Management Cuts for Teamsters

Discussion in 'UPS Partners' started by BrownSuit, Dec 16, 2007.

  1. BrownSuit

    BrownSuit Guest

    What will be the next management cuts to pay for the increased Teamster Benefits ?....Will the reductions be in pay, benefits, vacations etc...
  2. 705red

    705red Browncafe Steward

    Hopefully less management people!
  3. hangin455

    hangin455 Member

    What makes you make a statement like that?
  4. retired2000

    retired2000 Active Member

    i can not say what the cuts will be my the higher ups and do know one thing though you will not get less hours.
  5. Channahon

    Channahon New Member

    Cost plans are already done for 2008 and staffing is taken into consideration. If staffing cuts are going to be made within an operation or department, your division manager/dept manager knows about them. As far as your concern for reductions in pay, benefits and vacations, I have never in my experience, been told to plan on those kinds of reductions.
  6. beentheredonethat

    beentheredonethat Well-Known Member

    You may be retired now, (I'm not certain), but what do you call the changing of the MIP from 15% of pretax profits to determine the MIP amount to some mysterious calculations (that by the way results in less of an MIP then if we did 15%). I call that a cut to mgmt. Also, for any mgmt that leaves, they leave half the MIP on the table, since it's half now and the other half over a 5 year period. But if you quit you lose the potion not vested. Also in terms of folks leaving, now vaca is prorated, so if you get 4 weeks of vaca and leave on June 30th, you only should have taken 2 weeks. Remember when we started and we had to earn the vacation this year for next years vacation. The first year I worked there were no vacation but I could borrow one from next year. Teamsters get their vacations populated and if they leave shortly after the vacation bank populates they can take it all. I call that a cut. Also as far as reduction in mgmt in the ops, there's way less on roads then there used to be. Maybe that's a good thing, but the problem is we have way fewer supvs as compared to uppper mgmt. Look at the size of our corp hq, there's way too many people there.
  7. JustTired

    JustTired free at last.......

    That's why we work so long and hard. Gotta put fuel in that gravy train.
  8. Channahon

    Channahon New Member


    I left in 2006 and was still working when some of the changes you mentioned were implemented.

    The stock program as it is now, I believe was done for expensing purposes. I'm not a finance person, but as I understood it, if an employee leaves before retirement, the stock lost to that person, can then be taken off the books. Whereas, with division managers stock options, if you left you lost those as well. Is it right with a publicly owned company, I don't know, but I am sure corporate legal and finance researched and made that call.

    As far as earning vacations, if you generally came to work everyday, then no problem. However, with some management going out on stress for extended length of time (sometimes valid, sometimes not, based on employee history), I believe that is why that change was made.

    And no doubt there are way too many people in corporate, hence the buyout, which the only people I knew that took it were within 5 years of retirement. That really didn't pan out as corporate would have liked, so maybe that was a good message for them to receive.

    I also feel there will be changes to the pension plan to mirror the changes made at FedEx earlier this year. There will no longer be a defined benefit program, but an enhanced 401K that will be managed by the employee.

    It's a changing business world out there, and unfortunately, UPS is changing accordingly to stay competitive. Do I like what I'm seeing for the management team, absolutely not. But everyone has a choice, to stay and retire from UPS or pursue other interests, which I think lately, the numbers of UPS management leaving is shameful to UPS.

    Overall, UPS has changed to meet the times, but we are still in business and well respected in the business world. It is sometimes disheartening to see other large companies struggle to stay afloat at the expense of their employees.

    The auto industry is a good example of that. GM just went through negotiations, a minor strike and is now announcing layoffs, that will affect their employees job security.

    Just my thoughts and opinions
    Happy Holidays
  9. JustTired

    JustTired free at last.......

    I agree. But other large companies (one,in particular, comes to mind) are struggling to keep the caviar in the boardroom and the "golden parachute" (or to follow the analogy,"golden lifeboat")next to them..... at the expense of their employees.
  10. Latest rumor is that the will be two less regions soon. This will eliminate a few hundred management jobs.
  11. browniehound

    browniehound Well-Known Member


    My guess is you're a troll because I've never heard of you before. But in case that you're not, here is my reply:

    Why do you assume any management cuts are made to pay for increased teamster benefits? From what I understand, you are paid salary. So if the volume in the center averages 10,000 parcels per day for the month, you still get your monthly salary. If the volume drops to 9,000 pacrels per day, I believe you will still recieve your FULL monthly salary.

    Yet me Mr. Teamster down here at the bottom of the list will have his route cut 1 or 2 days per week. This results in "UNION CUTS" to use your terminology. It adds up to about 1 week salary per month for me.

    Now, I have to worry about my hours to make sure I have enough to recieve my health benefits. Do you have to worry about making enough hours to cover your health insurance?

    I'm sorry to jump down your throat here, but management is cutting teamster benefits every week. Every time you send someone home or cut a route you are making "union" cuts.

    But let me go out on a limb here. You're a sup. in the hub and when the manager tells you to start sending people home you do it without thinking about it. You are there making 60-100 grand per year as a hub management person sending a guy making 8.50 an hour home an hour early to make your numbers so you can get your stock bonus. This hub worker took the 2nd job to get health benefits and to make ends meet, but he can't even make it worth his effort because you are CUTTING his hours. Sound familiar?

    But you don't care, you'll cut his hours and then you'll come on this message board and state:

    "What will be the next management cuts to pay for the increased Teamster Benefits ?....Will the reductions be in pay, benefits, vacations etc"

    Management makes cuts in teamster benefits everyday of every week in every year of their operation. If I were you, I would realize this and not whine about it!
  12. longlunchguy

    longlunchguy Runnin on Empty

    Maybe there will be less brown suits:surprised:
  13. trplnkl

    trplnkl 555

    I haven't heard of any planned management cuts but then I am just a grunt in a brown uniform.Most of the time I don't KNOW of a cut back till it's been done for months, then I learn that's why so-in-so isn't around anymore.
    For those that are rejoicing over such cuts need to think that out a little more. As it is now the hourly people can't get oc sups to do things that we need done. Simple stuff like ordering replacement uniforms, keeping needed supplies readily available, fixing the trace on our areas, etc. etc. etc. This is not a situation of the sups going to the golf course, or taking a two hour lunch. They are running themselves into pools of butter to get reports filled out/ filled because some corporate dumb butt has to justify their own existence in the company. When I started diving our management team had 15 drivers to a group, this gave them the ability to get out the reports to district office, do their safety rides (which was when the sups found out what changes really needed to be made on the trace), and a bond of trust (or not) could be established to make everyones workday much better. Today, each OCS has 35-40 drivers and probably twice as many worthless reports. This crap can't be much fun. In our building all OCS have to be at work no later than 6:00, most evenings at least one, sometimes two are still the at 19:00 or 20:00. It's the OCS that do the dispatch everyday, I still haven't figured out why we need that full time worthless, can't do anything without OCS telling her what to do preload sup. (she does have a nice badonkadonk though.) I digress.
    My point is that we don't need less ocs, we need less corporate ax kissers that serve no purpose but to sponge off the people that make this company great. It's a fact that the closer to the customer an employee is the bigger the influence they have on this company's success.
  14. nhguy

    nhguy New Member

    Many of you bring out some valid points. I can tell you from my attendance in some focus groups that the company has a major concern of how to make the full time supervisors job more appealing. They are not getting candidates and in our region they are trying to get the sups to hype up the benefits of joining management.
    There will be a major flux of baby boomers leaving UPS in the near future and it is my feeling that many will not be replaced. They will continue to put more and more responsibility on the center manager level.

    When the region manager has to sit in a focus group with every manager and supervisor to hear the concerns and to ask what can be done to make things better, it clearly tells me that we are heading towards a crisis.

    With regards to changing the pension, it is my belief that this would be a kiss of death to UPS. Young people who are frustrated and unhappy, will now be able to take their 401 funds with them and move on. Put $200,000 into a guys 401k and if he's 35-45, he might not feel he has to stay.

    I am expecting lots of changes with this new CEO taking over. I think we'll all find out in the next few months where all these rumors stand!

    Rmember the big fish always eats the little one's.
  16. For someone who's been with the company 20+ years the present value of their pension would be considerably more than $200k. If that's all the company plans to pay I'd expect to see an IBM style lawsuit very quickly.
  17. nhguy

    nhguy New Member

    Boiled Frog,

    Here is an example of what type of money might be put into a pension buyout.
    Assume a person is retiring with 25 years of service and they are age 55 when they retire. I am also going to assume that the money gets 5% interest a year. The other assumption is that the pension they will recieve is $30,000 planned to be paid for 25 years (till age 80).

    You would need to recieve $400,000 to make it to age 80. All of the money would be completely exhausted at year 25. The pensions are not designed to pay out over 25 years and at the end of the 25th year to still have the total principal balance left. It is a declining balance that exhaust itself over some time period. I also think that is why so few took the buyout offered last year.

    I know the formula that is rumored out there, but, I would be shocked if that's how they calculated it out. Remember any change they make will ultimately result in a hugh windfall for the company.

    If you want to get a real idea and if your a mathametician, calculate out the two formulas they use in the pension book and I think you'll see that the dollars are much smaller than the formula rumored to be out there.

    I think we'll all know soon.

    Remember the big fish always eats the little one's!!