Orion warning letters

Discussion in 'UPS Union Issues' started by Tough Guy, Feb 25, 2015.

  1. Tough Guy

    Tough Guy Active Member

    We were basically told that warning letters will start being handed out if Orion % isn't met going forward. They've always harped on Orion since we've had it, but have never really come right out and said anything about progressive discipline and warning letters.

    I pretty much have it in my mind that I would rts any letter they put in front of me. "Making good business decisions" (legitimately) and such would be my argument. But has this been "threatened" with anyone else? This Orion stuff is really getting out of hand in my center.
     
  2. Mugarolla

    Mugarolla Light 'em up!

    I am not trying to be argumentative, but if you are instructed to follow a set percentage of ORION, then that is your job. Your job is not to make good business decisions. Your job is to work as instructed.

    I only say this because the union will not back you up. They will say you have to work as instructed unless it is immoral, illegal or unsafe.

    And for reference for anyone who doesn't know, UPS does not need your signature on a warning letter. They just need to give it to you, or mail it to your house.

    Your only option is to grieve it. And, in this case, you will lose.

    Follow the percentage they want you to follow and you will make a lot of money. If everyone in the country did this, they would pay out more in unaccounted for OT than they did this past quarter.

    The stock would take another big hit and ORION would be shut off. At least for the time being.
     
    • Like x 7
    • Agree x 6
    • Winner x 3
    • Disagree x 2
    • Optimistic x 2
    • Funny x 1
    • Informative x 1
    • List
  3. standtall

    standtall You can't hurt my feelings, I left them at home.

    The only thing i would add to this is, any warning letter issued by the company (ie. descipline) is non contractual, therefore worthless. You can not be disciplined by means of technology alone. Somevone has to follow you or ride with you, record all the horrible, non-compliant things you do all day while your busting your ass to meet there ever increasing, unattainable goals. To that I say, good luck to them. "Work as directed". Make more money. There letters aren't worth killing trees.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
    • List
  4. Mugarolla

    Mugarolla Light 'em up!

    Unless you're defrauding the company. But in this case, not following ORION by 85% is not defrauding the company.

    Scanning air across town is
    Padding miles is
    Taking too long on break or lunch is

    These you can get fired for by technology alone. But ORION mandate, no.

    But be careful, contract says on first offense. So the first time they just tell you to follow 85% The second time starts progressive discipline just by technology alone.
     
  5. Tough Guy

    Tough Guy Active Member

    They weren't singling me or anyone else out. They said it to the whole center at PCM.
     
  6. standtall

    standtall You can't hurt my feelings, I left them at home.

    The only thing i would add to this is, any warning letter issued by the company (ie. descipline) is non contractual, therefore worthless. You can not be disciplined by means of technology alone. Somevone has to follow you or ride with you, record all the horrible, non-compliant things you do all day while your busting your ass to meet there ever increasing, unattainable goals. To that I say, good luck to them. "Work as directed". Make more money. There letters aren't worth killing trees.that
    That's there first step in progressive discipline. Still means nothing, it's unenforceable.
     
  7. toonertoo

    toonertoo Most Awesome Dog Staff Member

    Oh boy is my mailbox gonna get busy. I will follow it, if thats what they really want.
     
  8. standtall

    standtall You can't hurt my feelings, I left them at home.

    Oh brother!!
     
  9. toonertoo

    toonertoo Most Awesome Dog Staff Member

    I tried really tried yesterday. aside from pulling for business they had at the end of my day, I followed it even when it made no sense. 22 miles over. The only way I can follow it 100% is have late air, missed commercial. Is that really what I should do?
     
  10. clean hairy

    clean hairy Well-Known Member

    Just run it 100%, then what can they do?
    After all, they want orion compliance, give 100% compliance.
     
    • Winner Winner x 3
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • List
  11. clean hairy

    clean hairy Well-Known Member

    From the original post, warning letters will be given for not following Orion.
    Therefore, I don't see how warning letters could be issued for any service failures due to the flaws in following Orion.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • List
  12. Bubblehead

    Bubblehead My Senior Picture

    It's most likely a bluff, but as most others have said, follow the ORION trace to the tee except to avoid service failures.
    Work by the methods, avoid unnecessary backs and you will fail to meet their miles.
    After a period of time, after the ORION Team leaves your center, management will come to you begging for a mileage reduction.
    At that point tell them you believe you would have less miles running RDO.
    They will tell you go for it and ORION will be in your rear view mirror.

    I ran it into the ground for 4 months and haven't seen it for 6 months now.
    I rarely meet the miles, but come much closer my way.
    They will likely make another run at my route eventually, at which time I will repeat the whole process over again.
     
    • Winner Winner x 3
    • Like Like x 2
    • List
  13. 3 done 3 to go

    3 done 3 to go In control of my own destiny

    I'd give them exactly what they want. You are not able to b.e 2 places at one time. I haven't got the pleasure of Orion yet. I am actually looking forward to it. We aren't paid to think for them any longer. So make them think. I bet you will make 10k off of it
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • List
  14. Griff

    Griff Active Member

    We are going through this Orion phase as we speak. I say phase because that's all it is, just like building and center managers it will fade away in 2-3 years. It's an idiotic concept and the shareholders should be OUTRAGED that the company thought this would be a sound investment of money. You are a package delivery company, not a technology company.

    I follow it 100% because they have threatened failure to follow instruction on us. The only reason I break the trace of Orion is to ensure delivery of airs on time. Every single day I have business stops that get sheeted up as closed after 5pm, my miles are way up from the historical averages of my route, my overallowed is 100-120 clicks higher than it ever has been and I never make 9.5, ever. In summary, give the Orion guy a big raise. Like most UPS cubical dwellers, he has zero concept of reality.
     
  15. 728ups

    728ups offending people on the internet since 1995

    Work as Directed. It isnt the drivers responsibility to make decisions any longer. Give them what they want to the Letter. beat them at their own game and they WILL change the game
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Like Like x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
    • List
  16. I saw an interview one time with the CIO of UPS and he said "We are a technology company that delivers packages." Almost peed my pants laughing. Oh yeah? We are? Than why do we have such crap computers and scanners that constantly break?

    Isn't the Orion goal 85% trace? If so is it really that hard to make it? I say that because on a 100 stop day that is only 15 stops to break trace for.
     
  17. Brownslave688

    Brownslave688 You want a toe? I can get you a toe.

    boom not following ORION could be called padding miles since that's what the program is all about.
     
  18. Brownslave688

    Brownslave688 You want a toe? I can get you a toe.

    The problem is 1 break could make the rest of the day make no sense at all so yeah 15 breaks could be a huge deal.
     
  19. Ah, that clears it up. I knew it was bad, but I didn't think breaking trace for a couple packages could ruin an entire day.
     
  20. Brownslave688

    Brownslave688 You want a toe? I can get you a toe.

    Totally with you. I'm almost giddy at the thought of following ORION to the T.