NMA...we were robbed

[sdf6hr]

soberups is right, there were more "yeses" than "noes"... when the contract was in the rumor phase, our union steward was urging "vote no, vote no, vote no" (refering to nma, cs, & loc. 89) once the "handshake agreement" was announced the message abruptly changed, and the dis- & mis-information started flowing. (e.g. splitting the raise will actually net us more money)!!! he lost all credibility and respect among those of us who attention.

 

[tieguy]

while at first i did not think about it, asking you for your honest opinion is pretty much a redundency?

point is, as has been stated, until it becomes a serious issue for the company, it will never stop. and as with all behaivior that needs changing, when the proper motivation is there, it will happen.

d

i think it is a serious act for the company , I don't think it will ever completely stop.

 

[JonFrum]

really? care to link to said law, since you quoted it???

OK. You asked for it.
http://benefitslink.com/erisa/crossreference.html

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

OK. You asked for it.
http://benefitslink.com/erisa/crossreference.html

Advantage, JonFrum


Actually, I went to the link Jon provided and, unless you knew exactly what you were looking for, you could easily be overwhelmed by the amount of information provided but, suffice it to say, he has backed up what he was saying in his post and then some.

 

[girlfeia]

your insurance after you retire now is not free any more 172.00 single 272.00 couples pre month that you will have to pay out of retirement plan for it.

 

[Bubblehead]

1. It would seem Tie is a Hoffa fan. Now I really hate him. Hoffa that is.

2. It doesn't matter what the penalty is for any violation if our members don't grieve it and hold the company accountable. As it was eluded to, this would seem to be the companies plan. Think about it. Supervisors are salary. They are paid the same whether they are doing just their job or their job and yours. That's why double time (or more) grievance pay will tilt the scales our way. At straight time they break even, no penalty. Problem now is the lack of accountability. To many cowards turn a blind eye and it remains economically viable for management to violate the contract that they supposedly bargained in "good faith".

 

[tieguy]

OK. You asked for it.
http://benefitslink.com/erisa/crossreference.html

Looks like this anonymous sitescab just dumped an erisa website on you without actually posting his source reference material. seems the scab should have been able to direct you to whatever area he feels supports his position.

 

[trplnkl]

Since we're dreaming here. I dream that our over 9.5 language be changed up a little. The opt in/opt out is fine, some people really like the overtime for various reasons. My change would be that instead of having to file after three days in given week (and wait,wait, wait) to get the triple time pay that the triple time kicks in automatically if one has signed the opt in list stating they did not want the overtime hours. I personally have filed four weeks on the O/9.5s and haven't heard a word as to the progress of the grievances. I do realize that kinda makes be sound like a money hungry leach, but nothing could be further than the truth. I file the grievances because the company id violating the contract and...AND... I want my daily dispatches lowered. I would much rather have the time at home than to have the $90 or so bucks an hour for o/9.5s.

 

[trplnkl]

Looks like this anonymous sitescab just dumped an erisa website on you without actually posting his source reference material. seems the scab should have been able to direct you to whatever area he feels supports his position.

I knew it was an ERSIA site without him posting so. I mean, it's in the title of the link. He was asked for a link to where he got his info, he gave it.
If you choose not to accept his reference material , why not just say so without the name calling?

 

[dannyboy]

Advantage, JonFrum

since he was too busy to post the direct link, im too busy to sift

d

 

[pkgdriver]

Advantage, dannyboy

 

[trplnkl]

since he was too busy to post the direct link, im too busy to sift

d

And that's your choice. But if you are wanting to prove him wrong, I would think you take the time.

 

[tieguy]

And that's your choice. But if you are wanting to prove him wrong, I would think you take the time.

Lets face it if the anonymous sitescab had the information he would have posted it along with the link.

 

[JonFrum]

since he was too busy to post the direct link, im too busy to sift.

Dannyboy & Tieguy,

I'm not a mindreader. I don't know what features of ERISA you are in doubt/denial about. ERISA is the Mother of All Pension Laws. It dates back to 1974, with major additions in 1980 an 2006. It contains dozens of guarantees covering numerous situations. I provided you with an indexed site (which is more understandable than some others.) Use it as a Table of Contents to look up whatever you are interested in.

There are guarantees for Single-employer plans and Multi-employer plans. Guarantees that apply to companies that stay in the funds, and those that withdraw. There are PBGC guarantees and so on. I can't link to them all individually without knowing what you're driving at.

Didn't you guys notice that UPS was required by law to pay $6.1 billion in Withdrawal Liability to Central States on Dec. 26, 2007?

Haven't you noticed that Maitenance of Benefits notices have been sent out by some funds, indicating that employers must agree to higher and higher contribution rates or their employees will be thrown out of the fund?

Haven't you heard that some underfunded plans are required to improve their funding ratios by drawing up Funding Improvement Plans that require higher contribution rates from employers?

Didn't you hear that UPS might be required to pay an excise tax if Central States' funding level dropped even further in 2007?

Didn't you notice the new language in the UPS National Master that allows the pension funds to take 35-cents a year out of our raises, if necessary, and more if really necessary; and if UPS is required to make additional contributions, above and beyond those contractually agreed upon, that the contract will be reopened so that cuts can be made to offset UPS' added expenses?

These and other actions are all the result of ERISA guarantees.

 

[Braveheart]

I am all for better work rights, better seniority rights, better job protection, stronger harassment protection etc etc. Let us make it a better and safer place to work.

We may have to continue to take smaller raises than we had in past but is it not worth it at $32 per hour to just have less stress at work and a better work environment.

 

[dannyboy]

And that's your choice. But if you are wanting to prove him wrong, I would think you take the time.

so why then, if somewhere in that massive load of legal crapshoot is the proof i was asking for, why would he not post that information? its like someone posting the ada site and stating that you are covered under that law for stupidity?

since he made the statement, it is up to him to prove he was right, not me.

besides, got a pond to finish, and pack for a project in europe that starts the 28th. so i just dont have the time. sides, i do fall under the ada for the time being........makes it hard for me to do much quickly on the keyboard

d

 

[tieguy]

1. It would seem Tie is a Hoffa fan. Now I really hate him. Hoffa that is.

Don't really care for him or against him.

I strongly dislike Carey because I believe he had an agenda in 97 that had nothing to do with the contract talks. I also believe he was guilty but had the luck of a sympathetic jury to get him off.

I'll take hoffas side in a debate just to play devils advocate. I'm often surprised by how little some posters here know about Hoffa when they put him down. Those I do question when I see their posts.

 

[captainvaughan]

Remember when TEAMSTERS owned Vegas?

 

[BleedBrown33]

To all im just finding out a lot of the harsh words are coming from the wonderful folks we like to call MGMT. Union brothers regardless if you think my proposal is bizarre or hitting the nailon the head. Think of this things must change and not everything changing to benefit the company thats profits are in the billions the profits that our made with our blood, our sweat, our smoking of two or more packs a day to deal with the stress that shoved down our throats to swallow.
To the naysayers i say this and dont respond evil sup's that shouldnt be in this forum anyways. What our union brought us is less than what we deserved and what we should have already walked away with from 1997. If you call me off the planet! Is the IBT not such for the small gains and record and givebacks?

Maybe my line of thought is what will save us now and all of our futures i dream big but do you not think i would listen to every last one of you. I will fight the fight and walk the walk. Be the voice in my head and in my ears tell me the minimum we should except and we will never except less we have the power to win in 2013. The biggest question is our we willing to leave it all out on the field and truely agree with what we get next time to not be back on this post complaining of what was so small not enough or the end of our pension funds our benefits our bargaining power. I will lead if you will follow.

 

[BleedBrown33]

Final thought all you Mgmt. undercovers out there that neverendlessly state we should be happy with what we get is this. I know a friend/T 22.3 and a friend/T sup that were hired the same week and the discussion i always hear is this. That the 22.3 is very comfortable in his wallet and doesnt have a whole lot of stress in his life anymore. While the Sup not jealously or spitefully always mentions the difference in their collective career paths. He gives a tip of the hat to how his hourly co-worker is making more money and working less hours and not in the neverending PCM's threatening his livelyhood.

P.S. maybe this is why there is so much hatred between the blue and white collars