Free Cash flow 5.4 billion

Discussion in 'UPS Union Issues' started by rudy5150, Jan 31, 2013.

  1. rudy5150

    rudy5150 New Member

    UPS (NYSE: UPS) today announced record 2012 fourth quarter and full year adjusted diluted earnings per share of $1.32 and $4.53 respectively, with the U.S. Domestic segment leading the way. The company generated annual free cash flow of approximately $5.4 billion, a testament to operations execution and the emphasis UPS places on capital efficiency. UPS estimates that Hurricane Sandy reduced earnings per share by approximately $0.05.

    I think its about time the union and UPS take care of the part timers. They have been left behind in the past few contracts. They obviously have the cash to do so. Both part timers and deserve a good contract but even more so for the part timers. Full timers make 30+ an hr 45 an hr OT plus great health bennys. Not too much to complain about in my eyes. Most part timers dont even come close to making 15-20 dollars an hr. Perhaps a large signing bonus and or jump in pay for part timers?
  2. LongTimeComing

    LongTimeComing Air Ops Pro

    Was patiently waiting on one of these posts....

    This 'cash flow' does not directly relate to having funds to just throw at people. It's a little more complicated than that.....but I agree they need to do something about PT pay...regardless of what sort of inflated numbers they release to the public for the sake of their stock prices....
  3. PiedmontSteward

    PiedmontSteward RTW-4-Less

    Scott Davis will be getting 112" rims welded onto his yacht instead while instructing the UPS management team in contract negotiations to continue bitching about health insurance. BLING, BLING baby.
  4. TechGrrl

    TechGrrl Space Cadet

    If I were us, I would be more worried about the effect that $3 Billion charge for mark-to-market on pension funding has on the bean counter thinking in Atlanta. The SEC is forcing companies to do that to demonstrate what their pension liabilities are. Since it hits the way earnings LOOK, expect a push to ditch our pensions by selling them to an insurance company that would provide annuities instead. Go google what happened to Verizon and GM pensions.
  5. 104Feeder

    104Feeder Phoenix Feeder

    They might ditch yours but they can't ditch ours.
  6. TechGrrl

    TechGrrl Space Cadet

    Very true. However, there is that pesky health care plan that is also part of the negotiation. Remember, there is a pot of money, and it must be divided three ways: wages, benefits, pension contribution.
  7. Sleeve_meet_Heart

    Sleeve_meet_Heart making the unreadable unreadabler

    Ah yes, the psychopath CEO mentality. A true American Patriot.
  8. 104Feeder

    104Feeder Phoenix Feeder

    The "pot of money" theory is a Browncafe invention. It's not like UPS brings one size of cherry pie & throws it to the Teamsters to let them fight it out among themselves how to slice it. Need proof? Look at the "pot" that was offered in 1997 and how that turned into a wine barrel.
  9. nate4027

    nate4027 New Member

    I am just glad to see UPS is profiting what they are profiting. It makes things somewhat easier when negotiating.
  10. Brownslave688

    Brownslave688 You want a toe? I can get you a toe.

    I don't think so. No matter what the company is going to seek concessions and cry poor us. They could make 2 billion a quarter it wouldn't matter.

    Where as if they weren't making money hand over fist we would be willing to give those concessions to them and wouldn't be quite the fight.
  11. TechGrrl

    TechGrrl Space Cadet

    It's not an invention. UPS, like ANY company, has their little financial model that says, "THIS is how much we can give to the employees while satisfying our EPS requirements." You can disagree with that model, and disagree with the company's EPS requirements, but that number exists. During the negotiations, the company has this group of hamsters in the back room, running on the wheels that power the computers that they have programmed with a scenario generator that tells them the tradeoffs between plain old money, and changes to work rules and such, that translate into money. At the end of the negotiations, all those tradeoffs have been modeled, and the company (and hopefully, the union) knows the exact value of their "last, best, and final" offer. [By the way, as much as people laughed at that phrase back in '97, the phrase is actually mandated by labor law as a trigger for certain things to occur regarding arbitration and so on.]

    At the end of the day, the company has real, cash money on the table, and 'imputed' money based on operational changes that impact their operating costs. And the real, cash money gets divvied up between wages, benefits, and pension contributions. Those items are negotiated between the company and the union. Your union knows that, even if you don't.
  12. Jones

    Jones fILE A GRIEVE! Staff Member

    The way it's been presented here in the past is definitely an invention. If it really just consisted of the company shoving a pot of gold at the union and saying "This what you get this contract, divide it up however you see fit" then negotiations would be over pretty quick. The company may have an upper limit that they are not willing to go beyond, but they sure as hell don't tell the union what it is. Negotiations are how the union tries to find out.
  13. 104Feeder

    104Feeder Phoenix Feeder

    Techgrrl, I guess those are the same hamsters that power the same computers that generate the same reports causing the same conference calls creating the same PCM's that lead to the same employee/mgmt meetings that waste billions trying to save pennies on inane things like "idle time" and "backing events". I'm unimpressed. Like I said, the proof is in the past.
  14. TechGrrl

    TechGrrl Space Cadet

    I don't remember ANYONE ever claiming that the company shoves a pot of gold at the union and saying "divvy it up however you want". I have always said that this is something to be negotiated, and that YOU GUYS (that is, the UNION) needs to decide which of the three legs of the stool is where you want the money to go, and how much you think you can squeeze out of the company. Those comments were in response to people who seem to think that there are no tradeoffs to be made between the three items (and other, non-cash operating work rules), and that they can have more wages, -AND- better benefits, -AND- more pensions. This comes out most clearly in the threads where people are being hit between the eyes with the increased monthly contribution for retiree health care, because $50 per month for a family is no longer viable.
  15. TechGrrl

    TechGrrl Space Cadet

    Won't argue with you that the company has lost its collective mind thinking that spreadsheets rule the earth, but that's what you get when you put a bean counter in as CEO.

    Having stipulated that, I speak from experience with regard to the scenario modeling concerning the impact of work rules, on both the company and the union side of the table. I was supplying some hamster wheels at one time, and we KNEW that the union had their own computers busy churning out scenario models based on work rules that were being proposed and haggled over. At one point, we offered the use of our model to the union so that they could see we were negotiating in good faith, since there was a lot of money on the table with some rule changes.
  16. 104Feeder

    104Feeder Phoenix Feeder

    I'm not doubting they run models, but the neat thing about models is that all the variables can be changed. Being in the back room is not the same as being in the negotiations, but thanks for your perspective.

    One of those variables seems to be how much they take from your side of the pie, especially seeing how your health insurance suffers compared to ours.
  17. 104Feeder

    104Feeder Phoenix Feeder

    Again, look to the past and you will see we've won all of those things: higher wages, pension contributions, and better benefits as well as more vacation time (I liked how we parlayed the anniversary & birthday paid holidays into an extra week of option days), and better work rules. Heck, even the last contract with our huge jump in pension benefits in the WCT ($5/hr thank you Central States) we also had triple time for over 9.5. Seriously, where do you see triple time being negotiated anywhere recently? All of that and the Company still continues to do very well, so I don't see us as "squeezing" as you put it.
  18. beentheredonethat

    beentheredonethat Well-Known Member

    104Feeder.. based on your last comment, does this mean you didn't squeeze the company until the company no longer makes money? or better yet, loses money each year? What should a company make in profits? (Based in terms of % of revenue?) 0%, 1%, 2% at what point is the % revenue fair to the company? You guys like to say fair days work for a fair days pay. Yet you don't definie fair. What is a fair % profit?
  19. rudy5150

    rudy5150 New Member

    A happy employee is a productive employee :wink2: UPS doesnt get it
  20. beentheredonethat

    beentheredonethat Well-Known Member

    Rudy.. Most people here post that UPS drivers work way harder and do way more then a FDX ground contracted driver. Yet, you say UPS doesn't get it using the theme of a Happy employee is a productive employee. So are you saying UPS drivers aren't productive?