I drink your milkshake! a metaphor for capitalism

1989

Well-Known Member
social security, EI, federal jobs program which single handedly got america out of the great depression, minimum wage, worker controlled enterprises (coops) instead of capitalist, guaranteed vacation (not in america), government controlled bank of north dakota, public parks, libraries.
How exactly do these worker controlled enterprises work?

Let's say I want to start a glass shop (a simple business, fixing windows and screens). Where do I start?

I'll need to lease a building, I will need maybe 10 cases of glass, mirror, dollies to move the glass, 2 trucks, a few sanders, cutters, 20 cases of tape, 10 buckets of putty, oil, aluminum/vinyl sash, screen, different sizes of screen bar, about 10 different boxes of screen, some lumber, saws, rope, glass cleaner, drills, many, many tools, a couple desks, phones, chairs, a couple large/heavy tables, copier, computers, $50,000 minimum operating capital.

Let's get started, you, me, and 3 of your homies. Let's call it, "Me and RickyB glass" Where do we start? My guess is we will need $200-$250K
 

newfie

Well-Known Member
How exactly do these worker controlled enterprises work?

Let's say I want to start a glass shop (a simple business, fixing windows and screens). Where do I start?

I'll need to lease a building, I will need maybe 10 cases of glass, mirror, dollies to move the glass, 2 trucks, a few sanders, cutters, 20 cases of tape, 10 buckets of putty, oil, aluminum/vinyl sash, screen, different sizes of screen bar, about 10 different boxes of screen, some lumber, saws, rope, glass cleaner, drills, many, many tools, a couple desks, phones, chairs, a couple large/heavy tables, copier, computers, $50,000 minimum operating capital.

Let's get started, you, me, and 3 of your homies. Let's call it, "Me and RickyB glass" Where do we start? My guess is we will need $200-$250K

don't expect an answer that makes sense.
 

rickyb

Well-Known Member
How exactly do these worker controlled enterprises work?

Let's say I want to start a glass shop (a simple business, fixing windows and screens). Where do I start?

I'll need to lease a building, I will need maybe 10 cases of glass, mirror, dollies to move the glass, 2 trucks, a few sanders, cutters, 20 cases of tape, 10 buckets of putty, oil, aluminum/vinyl sash, screen, different sizes of screen bar, about 10 different boxes of screen, some lumber, saws, rope, glass cleaner, drills, many, many tools, a couple desks, phones, chairs, a couple large/heavy tables, copier, computers, $50,000 minimum operating capital.

Let's get started, you, me, and 3 of your homies. Let's call it, "Me and RickyB glass" Where do we start? My guess is we will need $200-$250K
i dunno, i probably should know since im in love with the cooperative economic model as opposed to capitalism.

i was listening to a richard wolff economic update episode and he answered a few of the ways they deal with these problems.

have you ever heard about coops before i mentioned it? if not, you might want to ask yourself how come.

why dont you look it up. type in worker coop and see what you get. the cooperative economic model is gaining traction in america.
 

1989

Well-Known Member
i dunno, i probably should know since im in love with the cooperative economic model as opposed to capitalism.

i was listening to a richard wolff economic update episode and he answered a few of the ways they deal with these problems.

have you ever heard about coops before i mentioned it? if not, you might want to ask yourself how come.

why dont you look it up. type in worker coop and see what you get. the cooperative economic model is gaining traction in america.

I don't like it. Too many chiefs, not enough Indians. They buy in like partners. It's hard enough just having one partner, let alone 5 or more.
Sounds great for someone retiring that needs to sell. To have built in buyers, each paying 1/5 or more of your asking price.....Priceless
 

rickyb

Well-Known Member
I don't like it. Too many chiefs, not enough Indians. They buy in like partners. It's hard enough just having one partner, let alone 5 or more.
Sounds great for someone retiring that needs to sell. To have built in buyers, each paying 1/5 or more of your asking price.....Priceless

im sure your wrong, but anyways in capitalism its hte opposite: to few chiefs and too many indians.

well from what i remember they are statistically more likely to succeed than a capitalist business because the workers actually care about the jobs they work in and own.

mondragon coop in spain is the 7th largest business in the country, it has semi worker control, not sure about hte specifics, and anyways the workers voted that the most the executives can earn is 8x what the lowest paid worker does.

Ceos in america earn 350x the lowest paid worker by comparison.
 

rickyb

Well-Known Member
Capitalism is an enemy of democracy. It denies workers the right to control means of production or determine how the profits from their labor will be spent. American workers—both left and right—do not support trade agreements. They do not support the federal bailouts of big banks and financial firms. They do not embrace astronomical salaries for CEOs or wage stagnation. But workers do not count. And the more working men and women struggle to be heard, the harsher and more violent the forms of control employed by the corporate state will become. - chris hedges
 

1989

Well-Known Member
im sure your wrong, but anyways in capitalism its hte opposite: to few chiefs and too many indians.

well from what i remember they are statistically more likely to succeed than a capitalist business because the workers actually care about the jobs they work in and own.

mondragon coop in spain is the 7th largest business in the country, it has semi worker control, not sure about hte specifics, and anyways the workers voted that the most the executives can earn is 8x what the lowest paid worker does.

Ceos in america earn 350x the lowest paid worker by comparison.
From what I read, the workers have to buy in. Too tough to have 20+ partners.
 

rickyb

Well-Known Member
From what I read, the workers have to buy in. Too tough to have 20+ partners.
no idea, but congrats on being mature enough to look into it. its not a perfect system but its certainly and improvement over capitalism. there are 3rd parties which help workers run their cooperatives.
 

1989

Well-Known Member
no idea, but congrats on being mature enough to look into it. its not a perfect system but its certainly and improvement over capitalism. there are 3rd parties which help workers run their cooperatives.
One of the tribes I've delivered to would give shares to employees on top of their wages. And divy out yearly profits to them. But they had no say in how the company was run. It was more like a bonus.
 

rickyb

Well-Known Member
One of the tribes I've delivered to would give shares to employees on top of their wages. And divy out yearly profits to them. But they had no say in how the company was run. It was more like a bonus.
right, i heard a few years ago alaska was paying citizens for the profits on the oil it owned.
 

newfie

Well-Known Member
no idea, but congrats on being mature enough to look into it. its not a perfect system but its certainly and improvement over capitalism. there are 3rd parties which help workers run their cooperatives.

sound like a commune. I can see your motivation . living in your parents basement has to be tough.
 

rickyb

Well-Known Member
sound like a commune. I can see your motivation . living in your parents basement has to be tough.
its a real one, its not one of these so called socialist systems where the government controls everything like a dictatorship.

guys i listen to dont want the government to control everything, they want worker control.
 

newfie

Well-Known Member
its a real one, its not one of these so called socialist systems where the government controls everything like a dictatorship.

guys i listen to dont want the government to control everything, they want worker control.

what if the worker does not want that control.
 
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