Package Hide & Seek?

[kingOFchester]

Article 17

Paid for Time
All employees covered by this Agreement shall be paid for all time spent in service of the Employer.
Rates of pay provided for by this Agreement shall be minimums. Time shall be computed from the time
that the employee is ordered to report for work and registers in and until the employee is effectively
released from duty. All time lost due to delays as a result of overloads or certificate violations involving
federal, state or city regulations, which occur through no fault of the driver, shall be paid for by the
Employer.​

The Employer will not allow employees to work prior to their start time without appropriate compensation.​

You want to work for free, while the preloaders are having you steal money out of their pockets. Management counts on you working for free but yet you all fail to see that. I only hope that the people that get laid off if there are layoffs are the ones that like to work for free and work through their lunch, this way i wont feel so bad.​

nevermind

 

[stevetheupsguy]

Steve, I learned many years ago that not everything is just Black and White. Or I should say, not everything that should be equal, is equal. I have not made seniority. I know that their is a contract that the union and UPS should follow. I also believe that at the very least (VERY LEAST) that thier is some wiggle room. You have a group of seasonal drivers. Some from preload, some from twilight some from one center some from another center. If there is any chance that one may be passed over do to another driver who really gives 200%, then I am willing to do that. I have not made seniority. I am trying to make a name for myself. If I risk getting hurt while working off the clock so be it. I know I will get slammed by the "union" for this, but it is just the facts as I see them where I work. Besides, I always give 100% with everything I do.

I understand you, really, I do, but I'm not speaking from a union point of view, may 705 forgive me. All I'm saying is why rack your brains and body out, trying to do the impossible. You got in line the day you were hired. There's no skipping, jumping or cutting. You will make more money looking for and sorting the pkgs on the clock than you will off the clock. You're a supervisors dream right now. The more money you save them, the less people they hire.

 

[kingOFchester]

There's no skipping, jumping or cutting. .

I think there is more room then you may think. Just from what I have seen.

You're a supervisors dream right now. .

Bingo!! And if this supervisor has a seasonal driver who just does what he has to and also has a "dream" driver, who do you think they will try to cut first? This is the real world. From what I have seen at my building.....you know what, scrath that, from what we all read here, UPS will bend around the contract, just as the union will look the other way when their back is getting scrathed. it is reality. Not trying to argue with you at all. I truly respect you and all others here (for the most part). The union stewards, management and everyone else are humans. People have a tendency to cut corners to better their life/career. I also want to add AGAIN, that it is my nature to give much more then I should in my chosen career. I always give more then I should.

 

[705red]

Not here king, if its not your turn at the ftime job than you wont get it. Also people will be laid off in january according to ups, so once xmas eve comes you will be sent back ptime. Hate to tell you this and squash your dreams of being a driver right now but its the truth.

 

[kingOFchester]

Not here king, if its not your turn at the ftime job than you wont get it. Also people will be laid off in january according to ups, so once xmas eve comes you will be sent back ptime. Hate to tell you this and squash your dreams of being a driver right now but its the truth.

Red, if you have read my other posts you will clearly see that I expect understand and ready to go back to part time. The writing is on the wall. But, at some point my number will be called. And if I have made a name for myself, perhaps I will have a better shot at getting called earlier then the "Joe" who just came and did what they had to do. You have clearly had some kool aid if you sincerly believe that one's performance will have no bearing. maybe in your building, maybe in a lot of the buildings. But to believe that 100% of the time at 100% of the building that seniority is the only way....is very foolish thinking. I have seen it where I work on the part time level. Besides, even if it was true that the contract was followed 100% of the time across the board, I would still work with the same ethics I work with now. I want to be the top of my game.

Peace, I will end it at that as I do not want to get into an arguement.

 

[stevetheupsguy]

Red, if you have read my other posts you will clearly see that I expect understand and ready to go back to part time. The writing is on the wall. But, at some point my number will be called. And if I have made a name for myself, perhaps I will have a better shot at getting called earlier then the "Joe" who just came and did what they had to do. You have clearly had some kool aid if you sincerly believe that one's performance will have no bearing. maybe in your building, maybe in a lot of the buildings. But to believe that 100% of the time at 100% of the building that seniority is the only way....is very foolish thinking. I have seen it where I work on the part time level. Besides, even if it was true that the contract was followed 100% of the time across the board, I would still work with the same ethics I work with now. I want to be the top of my game.

Peace, I will end it at that as I do not want to get into an arguement.

No, I will end it, by telling you to reread my post as well as 705's. You will wait your turn like everyone else has. I was able to skip some senior people, because they chose not to go driving. Your manager will call the next number. When you look down and see that it is not your's don't be disappointed, they'll get to you in the order you arrived. The good thing is that you don't have to do all the circus sideshow tricks in order to become a driver. All will be given a chance (in the proper order) and that's the way it should be.

 

[dilligaf]

No, I will end it, by telling you to reread my post as well as 705's. You will wait your turn like everyone else has. I was able to skip some senior people, because they chose not to go driving. Your manager will call the next number. When you look down and see that it is not your's don't be disappointed, they'll get to you in the order you arrived. The good thing is that you don't have to do all the circus sideshow tricks in order to become a driver. All will be given a chance (in the proper order) and that's the way it should be.

Hope you don't mind, I fixed it for ya!

 

[kingOFchester]

No, I will end it, by telling you to reread my post as well as 705's. You will wait your turn like everyone else has. I was able to skip some senior people, because they chose not to go driving. Your manager will call the next number. When you look down and see that it is not your's don't be disappointed, they'll get to you in the order you arrived. The good thing is that you don't have to do all the circus sideshow tricks in order to become a driver. All will be given a chance and that's the way it should be.

How do you explain that there are 2 people that I work with. One started preload a little over 6 months ago. The other started over a year ago. Both signed up for Sat air when HR came around with the clipboard asking us who wants to sign up for driving. This was months ago. The guy that has only been there 6months and myself went to driving school. The guy who has been there over a year got passed over. I know that he has been disciplined in the past for showing up late and calling out sick. If it truly was senioirty, then he would of went to riving school with me rather then the other guy. BTW, the guy who got passed up has a CDL and is VERY pissed about not being called. I over heard him talking to HR and HR giving him some song and dance. I never told him that the guy that I was at driving school with was only working at UPS 6 months. So, again I will stick to my guns and say that it is crazy to think that there isnt "i'll wash your hand if you wash my hand" going on from time to time. And Let it be known that I think the guy should of been passed up as the other guy works twice as hard.

 

[dilligaf]

It sounds as though they did violate seniority, King, and that driver should have followed through with the steward. Everything is done by seniority.

 

[RozUPS]

I respect what you seasoned experienced guys are saying. I see most drivers in my building come in early. What are they doing? I think some come in to hang and BS with other drivers. Most are going through thier trucks to see what they have and were it is in the truck. Some come in 20 mins b4 start. All in all I guess it's what you feel like dealing with during the day. Do you want to spend it messing with a bad load and having a frustrating day coming in late or do you want to square it away first and have an easier less frustrating day .Do you want to come in at 8pm or 5 or 6pm. Again I'm new and learning the ropes and just doing what I have to do to get through peak.

 

[kingOFchester]

It sounds as though they did violate seniority, King, and that driver should have followed through with the steward. Everything is done by seniority.

Exactly. I don't know about you, but in our building we have over 400 part timers. I know maybe about 15-20. It is impossible for us to track seniority.

Let me ask you a question. Do you think there have been times where a union employee/steward or such needed a favor and they worked a deal with a manager who also needed or wanted a favor?

 

[stevetheupsguy]

How do you explain that there are 2 people that I work with. One started preload a little over 6 months ago. The other started over a year ago. Both signed up for Sat air when HR came around with the clipboard asking us who wants to sign up for driving. This was months ago. The guy that has only been there 6months and myself went to driving school. The guy who has been there over a year got passed over. I know that he has been disciplined in the past for showing up late and calling out sick. If it truly was senioirty, then he would of went to riving school with me rather then the other guy. BTW, the guy who got passed up has a CDL and is VERY pissed about not being called. I over heard him talking to HR and HR giving him some song and dance. I never told him that the guy that I was at driving school with was only working at UPS 6 months. So, again I will stick to my guns and say that it is crazy to think that there isnt "i'll wash your hand if you wash my hand" going on from time to time. And Let it be known that I think the guy should of been passed up as the other guy works twice as hard.

Maybe the guy had an accident, maybe the guy failed to meet some other criteria, I don't know. What I do know is that driving school does not make you a driver. And weren't you the one in another thread that said you didn't officially go to driving school? This all aside, rest assured that being the supervisors pet will not get you that coveted driving position. Why don't you go back and read some of the threads/posts written by your alter ego, BBAG, and see what it got him.

Another point is this. The "harder/faster" you work, the less you make. That means that guys like you are twice as poor and get hurt twice as often. Keep this in mind as you're tripping down the steps and scraping your shins on the way back up, trying to please the man.

 

[But Benefits Are Great!]

How do you explain that there are 2 people that I work with. One started preload a little over 6 months ago. The other started over a year ago. Both signed up for Sat air when HR came around with the clipboard asking us who wants to sign up for driving. This was months ago. The guy that has only been there 6months and myself went to driving school. The guy who has been there over a year got passed over. I know that he has been disciplined in the past for showing up late and calling out sick. If it truly was senioirty, then he would of went to riving school with me rather then the other guy. BTW, the guy who got passed up has a CDL and is VERY pissed about not being called. I over heard him talking to HR and HR giving him some song and dance. I never told him that the guy that I was at driving school with was only working at UPS 6 months. So, again I will stick to my guns and say that it is crazy to think that there isnt "i'll wash your hand if you wash my hand" going on from time to time. And Let it be known that I think the guy should of been passed up as the other guy works twice as hard.

I completely agree. I was sent to INTEGRAD because, in my opinion, I made a pain in the arse of myself over it. I've seen it since - unless you make your intentions known, you won't go where you want.

The idea that making a good impression is useless? I modify my feelings from when I started on this forum - I do believe that once you become a driver, once you have been "assimilated" your attitude & performance mean absolutely nothing (as long as it meets bare minimums). However, to get to this wonderful, rewarding, satisfying position, performance counts.

 

[kingOFchester]

Maybe the guy had an accident, maybe the guy failed to meet some other criteria, I don't know. What I do know is that driving school does not make you a driver. And weren't you the one in another thread that said you didn't officially go to driving school? This all aside, rest assured that being the supervisors pet will not get you that coveted driving position. Why don't you go back and read some of the threads/posts written by your alter ego, BBAG, and see what it got him.

Another point is this. The "harder/faster" you work, the less you make. That means that guys like you are twice as poor and get hurt twice as often. Keep this in mind as you're tripping down the steps and scraping your shins on the way back up, trying to please the man.

I do not care for your sarcasm or implying of my alter ego. Also, perhaps you need to read my posts. Never said I didn't go through driving school. I said that I didn't go to Intergrad. I did say i was less then impressed with the driving school.

So, go and sit on your high horse. Stand behind your union horses. Drink the kool aid and believe that both the union and management follow the contract. Funny, UPS employees what 400k people and all of these people are always on the up and up.

 

[But Benefits Are Great!]

Oh crap, now you did it...

 

[kingOFchester]

performance counts.

And for people to believe that performance does not count is crazy. I do know that in my brother in laws building they do follow the contract "bible". I am sure in his building performance doesn't count, but by no means does that streatch across the board!

peace out......didn't i already say that??

I am thru!! promise.....pinky pinky promise.
Night night all! Got to get up early to organize my truck before PCM!

 

[Mike Hawk]

Bingo!! And if this supervisor has a seasonal driver who just does what he has to and also has a "dream" driver, who do you think they will try to cut first? This is the real world. From what I have seen at my building.....you know what, scrath that, from what we all read here, UPS will bend around the contract, just as the union will look the other way when their back is getting scrathed. it is reality. Not trying to argue with you at all. I truly respect you and all others here (for the most part). The union stewards, management and everyone else are humans. People have a tendency to cut corners to better their life/career. I also want to add AGAIN, that it is my nature to give much more then I should in my chosen career. I always give more then I should.

Some people just have to learn the hard way, no amount of free work, coffee/donuts, or anything will stop management form using you until you are not needed and tossing you out.

 

[dilligaf]

Exactly. I don't know about you, but in our building we have over 400 part timers. I know maybe about 15-20. It is impossible for us to track seniority.

Let me ask you a question. Do you think there have been times where a union employee/steward or such needed a favor and they worked a deal with a manager who also needed or wanted a favor?

Absolutely I think favors are exchanged. It happens here and I have no doubt that it happens elsewhere as well. Sometimes it's the steward that is making the deals and sometimes it's the drivers (or other employees). I know of at least one steward that i would never allow to represent me because of side deals. That steward is at our other center.

Steve brought up a good point. Maybe the person that you are talking of had a prior 'something' that disqualified him from driving.

The point is that all is (or should be) done with seniority honored at all times. If it is not then the person that is violated has a specific period of time to grieve the action of the company. This is why we have stewards. If there is an issue of a steward not doing their job then that issue needs to be addressed with the Business Agent.

 

[kingOFchester]

Absolutely I think favors are exchanged. It happens here and I have no doubt that it happens elsewhere as well. Sometimes it's the steward that is making the deals and sometimes it's the drivers (or other employees). I know of at least one steward that i would never allow to represent me because of side deals. That steward is at our other center.

Steve brought up a good point. Maybe the person that you are talking of had a prior 'something' that disqualified him from driving.

The point is that all is (or should be) done with seniority honored at all times. If it is not then the person that is violated has a specific period of time to grieve the action of the company. This is why we have stewards. If there is an issue of a steward not doing their job then that issue needs to be addressed with the Business Agent.

I thought I was going to bed.....just can't seem to go!! I do know for a fact that he is able to go driving. I was working a few feet away when he was arguing with HR. Hr blamed it on Intergrad not having any more classes in maryland. Which was true, but they had a class at a nearby facility.

I also agree that since UPS and the union have a contract that both sides should follow the said contract. But as you say that doesn't work that way. So if by working 200% increases my odds of moving forward a little quicker by only a 1/2 %...well i will take those odds!

Onoe other thing.....I want to say again, regardless of my chances, I would still give all that I can give. The way i was raised i guess.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

You should think of UPS as an elaborate deli counter with the machine that you "Take a number" from. When you are hired you take a number. This number is yours for the next 30 years or so. You will advance when your number is called. It doesn't matter if you bring coffee and donuts or offer to pick up the CMs drycleaning.