be the starter.

Local elections are really simple, there are not that many "new" votes to change the landscape of an election. Those that dont vote, wont, and those that do vote usually vote the same way.

This means that G, has to be able to CHANGE peoples minds, and so far, from the chatter amongst feeder drivers & package drivers, this isnt happening.

Lets look at this another way. On a national scale, Mitt Romney ran for office and spent a ton of money. He failed on a grand scale to come even close to winning the white house. Now, in 2016, "some" people want him to run again, he definately has the money and time to do so, but he understands clearly, through the prior votes, that another campaign would be in vain, despite ALL the talk for him to do so. He knows he failed to make a good first impression on the voters and even though there are calls for him to run, he also knows he would be better suited as an advisor to another candidate. His role, while diminished on a grand scale, doesnt mean he cant be an asset to another candidate seeking office.

Same in local politics. L. A ran 4 times. Each time changing up his lineup hoping each member would bring in votes, only to find out he was operating at a deficit before the election ever took place. He lost all four times despite dragging in people from sanitation, anderson press and UPS. Local 396 election history doesnt bode well for G and regardless of his personal passion to want to make change, like Romney, he needs to understand his future role with local politics.

As I said before, My team discussed this at length, and while dissapointed with Galvans attempt to run again because he believed he brought in people who could help him win vs. impressing the membership on his own efforts, we have chosen to sit out.

I have discussed with Sal Z. the prospects of uniting in 2016 and in that same conversation, explained the "in's and out's" of local politics. The excuse given for Sal's departure is BOGUS, and let me be absolutely clear about that.

This was a "pushout" by G and his "team".

Sal's personal business has nothing to do with the election, his qualifications, his experience and RON would never include this in a campaign. RON may be plenty of things, but a dirtbag isnt one of them. RON has become a professional politician in union politics, this to his credit. He is also man enough to run on his own record and wouldnt dive into a mud slinging contest about someones personal business. Everyone has garbage in their personal lives.

This kind of information is "off base" in local politics, and any suggestion by the G team, that Sal's personal business got in the way is pure B.S. This alone takes away the credibility of G and his team.

I spoke directly to Sal, and i can assure you, your description of the event is INACCURATE. It may be the spin they are putting on it, but Sal deserves better respect than that.

Our team stepping aside gives G, the best opportunity to run this time around, if our team ran, we would split the vote and both lose, only accomplishing one thing, not knowing which team had the best chance of winning.

Allowing G to do it alone, the votes will speak volumes, and in 2017, he should "listen" to those votes and get out of the way.

There are many talented people in our local, and rather than attempting another do'over with the same strategy, assembling a winning team with a hybrid of G/TOS personnel would have insured victory this time around, but as I said, G has his own sights set on stardom. G and I have spoken before about this, but there was no reconciliation of the minds.

We will just have to see how it plays out in 2014.

I have made my predictions, and I am on the record.

As for RON. Yes, i think we can be in full agreement of your assessment of where he stands today. From sitting on mulitple boards and being "connected" ( in union terms) took years to create. Ron and I sat one day before the election that put us in office, and we agreed that "WE" would never become union politicians, and we would never spend our time attempting to hob nob with the IBT and get distracted.

I kept my word, Ron did not. On the other hand, its hard not to get involved. There is an old saying:

"power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely".

For Ron, this is where he stands today.

Does this mean we toss him out and give G three years to affect peoples lives? No. We tried that already with another unproven, lack of experienced leader in D. Bruno.

In three years, he racked up over 300 terminations, wasted local funds, committed illegal acts against the local in which charges were brought up at the JC, stole local equiptment and finances, misrepresented the members in all fields covered by our local and left THOUSANDS of unsettled greivances on the desks of the local when we took over.

It was a disaster from the start, but like now, we had an encumbent in office for nearly 15 years in Raul Lopez, as a part of that administration, Lopez didnt believe he needed to campaign or change the direction he was going in.

Nobody in the administration believed Bruno could defeat us, but people wanted to "give him a chance" and they did and everyone paid for it.

Now you want to try that again?

Bad things can happen, its a tough job, there are lots of things to do. Its just not walking around the yards in fancy shirts. Its a management job that wears many hats, and those hats can get heavy if you dont know how to wear them.

I personally do not want to revisit the Bruno era in an administration that consists of NOT ONE candidate having ANY executive experience whatsoever.

Thats "the other side".

TOS.
You are correct that you can't be fired from your executive board position you were voted in for. But as an employee of L396 whether you're a BA, organizer etc...you can be fired by the principal officer.

Second of all, what has their experience done for the membership? Do we have better contracts? No we don't and this carve-out is proof of it.

You say Ron doesn't mud sling, but he sure did against you when he went around telling people he fired you.

Why would you support his misuse of local funds? Next thing you know we'll be like 63 and 952, in negative net flow.

And why would you support an administration that pays for outside memebers to go to Las Vegas with the funds of the 396 membership.

You need to check yourself.
 

The Other Side

Well-Known Troll
Troll
You are correct that you can't be fired from your executive board position you were voted in for. But as an employee of L396 whether you're a BA, organizer etc...you can be fired by the principal officer.

Second of all, what has their experience done for the membership? Do we have better contracts? No we don't and this carve-out is proof of it.

You say Ron doesn't mud sling, but he sure did against you when he went around telling people he fired you.

Why would you support his misuse of local funds? Next thing you know we'll be like 63 and 952, in negative net flow.

And why would you support an administration that pays for outside memebers to go to Las Vegas with the funds of the 396 membership.

You need to check yourself.


No, I dont need to check myself. I understand how politics works, and it went without saying that "both" of us would talk smack about each other once we separated. Any suggestion that I did not complete my elected term is pure nonsense regardless of whatever has been said. Now, dont mix subjects. As Ron and his administration may say unflattering things behind my back to people like you, "I" on the other hand, talk smack to their face. What i am talking about when i mention "mudslinging", I am talking about the B.S. excuse for pushing Sal Z. out of way in the G slate. His personal business isnt a relevant subject in a local election. This isnt the same as public office where something like that could have an impact. Whoever "decided" that this was an issue clearly misunderstands the electoral process in local politics.

I agree with you that since 2008, both contracts contained givebacks that hurt the membership. There is no argument from me there. I too, am unhappy with the carve out insurance program regardless of its origin, but there is NOTHING we can do today about it. The company isnt going to take it back, now or later. its the UNIONS problem now.

As far as misuse of "funds". There isnt ONE shred of evidence that this has occured under the H administration.

Ron has ultilized the office to secure funds and the treasury, the local has a paid accountant to oversee the books and investments. Ron's role is to manage dues money into investments that make money and 396 will not see the levels of financial mismanagement like other locals. Any claim of this is simply untrue. If anyone is going to run for office on this premise, would be committing political suicide.

On the other hand, this isnt to say that money is being used for silly things, all legal, all Eboard approved and all above board. When I was holding office, motions were made for dumb things, like full page ads in high school year books for members who asked for it. By a vote of 6 to 1, things like this passed.

It was all politics, pay backs for members support. Pretty simple. Ive seen soccer uniform approvals, baseball uniform approval, golf outings, trips, leather bags, jackets, shirts blah blah blah.. the list is long.

Is this stuff right? Well, thats the fine line that is walked. If the Eboard believes it is and votes to authorize it, well then, its approved. NO laws broken. People may not like it, but its not illegal.

The local has been "paying" members to do many things other than just going to las vegas. This practice under article 16 is an allowed practice by the local and one of the ways Ron has been able to turn "haters" into "supporters".

How do you think M.K., P.M., D.C. or G.T. came to be a part of this administration??

Turner was a part of the smack talk with L.A. when he ran against us, the others were are part of that movement for years. Ron was able to "turn" them into supporters by tossing out carrots to them in the form of "inclusion".

That inclusion meant, trips to events, gifts, and ultimately, promotion into the local.

Again, it isnt illegal, its a practice.

Your points, while simple, are not ground breaking and it really goes to show how limited your experience is with local operations.

There are more serious issues that "we" has members have to deal with.

The issue then becomes, do we replace the H Administration with G just for the sake of change, possibly hurting ourselves and the local worse? In the next three years, who do you want in your corner, a group who for the most part understands the system, has the connections with the labor department and has a track record of win some lose some OR people with NO connections to the labor department with NO working relationships with the company where a phone call could make a difference, OR a new group of people who dont understand or has EVER conducted an arbitration?

Would you like to be the guinea pig for their first case? Of course you wouldnt, neither would "I" or any other member.

Some history, when G was a business agent during my term, he was ineffective in his yards and the one thing that stands out about his history was when he managed to get himself BANNED from several yards for his abusive tone and lack of professionalism.

Ron and I had to have a private meeting with then regional manager D.A., just to get our agents back into the yards. This was a troubling time for the local when our agents were banned because of his actions.

Ultimately, G and the local separated, and I will leave it at that.

The job is more than popularity, its an art, and that art is negotiation. Its the ability to make things happen vs. waiting for things to happen.

I dont believe G has that ability to "make" things happen, regardless of what anyone else has to say. He just doesnt have the company respect to accomplish this.

We shouldnt make change just for the sake of change.

Let me pose this to you. If the membership was truly upset with RON, then, how in the last election did G not earn any more votes than the normal dissention vote? 900 votes is the average dissention vote regardless of who is in office. That means that 900 people will vote against whoever is in office no matter what. G recieved 955.

Now, if he had actually pulled closer to 1400, then you could argue that he had a chance to win. At that point, its a simple matter of changing 200 peoples minds.

But, if you can barely crest 900, then you are not connecting with the membership regardless of how many people show up at a poker party.

From 955 to 1501 doesnt sound like a big number, but it is if the lead candidate cant pull in the numbers himself. If the lead candidate has to run around trying to bring in other people to make up a deficit, what does that say about the candidacy itself?

Thats called leading from behind, behind others credibility.

What is most likely to happen in this election is that "fewer" people will vote because they dont like EITHER candidate.

This hurts the new slate and NOT the encumbent slate.

Believe me, if Ron was doing anything illegal, I would be at the local requesting to review the books, and that isnt happening. Nobody is going to win an election on that premise.

This is about the future, 2018 to be specific. That's when our national contract comes back up for negotiation. The players need to change in 2018, and there is still one election prior to 2018 in our local.

2017 is my new target. Strategically, in three years, a majority of H supporters will have retired. Of course i am talking about the feeder department. In package, ORION will need to be addressed, and protections created for our drivers from the abusive treatment over its implementation. Part timers need to have progression returned to a reasonable time frame so we can reduce the "turnover" of part timers back to levels seen before 2008.

This election comes down to Galvans ability to put forward his best shot, and just not hope that people are pissed at RON and will make change for change. When he loses, regardless of vote count, he will have to step aside and allow the members to find another slate of personnel to move forward without interference.

As I said before, I am on the record already with my predictions, and only time wil tell. Lets let that clock run out and discuss it then.

TOS.
 
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Evil

Well-Known Member
Teamsters and golfing sound so stupid. What kind of example are they setting out there by acting like some yuppies? I'm sorry but a truck driver does not belong in the golf course.

I doubt Ron will get anywhere near the votes he got last time around. He's pissed of hundreds of people, especially the many people who were close to retiring and can't afford it under this new contract.
 

Evil

Well-Known Member
Anyone who is close to retirement and can't afford to do so because of the new contract has only him or herself to blame.
You don't live in southern California where a one bedroom studio runs for $350,000 to $400,000.

I know a lot of of you guys out east and in the midwest buy mansions off a lake for $200,000.
 

The Other Side

Well-Known Troll
Troll
Teamsters and golfing sound so stupid. What kind of example are they setting out there by acting like some yuppies? I'm sorry but a truck driver does not belong in the golf course.

I doubt Ron will get anywhere near the votes he got last time around. He's pissed of hundreds of people, especially the many people who were close to retiring and can't afford it under this new contract.

Ok, lets talk about "vote trending".

When we first took office, we received over 2700 votes. TDU and Bruno received less than 400 combined votes.

Since then, Ron has been steadily loses votes, with the last election bringing him down to 1965.

Yes, there are alot of upset members, but you will see his numbers on only drop down to about 1745 this time, which will still be a majority to win.

You can be sure that RON will be unable to draw larger numbers for sure, so protecting his base is his priority. That "base" will likely be retired in the next election cycle and will be of no help to his administration.

Being "engaged" is the key, and right now, the contract is "old news" to the majority of people. It became old news 6 months after it was voted down the first time. People just give up talking about it.

If this election was held in november of 2013 when our contract expired, Ron would have been tossed out even if mickey mouse ran against him. Today however, its a different story.

Other than those directly connected to local politics, who is talking about the contract? Who is debating sections of the contract that dont affect them? What full timer gives a crap about a 4 year progression for part timers?

Answer: NONE.

So, the real question is how to get the people engaged to care?

If you cant answer that in a manner that inspires member participation, then you dont have a chance to win.

TOS.
 
I think we all need to go in united in getting rid of H. If G doesn't do his job we'll vote for Sal and TOS in three years. The united goal this time should be to defeat that no good sell-out Ron H. TOS, how can you vote for someone that fired you. Leave your ego out of this one and tell people to vote for G.

Look at 952, they had the chance to beat Kelly twice but egos got in the way and split the vote. Hope they don't pull that next time around.
You should just change leadership every three years. That will be good for your local.
 
The chances of challengers winning in Southern California have always been very slim. But 396 represents only two crafts (sanitation and UPS). Sanitation workers for long have been unhappy with Ron H and the regressive contracts he's negotiated. Isidro Valdivia who is well known and respected for his activism in Waste Management after leading an $87 lawsuit against them in 2007 is believed to be running on the G Slate.

Read more: http://www.browncafe.com/community/...e-l-396-richard-G-slate.357991/#ixzz3CYa1z8Xf

How did they divide the 87 bucks in this big victory?



Fred Z will be visiting Southern California in the coming weeks just before the Local 396 nominations. It is said that he will endorse the candidacy of Richard G against Ron H.

The chances of challengers winning in Southern California have always been very slim. But 396 represents only two crafts (sanitation and UPS). Sanitation workers for long have been unhappy with Ron H and the regressive contracts he's negotiated. Isidro Valdivia who is well known and respected for his activism in Waste Management after leading an $87 lawsuit against them in 2007 is believed to be running on the G Slate.

But UPS is even now more angered about the worse contract in UPS history, especially the new healthcare they were dealt. The UPS members of 396 in majority are putting blame on Ron H and are saying they are willing to give G a chance. These are the same people that three years ago did not take his candidacy very serious. Last year Local 396 voted down the contract 1742 votes to 463. That's better than 4 to 1. If those No votes go to the challenging slate, H will be in big trouble.

Ron H, his executive board and business agents are now desperately saying anything to save their jobs. H and company are laying blame on Hoffa and hall for their humiliating defeat at the negotiating table. They have gone as far as saying that they are no longer supporting Hoffa, even though H himself serves as International Trustee in Hoffa's Executive Board.

These are some exiting times at 396 and a H defeat would clearly show how angered UPS Teamsters are with this contract.
 

Evil

Well-Known Member
The money was split between every Waste Management Teamster in the country. The violation was nationwide and Isidro Valdivia filed the lawsuit and was represented by TDU lawyers.
 
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