Now it all make sense...

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by brett636, Mar 18, 2008.

  1. brett636

    brett636 Well-Known Member

    Barak Hussein Obama has exhibited some strange quirks about how he honors his country since the start of this election. First he would not wear a flag pin on his lapel, then he wouldn't cover his heart during our national anthem, and finally his wife stated that she was proud of her country for the first time in her adult life. His campaign had an excuse for each of these events, but now that we have some insight into the sort of preaching that came from the Obamas' church it now all make sense. Deep down inside these two don't respect this country. I would go as far to say that Barak, and his wife both believe most of what his pastor has said despite what Barak now claims. You don't attend a church for twenty years listening to this garbage, get married by this same preacher, and allow your daughters to be baptized by him and not believe what he claims. These aren't isolated incidents, but is the basis for his entire church. Just look at how the entire congregation cheers at the garbage this pastor speaks. My guess is the Obama's are not innocent of doing the same.

    {WARNING: Video contains derrogatory, and racially dividing language)



    Is Obama Wright? - Pastor Jeremiah Wright & Senator Barack
     
  2. diesel96

    diesel96 New Member

    Brett, why are you buying into all this off topic/issue nonsense ? Why can't pundits stick to the issue's instead of digging up video's of a canidate's preacher and judging a man's life work and teachings by a 20 sec excerpt?

    If one is to believe that Obama secretly harbors the beliefs expressed by Wright it is incumbent upon his accusers to show us the proof. Is it to be found in his writings? In his speeches or how he has raised a family... or maybe his voting record? Show us the proof of the fiery, racially divisive, figurative bomb thrower which is supposed to scare us into voting for the other candidate. I contend there is no there there. There is only a man living the very ideals he calls upon the rest of us to follow.

    Every Sunday thousands of right wing white preachers rail against America’s sins from tens of thousands of pulpits. They tell us that America is complicit in the “murder of the unborn,” has become “Sodom” by coddling gays, and that our public schools are sinful places full of evolutionists and sex educators hell-bent on corrupting children. They say, that we are, “under the judgment of God” and "you will burn in hell." They call America evil and warn of immanent destruction. By comparison Obama’s minister’s shouted “controversial” comments were mild. All he said was that God should damn America for our racism and violence and that no one had ever used the N-word about Hillary Clinton.

    And if you want to play the guilt by assocciation game, John McCain has snuggled up to the likes of the Republican friends Fallwell and Robertson who two days after 9/11 while the smoke was still rising and the buried survivors were taking their last breath at ground zero said this:


    Which of them will Jesus smite first? (Question answered!)


    When the nation heard Falwell or sees Robertson or Hagee make some outrageous and patently offensive comment we are watching a white preacher, normally with a soothing southern drawl and a smiling countenance. When we see Reverend Wright in a dither during one of his rants, we are witnessing an angry black man. Quite frankly angry black men like Wright scare the snot out of most of the nation, especially little old white ladies. Pleasant sounding white fellows who preach the same sort of nonsense from the right are much less traumatic for most of us.
     
  3. wkmac

    wkmac Well-Known Member

    From the "Middle name is Hussein" to the "he doesn't salute" or "wear a flag pin" to now the current flap over his pastor, the whole idea is exactly what D said above. Now if that being the case, who is the one mostly likely to benefit at this point from such a scare?

    McCain? Not really. This is the type of thing you save for the general election, say about early October, when you stand a chance of it being fresh on the minds of the voter. Coming out in March, 7 plus months ahead of the general, most voters will have forgotten or discounted these events as the candidate would have 7 months to thrust their focus elsewhere. So McCain gets little from this except it does tend to rally the party troops who have been in a bit of disarray.

    The real winner and IMO the one behind all of this is Hillary. There are still a couple of primaries left which even if she sweeps only at best gets her close. Instead, Hillary is on full court press for the Superdelgates as this is her only hope. In the 90's especially, we heard long and often about the "politics of personal destruction" and the finger of blame was often pointed at republicans who by no means were without sin here. But, if you really watch the democrat primary process you will see who the real master is of the politics of personal destruction.

    BTW: For those who continue to point out that Obama's middle name is Hussein, he doesn't wear a flag pin or salute the flag or what his pastor sez, as correct as that all may be, they are in effect IMHO working for the election of Hillary. From a republican perspective I personally think Obama is more beatable in Nov. because Hillary, give her the due, is a savy political monster and knows how to manipulate to win. I honestly think she would beat McCain before Obama but that's JMO.
     
  4. traveler

    traveler Where next? Venice

    What you stated is mostly true except that John McCain does not claim Falwell or Robertson as his pastor and friend, nor does he attend either church weekly. Barack Obama does claim a close relationship with the fiery pastor and attend this church regularly.
     
  5. wkmac

    wkmac Well-Known Member

    And Pastor John Hagee? He's anti-semite in the most diabolical way IMO.

    Sure he extolls the presence of jews in Israel and the biblical command of America (his eschatology) to back them to the hilt but what is his motive? Bible prophectic fulfillment/end of days.

    His bible fulfillment would have the jews in the end rebuild the Temple of Solomon on Temple Mount as a mechanism to bring back Christ to earth. When this happens according to "HIS" beliefs, many jews will accept Christ as messiah and convert to Christianity. Those jews who refuse to convert will be killed by a type of divine holocaust. In the end, no more jews!

    The political zionist crowd find Pastor Hagee a useful tool but other jews are deeply concerned about this man and find his growing influence disturbing and I stand with and support them fully. They see through the thin veil. McCain was easily able to distance himself from this man after Hagee's endorsement because for one, this man is not McCain's direct pastor in the way Wright was to Obama. But don't look at Hagee/McCain through the front door, look through the backdoor and look espeically at the folks who support Hagee and then support McCain.

    Start with Hagee's Chrstian's United for Israel (CUFI) and the executive board and the directors. https://web.archive.org/web/20090321031336/http://www.cufi.org/site/PageServer?pagename=about_cufi BTW: until his passing Jerry Falwell was on the board and has been replaced now by his son who is senior pastor on Thomas Road Baptist Church.

    In 2007' Pastor Hagee spoke to one of the most powerful lobby groups in America, AIPAC (American Israel Public Affairs Committee) and who is AIPAC?
    http://www.aipac.org/ and check out the "about AIPAC" page.

    From there start backtracking and connecting the dots and the picture of disassociation was purely for public consumption. Here's another question that puzzles me. Why is Pastor Wright being investigated by the IRS for violating 501c3 status when he endorsed Obama from the pulpit, yet nothing as I know is happening to Hagee for doing the same thing. I think I know the answer (unlike Wright, Hagee never did it from his actual church pulpit) but curious if anyone else had an angle.

    McCain publically was able to distance himself from Hagee but in reality the solid connection is still there and in a place they hope you won't look or connect too!

    JMO.
     
  6. brett636

    brett636 Well-Known Member

    diesel- What you don't seem to be grasping is that we now have some insight into Barak Obama's level of judgement. Barak wrote that when he first met rev. Wright in 1985 he was told his church was more radical than most black churches. He knew from the very beginning the kind of church he was attending. Not only did he attend this church for 20 years, but he was married by the same racist that performs these sermons. He exposed his daughters to this venom, and even had them baptized by the same pastor. If I attended a church, and i heard this same kind of hate speech I would never go back. Rev. Wright is a black segregationist. He is the exact opposite of such great civil rights icons such as Martin Luther King. Obama knows this and still considers this man an "uncle".

    I don't know about you, but this showing of poor judgement doesn't seem like presidential material to me.

    Also, don't you find it odd that his wife, Michelle Obama, said that for the first time in her adult life she was proud of her country. This is a woman who has attended Ivy League schools and lives an upper middle class lifestyle. No other country in the world can offer her opportunities like that , yet she wasn't happy with what she believed took place here because of the garbage she buys into that is spewed week in and week out at her church.

    wkmak- Can you show me where John McCain attended the sermons of those pastors for decades? Was john McCain married by Robertson, Falwell, or Hagee? You are trying to make the same connection to John McCain even though no such connection exists. Obama gave large sums of money to his church, did McCain do the same with the churches you mentioned?
     
  7. Channahon

    Channahon New Member

    Also, don't you find it odd that his wife, Michelle Obama, said that for the first time in her adult life she was proud of her country. This is a woman who has attended Ivy League schools and lives an upper middle class lifestyle. No other country in the world can offer her opportunities like that , yet she wasn't happy with what she believed took place here because of the garbage she buys into that is spewed week in and week out at her church.



    From Wikipedia
    On February 18, 2008, Obama commented in Milwaukee that "for the first time in my adult life I am proud of my country because it feels like hope is finally making a comeback."

    Several commentators criticized her for remarks.and the campaign soon issued a statement that "anyone who heard her remarks ... would understand that she was commenting on our politics".

    I personally didn't care for the way she explained herself after this remark. She said she is a girl from Chicago whose father was a city worker and she attended both Princeton and Harvard.

    And proud anyone would be to have attained her success, it was just the way she presented herself as being defensive and arrogant at the same time. Perhaps just inexperience in and with the media.
     
  8. Jones

    Jones fILE A GRIEVE! Staff Member

    On the plus side, at least we'll be getting a break from all the morons who were convinced he was a "secret muslim", as the new narrative shifts to him just being a "crazy christian". Baby steps...

    One of the more insightful quotes I read on the speech he gave:
    Among the people with a vested interest in keeping Reverend Wright in play, the "I demand an explanation which under no circumstances will I ever accept" crowd, I doubt it had any effect.

    Yep, nothin’ like a scary angry black man to remind white folks where their priorities lie :wink2:
     
  9. wkmac

    wkmac Well-Known Member

    Before I move forward, LMAO @ Jones! Good one!

    Ok Brett,

    First off, I think there a 2 ways you can approach an election campaign. First and IMO the preferred way is the discussion and debate of ideas. I can find lots of areas where I disagree with Obama on policy alone and that's what this process is all about.

    The other way is the same way you gain standing on the school playground and that's by name calling, etc. Do some of those names have standing? Sure, no argument Obama didn't salute or wera a pin or that he sat in the pew while Rev. Wright said what he said. I've gone to a church or 2 in my life and when I heard something that I knew was flat wrong, I carried my arse out the door and never came back. I do think in the case of Rev. Wright Obama is IMO disengenuious and deceptive but I still believe you beat someone in the arena of ideas UNLESS!

    The truth is there really aren't any differences at the end of the day.

    It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know Hillary is behind this Obama stuff but what is most interesting to me is several months ago we heard the "conservative" mouthpieces slamming McCain as a "liberal in Republican clothing" and documenting case after case of conservative betrayal McCain. Even the right's babydoll in Anne Coulter stated she would campaign for Hillary before she voted for McCain. Rush was just as unkind but it seems a different story. I know Rush is an entertainer first but seems on his show of late he's back to playing team ball for the party. So one week they are one thing and the next they are another. So much for principles!

    As I said in my earlier post about Hagee, you've got to go behind the scenes and look at the people and then connect the dots. Gary Bauer, prominent Christian Family values guy and on the board of Hagee's organization. Bauer is also tight inside Republican party politics and who is the party nominee? Who are advisers and how do they cross?

    Rev. Rod Parsley appeared in Ohio with McCain giving a public endorsement and McCain called Parsley a "Spiritual adviser". What board does Parsley also sit on? Check out Hagee's website. How close is Hagee to McCain?
     
  10. wkmac

    wkmac Well-Known Member

    Here's a Salon.com piece on the subject but a good point made by the article concerning the late Francis Schaeffer among other points.

    https://web.archive.org/web/2010030...pinion/greenwald/2008/03/17/wright/index.html

    From Frank Schaeffer about his own father:
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/frank-schaeffer/obamas-minister-committe_b_91774.html

    Francis Schaeffer along with others like RJ Rushdooney and Gary North were the force behind Christian Reconstructionism of the late 70's and 1980's. I'm familar with these men because I too during that period held to reconstruction dogma but even though I hold many of thee views still as a personal matter, I no longer believe in advancing them by means of central gov't. Gary North, even now is very popular among anarcho-libertarians and Rothbardians/Austrian economic types as can be seen at Lew Rockwell.com and the Mises Institute site.

    Yes, these men advocated overthrowing the gov't although Rushdooney and I had a conversation about 1984/85 and he wasn't as radical on the matter as Schaeffer and North but his goal in the end was the ultimate overthrow of the US gov't and a puritan/reformist theocracy installed in it's place. Again, I still hold many of these beliefs at a personal level but my libertarianism easily checks any agressive/forceful means at the door when the issue goes beyond me personally. I can let you see me and how I live (call it witness if you will) but I can't force you and visa-versa.

    Now how dd I or the other early Christian right that helped began republican reign in Washington differ so much from Rev. Wright. In truth we didn't. What Wright has said from the pulpit has also been said by others. as the Salon piece pointed out, even from the well of Congress by a highly respected Republican legislator. Where are the hues and cries for his head? Back when the gov't raided a Baptist church school in Nebraska in the 80's and various other actions across the country, I heard fiery oratory from the pulpits of American churches that were of the same vein as what was heard in the 1770's. And I'm talking from mainstream denominations, not some radical nutjobs in the forests of Idaho.

    What Wright said may have been distasteful and beyond the pale but at least in my case, as a white guy, maybe I don't have the same perspective and that's very true. However, Wright's comments about 9/11 and the "chickens coming home to roost" may have a bit of a point. When you look at our foreign policy, especially since WW1 in the Middle East region, it's not hard to IMO to see where Ron Paul's point about "blowback" is a kinda "Chickens coming home to roost." Now I don't think Paul or myself took the pleasure in saying it as Wright appeared to but I still can understand the point at least from a historical perspective as our gov't asserted policy is considered.

    Brett,

    If you want to throw rocks at Obama, throw away but as long as you do so outside the bounds of real issues and actual policy which is where the American conservative movement got away from and off course, don't be shocked when I take the contraian position and throw rocks back at you. If "WE" can't beat them in the arena of ideas and vision, then IMO "WE" don't belong on the stage at all!

    JMHO
     
  11. brett636

    brett636 Well-Known Member

    wkmac- you seem to be confusing an endorsement with a church where Obama sat for twenty years. Louis Farrakhan has endorsed Barak Obama, and considering Farrakhan received a lifetime achievement award from Obama's church it appears his views are much closer to Farrakhan's than we originally believed. The bottom line here is that Obama has almost no record to judge him on.

    Considering what racist remarks were made in his church you would think he would be smart enough not to judge others on comments they have made. Unfortunalty Obama is a hypocrite, and has said the following on Don Imus.

    Or how about this, words straight from Obama's own autobiography




    This is the arena of ideas. The idea that racism is as alive now as it was in the 1940s, 50s, and 60s. As it appears Obama is well immersed into the idea that there is a black america being held down by the oppressive white man. These very ideas will govern how Obama makes decisions as a President, and shows how poor his judgment truly is. IMO Obama is not fit to be president, because his mind is too wrapped up in looking for racism that he will not be able to make clear decisions that are for the benefit of this country.


     
  12. Jones

    Jones fILE A GRIEVE! Staff Member

  13. Jones

    Jones fILE A GRIEVE! Staff Member

    I think McCain's good intentions regarding this kind of stuff are honest, because he was the target of the exact same smear machine back in 2000:
    click
    and
    another click

    He doesn't really have any control over it though, so I think we can expect more of this.
     
  14. wkmac

    wkmac Well-Known Member


    Find any more direct quotes and stuff like that, post away because it's the kinda stuff that should be discussed instead of the fact that Obama's middle name is Hussein.
     
  15. diesel96

    diesel96 New Member

    “The people of faith have moved from the hatred of armed enemies to the hatred of unarmed innocents. We want revenge, we want paybacks, and we don’t care who gets hurt in the process.” – Reverend Jeremiah Wright

    "Now it all makes sense" regarding Reverend Wright and his asscociation with Barack. Time to bury the hatchet job that media outlets, pundits and those of you on this site have either instigated or perpetuated against him. Much has been made of the intentional edited snippets of Rev. Wright’s sermons featuring impassioned, out of context inflammatory remarks. But not surprisingly, no one has aired or transcribed an extended portion of the sermons that have caused so much controversy. Until now, the truth is coming out. Nor have any of the media outlets I have read and viewed mentioned that Rev. Wright was referencing comments made by former Ambassador to Iraq, Edward Peck, ironically given on a Fox Noise program entitled “The War on Terror” in October 2001. On that program, Ambassador Peck presented facts that clearly agitated the program’s host; including pointing out that America previously viewed Saddam Hussein as an ally, eleven years of economic embargo killed countless children, the proceeds from the sale of “oil for food” all went to the United Nations not the Iraqi people, and two United Nations humanitarian directors resigned in protest over the suffering being forced on the Iraqi people.

    Reverend Wright witnessed this discussion on FOX and it made him think in the context of the horrible event visited upon this nation September 11, 2001. So many of us asked the question, “Why?” Why would someone do this? Why would someone attack us in such a savage and cruel way? Reverend Wright knew his people and knew they were asking these questions. And in the sermon that he delivered, Rev. Wright was attempting to answer these questions that plagued us. Picking up where Ambassador Peck left off, Wright connects the dots and reminds us that in our quest to hunt down terrorists, there are those in other nations that would ask our country to take a look in the proverbial mirror. From this land’s native inhabitants to civilians in Grenada, Panama, Libya, Iraq, Sudan, and Japan (to name those referenced in Wright’s message), there are quite a few people who may not be thrilled with America’s conduct towards them. You don't have to agree with the Rev"s positions but I'm sure Brown Cafe does not abdicate your politically motivated obligation to character assasaination. I look forward to many of you (you know who you are) correcting the record and presenting an accurate portrayal of the true character, intelligence, and integrity. Failing to do so will prove that you are no more than followers of Sean Hannity and similar propagandists.

    Part of the transcript Of Edward peck on Fox Noise....huh news (NOT)
    https://web.archive.org/web/2009072...oming-home-to-roost-september-11-full-sermon/

    And here’s the true crux of Rev. Wright’s message in his own words, taken from that sermon:

    “Violence begets violence, hatred begets hatred, and terrorism begets terrorism. A white ambassador said that y’all, not a black militant. Not a reverend who preaches about racism. An ambassador whose eyes are wide open and who’s trying to get us to wake up and move away from this dangerous precipice upon which we are now poised. The ambassador said the people that we are wounding don’t have the military capability we have but they do have individuals who are willing to die and take thousands with them and we need to come to grips with that.”
     
  16. wkmac

    wkmac Well-Known Member

    DAMN YOU D!
    :wink2:

    You beat me to the punch! Found this yesterday from CNN http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2008/03/21/the-full-story-behind-rev-jeremiah-wrights-911-sermon/
    where Roland Martin (no not the fishing guy!) listened to Rev. Wright's entire sermon and he saw it from a completely different context.

    Even though I understand the acts of 9/11 in the context of foreign policy blowback, I came away from reading Wright's comments remembering the words of some guy the Romans hated years ago who said, "those who live by the sword, die by the sword!"

    Rev. Wright may have his warts but it's looking more and more like this specific case may not be one of them. It's ashame at least in this case that Obama didn't standup and defend Rev. Wright's words so even in this I do have to wonder about Obama's principles and even committment to his so-called anti-war, anti-Iraq war stance. Brett may be right afterall about Obama being a hypocrite, just not in the exact way he was thinking!

    :happy-very:

    Hey Brett, regardless, you may still get an A+ when this is all said and done!

    LOL!

    Hey D,

    Check this op-ed out on Wright's 9/11 sermon from the libertarian website "antiwar.com" http://antiwar.com/henderson/?articleid=12553
    David Henderson, the author, is a research fellow with the Hoover Institution and an associate professor of economics in the Graduate School of Business and Public Policy at the Naval Postgraduate School. Not exactly a wild eyed crazy type one would think.
     
  17. diesel96

    diesel96 New Member

     
  18. av8torntn

    av8torntn Well-Known Member

    http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=59456


    It is great watching you guys make excuses. For years if you believed killing babies was wrong and killing terrorists was right you were labeled as a religious nut. If you thought it was wrong for a grown man in San Fran to walk around in a leather thong but saw no problem with making a terrorist wear his boxers on his head in Abu G you must've been part of the religious right. I mean you guys really do not want to talk about the issues your candidate stands on. Maybe the "chickens are finally coming home to roost" and it is very fun to watch. You guys even want to run from his name. I mean the name of a candidate really is not important. No one really knows the name of any of our presidents anyway right.

    On a side note he talks about the people of faith beside the rivers of Babylon. Think about it. Thanks for posting the 'context' video it just helped reinforce my belief that these guys hate America. One positive thing out of all of this I may have been wrong when I thought all Democrats hated America as I see the shift in the polls away from B. Hussein Obama.
     
  19. brett636

    brett636 Well-Known Member

     
  20. Griff

    Griff Active Member

    A true American patriot doesn't need a pin on his jacket and a "support our troops" ribbon his or her SUV. You are a brainwashed drone and you should be in a padded cell. If you support the Bush administration, you aren't a patriot, you're in favor of the systematic dismantling of the constitution and everything America stands for.

    "The Constitution is just a piece of paper" - G.W. Bush



    Hitler like laws passed by G.W.Bush