New GPS Time Study: What they are not telling you

[2years2go]

Laguna Brown, here is how it is done. Each Stop is classified as a building type by the drivers. Each building type is given a time value based on the average time value that was determined for that building type from 1000's of previous physical time studies of the same building types. On top of the building classification time value they will measure the distance from the middle of the road to the front of each home / address that you go to. This distance is given a time value based on what times were generated walking to those type homes - some to front , some to back, some to garage, some to porch. This distance time is added to the building classification time to generate the average allowed time for each stop as it is measured. All the stops are measured in a given unit (portion of a loop) and then the time is added up and divided by the number of stops that were measured to get an average stop allowance for that unit. That average allowance will be given to every future stop in that unit. On top of the stop allowance, there is a package allowance that gives an average time to select,unload and record each package. That average time includes rear door select, bulkhead select, select from a 2 wheeler and 4 wheeler.

On top of all of this there is travel time given. This is based on the average min it takes to drive each mile on the route. Travel takes into consideration the "average" delays, congestion, traffic of specific areas by providing minutes per mile that best fit each route based on it's characteristics. The characteristics are driven by the density of stops and volume versus the number of miles driven. In other words, if a driver has high miles and few stops and pkgs, the "min per mile" given are typically less than someone with low miles but significantly high stops and volume.

So it doesn't matter where you record, how fast you walk, how fast you drive, where you deliver to, how many trips you make. The goal is to measure the area not the driver. The measurement determines how much work exists, not how hard the driver is working. It is no longer called a "time study" is is now called 'On road Work Measurement" or ORWM for short. You can have the best methods driver in the world or the poorest methods driver in the world on a route and the measurement will come out the same.

 

[LagunaBrown]

Thanks for the info but what measurable distance from the street.......Is that pulled from the same day as your stop classification report? Why can no one provide this information if it is true? Was Bing or Google maps used to gauge the distance to the delivery stop? How much man power would it take to make sure the points are correct?

 

[FracusBrown]

Laguna Brown, here is how it is done. Each Stop is classified as a building type by the drivers. Each building type is given a time value based on the average time value that was determined for that building type from 1000's of previous physical time studies of the same building types. On top of the building classification time value they will measure the distance from the middle of the road to the front of each home / address that you go to. This distance is given a time value based on what times were generated walking to those type homes - some to front , some to back, some to garage, some to porch. This distance time is added to the building classification time to generate the average allowed time for each stop as it is measured. All the stops are measured in a given unit (portion of a loop) and then the time is added up and divided by the number of stops that were measured to get an average stop allowance for that unit. That average allowance will be given to every future stop in that unit. On top of the stop allowance, there is a package allowance that gives an average time to select,unload and record each package. That average time includes rear door select, bulkhead select, select from a 2 wheeler and 4 wheeler.

On top of all of this there is travel time given. This is based on the average min it takes to drive each mile on the route. Travel takes into consideration the "average" delays, congestion, traffic of specific areas by providing minutes per mile that best fit each route based on it's characteristics. The characteristics are driven by the density of stops and volume versus the number of miles driven. In other words, if a driver has high miles and few stops and pkgs, the "min per mile" given are typically less than someone with low miles but significantly high stops and volume.

So it doesn't matter where you record, how fast you walk, how fast you drive, where you deliver to, how many trips you make. The goal is to measure the area not the driver. The measurement determines how much work exists, not how hard the driver is working. It is no longer called a "time study" is is now called 'On road Work Measurement" or ORWM for short. You can have the best methods driver in the world or the poorest methods driver in the world on a route and the measurement will come out the same.

Nice explanation. Too bad it will likely be ignored or misinterpreted by those with their own opinion or perception. I learned long ago that the facts are only as good as others understanding and acceptance of them.

Some of the most well demonstrated and proven facts are widely disputed by the American public. Many of the posts on this forum clearly demonstrate this theory.

 

[LagunaBrown]

Well we can all vouch there are still glitches with pal labels so if you really think virtual time studies are flawless then those I.E guys should work for N.A.S.A. and not U.P.S.

 

[2years2go]

I believe Microsoft Map Point is being used. Very similar to Google Earth. Yes they use the same day as your stop classification report. To measure the distances, a tool is provided within the software that will measure the distance between any two points. The person developing the measurement will take each of your residential stops, locate them on the map, click at the center of the street and then at the front of the house. The distance is measured by those two clicks. I would estimate that someone skilled at doing this can work through a drivers day in about 1 to 2 hours. ( Keep in mind, when UPS used to do time studies on road, the walk distances were much less accurate. walks were broken down into class 1,2,3,4,5. I don't exactly remember the breakdown, but a 3 walk was like any distance 50-100 feet. The observer would estimate the walk distance based on the average length of their paces and then classified them. You got the same amount of time for a 50 ft distance as a 99 ft distance.)

 

[LagunaBrown]

Thank you again with that information but when time is gained it is subject to scrutiny. I have yet to see a time study that lost time reviewed as hard. We have requested to review those points with the drivers to verify validity as in the west the union can review the bonus plan. I think everyone can agree whatever the allowances the input of information must be accurate. As you can guess nothing has been provided as proof and overallowed drivers get harassment daily. My issue is not the numbers but the standard. Unsafe standards jeprodize driver and public safety.-

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

Well we can all vouch there are still glitches with pal labels so if you really think virtual time studies are flawless then those I.E guys should work for N.A.S.A. and not U.P.S.

The only glitch we have with PAL labels is when the SPA guy gets out of synch. We know the preloader is supposed to compare the PAL with the address label but...

 

[stucrew]

Time allowed for folding in the mirror: none.
Time allowed for putting out a cone; none.
Time allowed for putting the package in a bag to keep it dry; none.
Time allowed for locating an out-of-sight, dry location to release package; none.
Time allowed for walking around the car to make sure the kid you saw behind you isnt hiding someplace; none.
Time allowed for getting out to check clearance when forced to back up in an unfamiliar location; none.
Time allowed for going back to change the delivery notices you left at 4 different apartments because you tried to indirect and the manager was out to lunch; none.
Time allowed for making 3 indirect delivery attempts on a signature required package; none.
Time allowed for making 2 or 3 dozen 8-point turnarounds because your non-power steering pkg car has the turning radius of an aircraft carrier; none.
Time allowed for driving 5 miles uphill in 2nd gear at 11 MPH because your non power-steering pkg car is so underpowered that it cant get out of its own way; none.
Time allowed for bagging smalls; none.
Time allowed for correcting invoice errors on an international shipment; none.
Time allowed for applying highlight tape to all 6 sides of an over-70 lb package; none.
Time allowed for waiting for a customer to fill out ASD's and waybills for an on-call air; none.
Time allowed for waiting for a customer to finish printing the online end-of-day report to scan; none.
Time allowed for sorting and re-handling the 40 stops that you are sent to take off of an overdispatched driver; none.
Time allowed for looking in a map book in an unfamiliar area; none.
Time allowed for verifying the address on a house that doesnt have a visible number; none.
Time allowed for sorting your load when preload forces 400 packages into your P-800; none.
Time allowed for reading and responding to text messages in the DIAD from the center; none.

In I.E. world, none of these things are necessary so there is no need to allow any time for them.
In I.E. world, all the allowances are fair and realistic, and every day is sunshine and lollypops.

Isnt I.E. world a lovely place?

Hey sober, I see you have delivered my route

And remember the job is so easy now because of 'ED' that we don't really need time to do the job anyways. And we are so lucky that UPS smiled on us and gave us a job.

 

[stucrew]

Originally Posted by freecarry88
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As I recall, you are correct. All they are doing is trying to measure walk distances. They look at a satellite image and put a mark at the car park location and at the delivery location. The distance between them is walk distance. They will look at the GPS reading of Scan, Sig, Stop Complete to see where you were and then move the points. (I honestly don't remember if they use the DIAD 1 second readings or not.) The key is that they move the points to reflect where you park and walk to. It may be worth asking the local IE guy to show you. Its really a very nice system. P-Man
They are not actually marking the true walk path like the timestudies of a few years ago. It is straight line to front door from midpoint of the street/road. There is a factor that compensates for the obvious difference, based on class of walk 1,2, etc.... Interestingly enough, the per package allowance on both pickup and delivery is partially based on size of package car (P500 has different allowance than P1200). Most centers that I have known of gain. This all might be moot if we truly go to a P&L model at the center level. We may find out some of the things we thought were so important may not be. I personally cannot think of a better way to measure a service providers efficiency than some combination of SPORH, NDPPH, and Ov/UN.

Pressure and lying, isn't the model already in place?

LMAO, when I read this one

 

[stucrew]

If in the situation you mention, the two routes have the same load quality, same quality of dispatch, same quality of trace, same amount of missorts, etc., then there is something wrong with the time study.

From my experience, those things I mentioned (which are out of the drivers' control) are the biggest factor in overallowed.

A manger that manages only by overallowed, is the problem....

P-Man

We have a lot of problems at UPS

 

[stucrew]

Why doesn't the company take the initiative and show the Union how it works? Why doesn't the company show the drivers how it works? In one post your saying that it is 95% correct 95% of the time, given that kind of figure I again ask if this thing is the fair, honest, bastion of scientific accuracy that you make it out to be, then why can't we see the equation?

One could very easily boil all of your posts about this subject to two simple words: "trust me".[/QUOTE]

If "trust me" is the message you got, that was not my intent.

My message is "learn the facts".

I 100% agree that the union should learn ALL the facts around time study. If you read all my posts on this, I have said that the new program is great because the results are easily audited. I have also said to go ask I.E. to show you the system.

If the company has asked the union to see this, I do not know.

When I was a district I.E. (long ago) I did show the union how work measurement worked. I had discussions regularly with the B.A. I absolutely believe in showing the facts.

You aske about scientific accuracy. Work measurement was not invented by UPS. If you check out http://www.iie.org/ you can learn about some of the science behind work measurement. IIE has over 26,000 members worldwide.

I have also said that work measurement is meant to measure a job, not a person. I think UPS inappropriately uses some of these concepts. For instance, if a driver has a bad load, bad trace, bad dispatch, etc, the driver will be overallowed and hot his / her fault.

I'm giving facts. Many here do not want to hear the facts and will live by their opinion only. I do not know if you are one of them.

I am glad to share facts any time.

P-Man

At first thought that was lie.org What does a site for International Institue of Education have to do with anything? Or were you trying to make it look like there is a bigie wowie site about internal engineering?

 

[stucrew]

The only reason the company continues to harass you guys about being over allowed is because you allow it. Just listen, tell them your doing your best, and go out and follow the methods. You will not be disciplined for being over allowed. You will be for methods violations. If a sup statrs making you feel uncomfortable with the way he is talking to you, ask for a steward before he says anything else to you, don't be argumentative or beligerant, be respectful and nice, don't take it personally, your not the only one being treated this way. If they see it's getting under your skin it will only get worse. Unfortunately UPS management philosophy seems to be the madder we make them the harder they work. NEVER LET THEM SEE YOU SWEAT!!!!!

I do agree with you on this. However, it is hard to get lower seniority drivers to stand up when they think their job is on the line. Also, most of the low seniority drivers have kids and wife waiting at home so they are doubly unable to just relax and stay out there for 11 hours and earn the money.

 

[LagunaBrown]

How come supervisors code 02 (if they get stuck doing a route) in the D.I.A.D. when driver code is 06? Because it makes their day scratch no matter what......... Its the old "do as I say not as I do" routine. It is sad when they play games like that and harp on drivers over allowed.

 

[LagunaBrown]

"The only glitch we have with PAL labels is when the SPA guy gets out of synch. We know the preloader is supposed to compare the PAL with the address label but..."

Only one problem....... Really? I get air that is not coded as NDA's and are loaded as ground..... How about air that is PAL'd to multiple shelving in loads that are bulked out. You know if we actually worked as a team we could do so much to improve the system but it is so easy to just blame the hourly.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

"The only glitch we have with PAL labels is when the SPA guy gets out of synch. We know the preloader is supposed to compare the PAL with the address label but..."

Only one problem....... Really? I get air that is not coded as NDA's and are loaded as ground..... How about air that is PAL'd to multiple shelving in loads that are bulked out. You know if we actually worked as a team we could do so much to improve the system but it is so easy to just blame the hourly.

You asked a question and I gave you an answer. That is the only problem we have in my center. The problems you described can be attributed to a poor disptach sup in your center. All he has to do is ensure that any NDA is PALed to your 1000 section or, better yet, direct the loaders not to load any NDA and have the drivers load them when they wrap up their pkg cars.

If you don't like the answer then don't ask the question.

 

[LagunaBrown]

You asked a question and I gave you an answer. That is the only problem we have in my center. The problems you described can be attributed to a poor disptach sup in your center. All he has to do is ensure that any NDA is PALed to your 1000 section or, better yet, direct the loaders not to load any NDA and have the drivers load them when they wrap up their pkg cars.

If you don't like the answer then don't ask the question.

Lol. Like I said originally there are still many glitches with PAL labels, sorry you can't accept that or the fact that glitches exist in Virtual Time Studies. It is not a matter of like or dislike to your answers just the fact they exist. Lets not be in denial.

 

[trdferguson16]

couldn"t have said it better sober!!! management has no idea how we run our routes. and the amount of hard work we do for them. they just worry about their own necks to the higher UPS brass. its all about profit to those ******!

 

[Omega man]

Wouldn't it then make sense to do this virtual time study not just for one day but for 2-3 non consecutive delivery days to get a true sampling of the route?

Why sample it, that just introduces a certain amount of error? UPS now has the ability to look at your route all year and give you a variable allowance as it changes.

 

[soberups]

The problems you described can be attributed to a poor disptach sup in your center. All he has to do is ensure that any NDA is PALed to your 1000 section or, better yet, direct the loaders not to load any NDA and have the drivers load them when they wrap up their pkg cars.

The dispatch sup has become an easy target and a scapegoat for angry drivers, but the reality on my center is that the guy was set up to fail by an incompetent and corrupt IE department. He is overworked. He doesnt have time to fix the problems, and more importantly he doesnt have the authority to fix the problems. He is told by his higher-ups how many cars he is allowed to dispatch, and this arbitrary number seldom has any correlation to how many he actually needs to dispatch in order to come up with a workable plan.

Basically, he is little more than a guy who has been told by IE to fit 10 gallons of sh&t into a 5 gallon bucket, and the drivers get pissed at him when he spills some onto the floor.

 

[Omega man]

Management claims that allowances are based on the average time it takes for drivers to perform certain functions. Then why isn't the average driver at UPS running scratch?
If you assume a normal distribution and make a graph of every UPS driver's performance it should look like a bell curve with approximately equal numbers of drivers on either side of 0 (or scratch). This is not the case. The curve is skewed towards the over-plan. This is simple proof that the allowances are not based on what UPS claims.