Managemnt screw up. No warning letter?

hubrat

Squeaky Wheel
You are the real crook. The IE department steals from drivers every single day of the week and are essentially the sole cause of production harassment across the nation. The IE department is nothing but a bunch of criminals who are paid to legally steal from drivers in a very transparent manner through a series of payroll deduction scams.

IMO he's just a sucker like the rest of us. They develop/implement products designed to give the company an advantage, which unfortunately takes advantage of the rest of us. He is doing the job he's instructed to do. The entire situation could be much more fair, but the pigs at the top don't care about fair.
 

UnconTROLLed

perfection
IMO he's just a sucker like the rest of us. They develop/implement products designed to give the company an advantage, which unfortunately takes advantage of the rest of us. He is doing the job he's instructed to do. The entire situation could be much more fair, but the pigs at the top don't care about fair.

All is fair in love and war...you choose which applies..;)
 

UnconTROLLed

perfection
UPS upper-management use the same "endless reports" approach when it comes to what lower management "accomplishes", the same way the CMs and on-cars run one billion reports a day? I guess it is just one big train of WTF right down the line?
 

brownIEman

Well-Known Member
You are the real crook. The IE department steals from drivers every single day of the week and are essentially the sole cause of production harassment across the nation. The IE department is nothing but a bunch of criminals who are paid to legally steal from drivers in a very transparent manner through a series of payroll deduction scams.

Why stop at crook, Griff. Don't forget I torture baby kittens and roast babies in my apple wood smoker on the weekends... MMMMMM, yum.

Oh, and push old ladies in the mud just for fun every chance I get.



Do you feel better about yourself now?
 

soberups

Pees in the brown Koolaid
Why stop at crook, Griff. Don't forget I torture baby kittens and roast babies in my apple wood smoker on the weekends... MMMMMM, yum.

Oh, and push old ladies in the mud just for fun every chance I get.



Do you feel better about yourself now?


I would not go so far as to call those in the IE department criminals.

I will say that 95% of the problems we face as a company today stem directly from the utterly ridiculous expectations that are placed upon us by those who supposedly "timestudy" the work we do.

The nice part about being in IE is the total lack of any sort of accountability. You design equipment that you will never have to use yourself. You design facilities that you will never have to work in yourself. You implement "time standards" for work that you will never have to do yourself. Your edicts are final, they are indisputable, they are chiseled in stone and can never be challenged or corrected no matter how divorced from reality they might be. You are never wrong, and if you are wrong it is going to be somebody elses problem, not yours.

We tend to do a much better job making the bed if we know that we are going to have to lay in it. Perhaps the day will come when IE learns this lesson for itself.
 

brownIEman

Well-Known Member
The title of this thread is "Management screw-up. No warning letter"

The "standards" I refer to are job performance standards, and have nothing to do with honesty or lack thereof.

Nowhere in this thread is willful dishonesty mentioned,

Not true actually, worthlessdrivers post on the first page of this thread is about almost nothing but willful dishonesty.


and nowhere in the thread do I make the claim that "all management are crooks". I am referring only to the blatant double standard that exists at UPS regarding personal responsibility for mistakes. As a management person, you can sweep your screwups under the rug or shift the responsibility for them to another part of the operation. As an hourly, I can't.

I can sorta see where you are coming from, I did interpret it a different way, my apologies.
You are however worked up over an apples to oranges comparison.
You say as an hourly you cannot sweep your screw ups under the rug. I have known drivers to do this very thing. I have also known them to get fired for trying. I have known management who have swept stuff under the rug, and known them to get fired for trying. Based on my experiences, I disagree with that part of your statement.

As for shifting responsibility to another part of the operation you are likely correct. It is difficult or impossible due to the nature of your work, for you to blame other hourlies for any screw up you might do.
Management is a completely different perspective. I am not responsible in my operation for 100 or so stops and 200 or so packages every day. I and my fellow sups are collectively responsible for around 20,000 stops and 45,000 packages a day. If one of my fellow sups screws up and we wind up with a bunch of service failures, guess what, I get written up as well. When was the last time you were written up because a brother teamster missed a pickup? From a production standpoint, I am responsible for my own actions, and the actions of my fellow sups, and the action of the hourlies that report to us. If they fail, we share in the discipline that results from that failure.

soberups said:
As a driver, If I misdeliver 2 packages per day, every day...I will be issued a warning letter within a few days, suspended within a week or two, and terminated soon after if I do not immediately correct my problem.

But are similar consequences imposed upon the IE man who screws up multiple timestudies.... or the operations manager who fails to accurately forecast volume to the extent that the dispatch fails and dozens if not hundreds of stops are missed? No.

Yes. The IE man who screws up multiple time studies will be removed from his position. As for the ops manager, I cannot believe you are comparing mis-delivering packages on your car, in your area of knowledge repeatedly, with not being able to accurately predict the future, but what the hell, I will bite.
In your case, let us say you mis deliver 2 out of 100 stops. That is 2% failure rate. If you do it repeatedly, yes, you will face discipline. So lets say the ops manager fails to accurately predict the future, screws it up badly, and say results in 900 service failures. That is a ton. That is also the same 2% you did on 45,000 pieces. And yes, if he screws up that badly repeatedly, he will be removed from his job.
 
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