need alittle help quick

Discussion in 'UPS Union Issues' started by benkicked, Jul 12, 2009.

  1. benkicked

    benkicked New Member

    I am a 13yr employee 7 as a coverage driver. Friday my DRV sup questioned me about backing into someones gate then not reporting it.
    I have only had 1 accident back in "04" a hit while parked. After the questions from him my center manager catches me and tells me someone sent a letter to corperate in atlanta. I am 99.9% sure i did no such thing.
    Heres where i need alittle help. My local 7 (on vacation...) and both of my union stewards retired 3 and 2 mounths ago. Leaving us alittle short on help. We do not have telemetrics yet, but the boss said that the GPS could show what happened? Is that real ? What should i be expecting?
     
  2. UpstateNYUPSer

    UpstateNYUPSer Very proud grandfather.

    UPS mgt hates surprises, especially when those surprises come from Atlanta.

    I have to tell you I sense a note of uncertainty in your post. Were you working the day in question and, if yes, were you at the address in question? If also yes, were you the only driver in that area on that day? Have you seen the damage to the gate? If so, does the damage appear as though it could have been done by your pkg car? Was there any damage to your pkg car? Were there any witnesses?

    You said that your Local 7 is on vacation. I assume that to be your BA. Unfortunately, UPS is not going to wait until he/she comes back before disciplining you. Make sure that you bring another hourly in with you to the meeting and make sure you get copies of all paperwork so that you can present your case to the BA.

    This should serve as a wake up call for the rest of us to report accidents immediately to your mgt team, no matter how big or small. As I said, they hate surprises.
     
  3. helenofcalifornia

    helenofcalifornia Well-Known Member

    Did the letter to Atlanta indicate that they were witnesses to this accident? Did they have other witnesses? What was the extent of the damage to the fence?
     
  4. Funfact

    Funfact Well-Known Member

    I'm assumming you didn't hit the gate ????? If you didn't hit the gate then makes sure get print out of your stops that day they said the gate got hit. Find out when they say the gate got hit and then find out where your where at that time. Then I'd go by the place and take pictures of the gate and see if the damaged is even consistant with a package car hitting it. I get as much info on the accident they said you caused so you can defend yourself with physical evidence not just I didn't do it.

    If they call you in the office and there isn't a steward there then ask a driver with alot of time to go in with you.
     
  5. JonFrum

    JonFrum Member

    Benkicked,

    GPS isn't very accurate and certainly can't establish that you hit a gate, or anything else. Have your Union determine exactly how inaccurate it is and please post the results so the rest of us will know.

    Unlike Upstate, I don't detect any uncertainty in your post. I assume you have no memory of hitting any gate, but acknowledge that it is theoretically possible that you may have hit it unknowingly. All drivers of trucks have that 0.01% possibility. That doesn't mean you are "displaying consiousness of guilt," as they say on the TV crime dramas.

    Don't bring an "hourly" into the office with you unless you have complete confidence in the individual. If you just grab someone who is available, you may get someone like Upstate, and loose the battle right there.:wink2:

    Never just assume the complaining customer is right and has the best of motives. Don't let management assume that either.

    Be aware of this language in the Contract . . .
    Check your Supplement for language on discipline, etc.
     
  6. cachsux

    cachsux Wah

    It seems funny that in todays day and age that someone would send a letter to Atlanta. Phone,e-mail yes,but a letter? On the offhand chance I would not say I didn`t do it,I would say I have no recollection of it or anything out of the ordinary that day.
    As advised above make sure you were even there that day. I was accused of knocking a tree limb off on a route i was swinging in pkg. While it turns out did deliver there I had walked the pkg off because of the low trees. Turns out AmVets was also there after me to pickup a donation bag and had blasted down the drive in a cube van. The fact of the matter was while the Diad showed I was there I didn`t remember the actual house until I saw pics,then I was able to recall the walk off.
     
  7. soberups

    soberups Pees in the brown Koolaid

    Dont volunteer any information. If you dont remember hitting the gate, you dont remember hitting the gate. If they want to fire you for failure to report an accident, they have to prove that you knew about it. You have a golden opportunity here to keep your mouth shut, I suggest you make the most of it. Something to remember here is that your management may very well be lying to you about "someone calling Atlanta", they might just be trying to scare you in order to get you to fill in the blanks for them. Also remember that they will frequently ask you questions that they already know the answers to in order to trick you into lying. You really are better off saying as little as possible.

    We have had two guys fired here for failing to report an accident. One of them caved in the side of someone's garage and drove away. There were witnesses, and the damage was extensive enough that there was no way the driver could deny being aware of the accident. His case never even made it to panel. The other guy was a situation similar to what you described; there really wasnt any damage, the fence he hit was out in the country and covered with vegetation, and he was returned to work with back pay.
     
  8. Baba gounj

    Baba gounj pensioner

    Had a driver once return to the building with a large tree branch rammed completely thru the top of the cab, claimed he did not know how that happened, and they continued to let him drive.
    :happy-very:
     
  9. UpstateNYUPSer

    UpstateNYUPSer Very proud grandfather.

    JonFrum, I would like to first congratulate you on your nomination for the "Cut and Paste Award" here on Brown Cafe. It is an honor that you have certainly earned.

    Now, I'd like to address a few of your comments:

    First, I did detect uncertainty in his story, as though he were not telling us the whole story. Whether this was intentional on his part or whether he actually did not realize that he may indeed have hit the fence is key.

    Second, I suggested bringing another hourly in to the office with him, not for the purpose of defending or intervening on his behalf, but simply to sit there and listen, to make sure that what was said in that meeting was properly relayed to the BA. Contrary to what you may think, I do have the ability to sit and be quiet for an extended period of time and I am a pretty good listener.

    Good luck in your future cut and paste endeavors. Dave.
     
  10. bubsdad

    bubsdad "Hang in there!"

    In January '08 we had a feeder driver that left a CPU and at the intersection about 1/2 mile down the road came close to hitting the guard rail on a right turn. He knew he wasn't going to make the turn so he stopped, backed up and swung it wider. A DHL package driver was leaving the customer and saw him readjust and continue on. DHL driver called police and said he hit the guard rail. He got back to the building and the feeder manager, safety guy and a shifter took the trailer to the shop and went over it with a fine toothed comb. Not a mark, not even a scuffed tire. Driver told them exactly what happened. Didn't matter. Supposed witness' word was taken. Driver fired. Deadlocked locally, fired at state panel.
     
  11. benkicked

    benkicked New Member

    I was working that day. I did deliver to that address, but according to the "letter"
    i backed (blind side) 250 yrds up a very curvy hilled driveway. The customer did take 2 pictures, 1 broken 1 fixed. Now my DRV sup and center manager did go out and take pictures but it was repaired already, total damage clained was $20 to $35.
    (update)
    monday 8:15am
    I was terminated and told to file a greivence with the union.
    I did take another hourly with me into the office.
    possible good news - they told me to keep my uniforms for now untill the hearing.
     
  12. benkicked

    benkicked New Member

    there was no witness. you can not see the gate from the house. when i met the customer at the house she asked me why i didnt pull in. I told her it was to unsafe to risk it.
     
  13. JonFrum

    JonFrum Member

    Benkicked, do you have a copy of the customer's complaint letter?

    Does the customer claim she saw you hit the gate, or is she just assuming it must have been you?

    What specific reason(s) did they give for terminating you? Getting in the accident? Not reporting it? Lieing about it? Or what?

    Wouldn't the fact that we now have backup cameras make such accidents less likely? How does UPS claim you managed to hit the gate despite the backup camera and two mirrors?

    All this for an accident that, if it happened, cost less than $35!!! There's a reason they call them accidents.
     
  14. cachsux

    cachsux Wah

    In the old days they were called incidents. Scuff a mailbox,bump over a landscaping stone,the minor stuff. Usually the ctr would let the driver take care of it as long as there was no complaint and it didn`t count against your record.
     
  15. benkicked

    benkicked New Member

    i have a copy of the letter but the union VP has it.
    Terminated for failure to report accident.
    Customer didnt witness.
    They are upset because she sent a letter to atlanta HQ(6/4/09)
    DRV sup claims measurements match up .....but they repaired it in june.
    We just got the letter 7/10/09.
    this letter got to my center
     
  16. UpstateNYUPSer

    UpstateNYUPSer Very proud grandfather.

    Mgt hates surprises.

    It sounds as though you may have a week or two off to think about it.

    I sincerely hope things work out for you. Dave.
     
  17. rod

    rod retired and happy

    Anyone old enough to still be sending "letters" probably backed into the gate herself ---- among other things.
     
  18. City Driver

    City Driver New Member

    that aint really even fair cuz we dont have a trailer in our fleet thats not scratched, dented, dinged or damaged in some other way
     
  19. some1else

    some1else Active Member

    that aint really even fair cuz we dont have a trailer in our fleet thats not scratched, dented, dinged or damaged in some other way//

    but all that damage is noted on the pre-trip every morning and noted / signed/dated+time by a sup
     
  20. MonavieLeaker

    MonavieLeaker Bringin Teh_Lulz

    Lulz