Management is taking issue with my being overallowed.

Discussion in 'UPS Union Issues' started by V and H, Dec 19, 2015.

  1. V and H

    V and H Member

    I came here to read about this issue because I thought there would already be a thread on this. I searched "overallowed" and read most of the info. Here is my story:

    I have worked at UPS over 20 years with the last 18 years as a full time driver. When I started out I was a runner gunner, but I had about 7 accidents my first 10 years, so for the last 10+ years I have made it a point to do everything by the methods 100% of the time. Lately, with peak and the fact that I do Early AMs, I have been running out of hours come Friday. Managements idea to fix it is to:
    (1) blame my running out of hours on the fact that I run overallowed an average of 1.50 hours per day on my average paid day of 12 hours,
    (2) tell me not to come in to do EAMs on Friday in order to have enough hours to do my bid route,
    (3) send me out on a split route anyway while a driver with less seniority does my bid route.

    I have talked to the union before and the clear result was that I could do EAMs as long as I wanted (which is until I retire), seniority allowing. Currently, all the other EAM drivers are new hires.

    Management is under pressure to get the work dispatched and make their production numbers. My bid route is in a town 25 minutes away from the center so that presents a challenge to them. My idea is for them to budget my hours to 12 hours per day so that Friday is just another day; this can definitely be done, but Mon-Thurs they are just trying to worry about those days.

    The issue of me being allowed to do EAMs and my bid route will be a slam dunk, but the center manager will be offended if I file a grievance. He could retaliate in some way.

    So can I get in trouble for running overallowed when I drive very safely (in treacherous country, by the way) and work safely ALL THE TIME? I am so careful to use all the methods no matter what. Should I start taking shortcuts or start driving a bit faster? What shortcuts would not threaten my job security?

    Of course, we have young drivers who come in early and set up the loads on their own time, drive like maniacs, sign for business packages themselves, leave packages at the mailbox, etc. and the management seems to be pleased with them because they bonus.

    At one point my BA said "just do everything right all the time and you'll never have to look over your shoulder". I followed this advice to the letter and now management is not honoring my seniority and creating the narrative that I am a slug. I have other drivers telling me "They are mad at you because you are running over".

    The center manager has told me that he does not like the idea of me doing EAMs because my route is far away from the center, but a mindful effort in dispatch planning would easily fix this and the adjustment wouldn't add any cost to the company.

    If I stopped doing EAMs, my replacement would be a new hire earning half the hourly rate.

    At one point, management did a production ride and I ran .65 and 1.49 hours over the first two days. They discontinued the production ride at that point and now they "cannot speak to the time study".
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2015
  2. clean hairy

    clean hairy Well-Known Member

    Been driving 18 yrs, and they never had a problem with you, but now they do?
    I would think a grievance citing past practice might work, and perhaps harassment as well would work, have to wait and see what others say...
    I do not see how they have a leg to stand on since they want you meet their made up dispatch numbers....
     
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  3. UpstateNYUPSer

    UpstateNYUPSer Very proud grandfather.

    It is not unusual for a new manager to target veteran drivers who are consistently over allowed.
     
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  4. Funfact

    Funfact Well-Known Member

    At some point your were producing good numbers on that route. Then you started to slack off whether that met you started working by the methods or just plain slacking off to prove a point is anyone guess. But sense you produced good numbers at one point you screwed yourself. You say you have been driving for UPS for 18 years and this is the first time you have had this problem ???? Something doesn't seem right. Your options are to file a grievance or not to your choice but they aren't going to retaliate if you file people file grievance all the time. Again you been with UPS 20 years 18 driving and your scared to file a grievance ????
     
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  5. clean hairy

    clean hairy Well-Known Member

    I would guess they did something along the lines of adding say, 10 more stops, then claim his route should take 30 min less. Wouldn't put it past them, still though, it is all made up numbers in a perfect world, not the real world.
     
  6. V and H

    V and H Member

    This is a new bid route for me. My most recent route I averaged 1.00 hours over on an average 11.5 hour paid day.

    When I started driving, I would bonus 1.50+ hours every day. After about 5 years and about 5 accidents, I started driving safely and taking a lot less shortcuts. At that point, I ran scratch because that route had a good time study.

    This new rural route that I have has a poor time study, and the fill in drivers run the route off:
    (1) come in early and tighten up the load on their own time,
    (2) drive as fast as humanly possible,
    (3) leave packages in mailboxes and behind gates at the road, and
    (4) probably sign for the customers, don't ring doorbells or leave out notices, etc.
    (5) leave their garbage in the car.
    These runner gunners still run a little over when they run the route off as much as humanly possible. They are also half my age and weight.

    Doing the EAMs probably doesn't help my numbers because I am driving across town in rush hour traffic in order to deliver 1-3 stops in an hour.

    The way I work now is:
    (1) I don't start working until start time,
    (2) I take zero shortcuts and drive like a driving instructor,
    (3) I work through my paid 15 and 10 minute breaks (to give them the benefit of a doubt),
    (4) I take no lunch or a lunch at the very end (after bringing in my pickups). After I punch out, I empty my garbage can and do all the little things to get ready for the next day.

    I feel like the bottom line is that I am driving and working exactly as they trained me, and I am being made to look slow because of some runner gunner cover drivers and the fact that the time study is off, particularly when you factor in the hour spent doing EAM work.

    All this is occurring in order to discourage me from doing EAMs. They want lower paid drivers (or at least drivers who work near the center) to do the EAMs. There is clearly identifiable pressure to get me to speed up somehow. The only way I could do this is drive faster, run and/or take shortcuts.
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2015
  7. 728ups

    728ups offending people on the internet since 1995

    If you are working safely and by the methods all they can do is follow and observe you in the hopes of catching you goofing off( if you are nt wave at them or call the poice and tell them you are being followed) ,or try and intimidate you by giving you a 3 day OJS.
    Dont acknowledge past performance or previous numbers,and dont sweat current numbers. If you are doing the job right they can pound sand. They will try and intimidate you so you will need to grow a pair and file whenever they harass you
     
  8. V and H

    V and H Member

    I definitely never goof off. If they followed me, they would just see a driver working and driving safely. A 3 day production ride is not intimidating. Like I said, I recently had the first 2 days of an aborted 3 day OJS and the supe just saw all the delays not in any time study, including horrendous road construction delays, a load of unimaginably poor quality, and 8 misroutes in 2 days. Maybe that's why they stopped the production ride. Note that I am still learning this route (i.e. searching for addresses).

    At one point on that production ride, I had some flowers for an old folks community with no unit number on it. He said sheet it as "Need Apt" and I wanted to take it to the office because it was perishable. I insisted on taking it to the office, which I did.

    BTW can I get in any trouble at work for posting this stuff on here? It is all factual.

    Also, I only file grievances as a last resort. It is only when they refuse to honor my seniority. The management team we have is intelligent and as reasonable as they can be considering all the pressure they are under from their superiors. The DM and his boss expect perfection and really push performance.
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2015
  9. 10 point

    10 point Well-Known Member

    Do the job by the methods.
    Remember what your BA said?
    Get over the fear factor.
    Settle it in your mind today.
     
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  10. V and H

    V and H Member

    I think that the best solution is, in fact, to continue working and driving safely, using all the methods.

    It would seem that the center manager is under so much pressure from the DM that he is trying to intimidate me into driving faster, running and/or taking shortcuts. This would all go very well until something goes wrong, and then it would be on me for not working as directed.

    This seems to be how management operates, in a nutshell. Have a perfect safety and service record, using all of the hundreds of methods at every turn. Oh, and meet our optimistic goals that came from some IE goon in a cubicle strung out on brown Kool-Aid. The only way that I could accomplish this is by coding in for a lunch and continuing to work. But this is not allowed.

    Are there any shortcuts that are okay? Really the only one I can think of is working off the clock.
     
  11. Brown_Star

    Brown_Star Methods Man

    file a grievance for harassment ... Been working at ups for 20 hrs hence 20 years older....keep doing what your doing...follow corporate methods to the letter.
     
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  12. hyena

    hyena I shut down BC

    Their words Safety , Service , and Performance in that order. No shortcuts are ok. Remember no one gets fired for just doing their job
     
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  13. 728ups

    728ups offending people on the internet since 1995

    THIS is why they are trying to run over you. FILE every day if need be.Management are like Schoolyard Bullies and if you bury them in paper and show them you arent afraid to fight back they find easier targets.Tell them you dont give a Rats Arse about their farking made up numbers and go do your job.
    After 20 years you should know that NOTHING you ever do will be good enough
     
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  14. Monkey Butt

    Monkey Butt You can call me Chappy Staff Member

    Yeah, they tend to do that!
     
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  15. Lead Belly

    Lead Belly BANNED

    Yea he should know but how many after 20 years surely don't?
     
  16. V and H

    V and H Member

    This is what I thought. They must have slipped some brown Kool-Aid in my eggnog.

    I always try to see things from all sides, and I know the pressure these guys are under from the new DM and his new boss (Regional Manager? I don't know). The center is in a smaller city so to a certain extent we try to work stuff out between ourselves before bringing in the BA.

    Aren't they just doing their job by trying to get me to hustle more? The center manager said "I need you to kick it up a notch". And I tried. I hit my nose really hard on a package after about three minutes. I realized that I had already been working my max safe speed.

    And when I tried to drive faster it seemed like I might lose traction and slide off the road (a lot of steep cliffs on my route). A friend joked that me driving off a cliff would solve their problem of me being a "slug" (to quote my runner gunner loop mate). Maybe I should drive as fast as possible on the straight roads.

    Maybe I could get them to bring the time study a little closer to reality. Any tips for my imminent 3 day production ride other than the obvious "work as directed"?
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2015
  17. 728ups

    728ups offending people on the internet since 1995

    During your ride work safely,by the methods. Keep notes if they help,take pick ups off you or massage your load.
    At all of your stops introduce your supervisor by name, and advise your customers if they have any problems to address NOW is the time for that as your supe is The manto talk to.

    Dont sweat it
     
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  18. 10 point

    10 point Well-Known Member

    The reason you are being pushed is obvious from your posts.

    You worry about too much and...
    You're pushable.
     
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  19. jumpman23

    jumpman23 Oh Yeah

    Come on dude youve been there that long and your worried about how u look on that fakeasczz piece of paper with their fake numbers? Youve been in the game too long son to worry about that BS. They cant do anything to you as long as your doing the job by the book. Tell them to ride with you then and the supe is not touching any packages and your taking your lunch at 1 or 2pm. That usually shuts them right up and tell them if they dont quit riding your butt about over allowed youll file a grievance or call Department of Labor or call OSHA n file a complaint with them over harassment. Bet they dont mess with ya after that lol. I have the OSHA number on my phone just in case they super pisczz me off at all.
     
  20. hyena

    hyena I shut down BC

    Stfu
     
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