Please Advise ...

Discussion in 'UPS Discussions' started by Ramned, Sep 1, 2009.

  1. Ramned

    Ramned New Member

    Hey,

    Today I became the most senior person on my belt, which is the smallest in a small facility. We're now just a 3-man team and we have 3 different trailers. I've been working on the belt and for UPS since May, the 2nd guy has been there for a few weeks and the third guy is a new hire.

    I have worked in the 2 most important trailers, IN (a drop-frame) and IL, for 2 months each. I know all of the sort zip codes and haven't had a misload in awhile. In IN I did have a minor problem missing audits on my scanning that my FT supe addressed with me. The second guy has only worked in IL and has never been in the IN trailer to scan and load.

    Last week I was being trained to be the pick-off. My supervisor did not have me take the sort test, but said I'd do it Monday. Then on Monday, he said "I changed my mind." That :censored2: me off because I wanted the extra 1$ raise (as well as being pickoff which is easier) but I didn't pursue it further or say anything else.

    Today, he trained the 2nd guy in seniority on how to pick-off and I overheard him telling this guy at the end of the night that he is to arrive 15 minutes early tomorrow in order to take the sort test so he can pickoff. "you get an extra dollar." he said. As this guy left he took check-charts so he could 'study' for it since he doesnt know the zip codes for 2 of the 3 trailers.

    I am not sure why my supervisor is allowing someone to jump over me to a preferred position when I have clearly demonstrated that I have more experience, production and also quality in my loading. I need the 1$ raise and he has refused to administer the sort test when I obviously could easily pass it and is giving it to someone who has been there less than a month.

    Can anyone entertain reasoning for this management decision? I intend to confront him about it tomorrow, I don't want to be held back from what I consider a more advanced position.
     
  2. Mr.Grey

    Mr.Grey New Member

    Ok, Take a moment and look at what you said . You already have the anwser to what happened .

    Here is a truthful inside as to how this decision was made by management . Also my insight .


    Today I became the most senior person on my belt(good), which is the smallest in a small facility(humm). We're now just a 3-man team and we have 3 different trailers(cut backs, pph)). I've been working on the belt and for UPS since may(the new guy), the 2nd guy has been there for a few weeks(why is the 2 now ??) and the third guy is a new hire(oh heck more paper work).

    I have worked in the 2 most important trailers, IN (a drop-frame) and IL, for 2 months each. I know all of the sort zip codes and haven't had a misload in awhile. In IN I did have a minor problem missing audits on my scanning that my FT supe addressed with me(well your doing a good job.thank god we didn't hire another :censored2:.) The second guy has only worked in IL and has never been in the IN trailer to scan and load.(he's new we'll watch him)

    Last week I was being trained to be the pick-off(this guy is a one is good). My supervisor did not have me take the sort test, but said I'd do it Monday.(we got busy running the sort ) Then on Monday, he said "I changed my mind."(post sort management meeting things were dicused , the case was made from others , why break something that's not broke. But the 2nd new guy has potiential for pick off as well with out loseing your good guy) That :censored2: me off because I wanted the extra 1$ raise(not management prob) (as well as being pickoff which is easier) (senority, has this one sorry)but I didn't pursue it further or say anything else.

    Today, he trained the 2nd guy in seniority on how to pick-off and I overheard him telling this guy at the end of the night that he is to arrive 15 minutes early tomorrow in order to take the sort test so he can pickoff. "you get an extra dollar." he said. As this guy left he took check-charts so he could 'study' for it since he doesnt know the zip codes for 2 of the 3 trailers.

    I am not sure why my supervisor is allowing someone to jump over me to a preferred position when I have clearly demonstrated that I have more experience, production and also quality in my loading. I need the 1$ raise and he has refused to administer the sort test when I obviously could easily pass it and is giving it to someone who has been there less than a month.(read above)

    Can anyone entertain reasoning for this management decision?(above) I intend to confront him about it tomorrow(um NO), I don't want to be held back from what I consider a more advanced position.

    you are right in your thoughts , but ups and bussiness does not work in this way . All are fighting right now for any edge they can get in this economy , your self included . the old rules apply but very new ones are testing us . the fight is long term , many others working beside you also want pick off, driver , management , and many have a lot of years with ups . it's the ability after helping all out over time that your voice has weight. try a ****ty peak or 5 and up hold what have done .

    keep going and helping others and when you need it then they will help you unasked.
     
  3. 22.34life

    22.34life Active Member

    I have worked at ups for ten yrs and picked off for 8 yrs of that.I had a similar thing happen to me when i first started picking off.heres how it went down there was a guy with less senority than me on my belt who was a sorry loader but a decent pickoff they wanted him to pickoff since i was a good loader.I Was the senior person in the load and at the time past practice was senority guy picked off but senority by the contract does not give you the right to pickoff.here is what i had to do to get up there. since the pickoff starts 5 minutes early at least at my hub they do i told managment i would file for the time so they decided to put me up there instead.best advise talk to your stewart.
     
  4. DorkHead

    DorkHead Active Member

    You have no say as to what job they put you in. However, you do get to work longer or earlier than the other two.
     
  5. sdf6hr2

    sdf6hr2 New Member

    22.34life hit it out of the park... if pick-off gets an earlier start time (i.e. more hours), the more (most) senior employees should get first considerations.
     
  6. Ramned

    Ramned New Member

    It sounds like this is from a management perspective. I understand that I may be the best loader on our belt and that if I were to be put on pick off we could get behind and it would be inefficient.

    But my problem isn't so much not being the pickoff. I just want to take the sort test so I can get an extra dollar per hour. Then, I don't care if I'm loading or if I am picking off, although I PREFER to pick off on slow days. I will do what is necessary to help our belt the most. But since I am (more) qualified for picking off then they shouldn't refuse to give me the sort test.
     
  7. evilleace

    evilleace Member

    They should give you the sort test and the pickoff spot because of your seniority talk to your steward.

    Of course seeing as you and the other two are probably seasonal hires then you might not have any rights when bringing up seniority.
     
  8. 22.34life

    22.34life Active Member

    You also have to know that just because you take the sort test you wont get the dollar until you demonstrate you can perform the job and do it.They can pay you the dollar for the time you pick off only if they really want to be hard ass about it.Bottom line get on the pickoff stand who wants to load any longer than they have to.like i said before if the pickoff starts before the loaders file on it.talk to management yourself first if they wont budge talk to your stewart.always better to give them them the chance to do the right thing first before getting union involved.
     
  9. UPSroanoke1

    UPSroanoke1 UPSroanoke1

    Art. 63 and art. 23 can explain to you that it is a preferred job sign the list take the test. you have the rigth to come in early as well. file with a steward.
     
  10. Sleeve_meet_Heart

    Sleeve_meet_Heart making the unreadable unreadabler

    Our entire hub ran part-timers before full-timers, so this is not entirely true.

    Still to this day, small sort part-timers start at 6:15pm, full-timers start at 6:25.
     
  11. Ramned

    Ramned New Member


    No, I am not a seasonal hire, and I don't think they are either.
     
  12. Ramned

    Ramned New Member


    I plan to pursue it first with my supervisor and gather his thoughts. My belt really relies on my atm but if they refuse to help me out whatsoever then I will head for union help as much as I hate to do it.
     
  13. 1000RR

    1000RR Member

    File a grievance. According to Article 22.4, if I am correct, lists the preferred jobs. I'm having that problem here too. I'm a good loader, I have one guy under me they moved to unload.
     
  14. Buffaloaf

    Buffaloaf New Member

    Sounds like you're getting screwed over because you do a good job loading and working fast. I would talk to your supervisor and tell him about your concern. If that doesn't help, then you should contact a steward in order to resolve the issue. I'm sure they know they are not following the proper procedure (management that is), but they are hoping that you don't notice.
     
  15. Ramned

    Ramned New Member

    Talked to my PT Supe.

    I asked again, when are you letting me take the sort test. He responds with I don't know.

    Then I told him that if he let XXXXX, the guy behind me on seniority, take it and be pickoff, then I should be able to as well.

    He was really passive on the subject and vague. I think he was banking on me not defending myself.

    Finally he told me "you're too good of a loader." And I told him Well that's good and all but I shouldn't be held back for that.

    Again he didn't say anything. Since he wasn't happy to be talking about it, I just told him I'll keep giving him hell over it and he said OK. Then I left.


    Any further advice? Resorting to contacting a steward is what I LEAST want to do, because my supervisor treats me well and it would be a low blow to the new pickoff. His motive is to keep his belt running efficiently. Mine is to get the extra dollar / hr. So hopefully there is a middle ground here that we can reach. I'll just keep asking him firmly to let me take the test. Around peak season I definitly want to pick off though.
     
  16. sortaisle

    sortaisle Livin the cardboard dream

    It's within your rights to be a pickoff. In my experience though, picking off sucks. If you're tall and long then it's not so bad as reaching across the belt isn't as much of a problem. If you're short and squat such as myself, then you can get a diverter to push the flow to you, but it causes more jams that way. Picking off isn't all it's cracked up to be imo, but it is well within your rights to pursue the issue. It's not a low blow to the guy who's picking off now because he has to abide by the same rules. He can be the back up pick or the second pick (if you guys have them.) Or you guys can alternate during the week, but you should get first choice during peak....something...although having a sucky loader when you're picking off sucks royally, you might be better off loading during peak anyway....there's options out there. Talk to your steward if there's no other choice.
     
  17. sdf6hr2

    sdf6hr2 New Member



    you have two good responses to this 'you are too good a loader', one diplomatic and one not so much.

    the diplomatic resp. goes something like: "yeah, i am a good loader, and i will be a good pick-off too".

    the not so diplomatic resp. goes somthing like: "as mgmt., it is your job to develop the skills of everyone of your employees, not to rely on just one to keep your area running smoothly..."

    choose wisely grasshopper.....
     
  18. Sleeve_meet_Heart

    Sleeve_meet_Heart making the unreadable unreadabler

    Slow down in the load.

    Your supervisor said "You're too good of a loader". Gee, hint hint there? Just as you can be "too bad", you can be "too good". Perform a reasonable, fair, safe work pace and they will gladly move you to the pickoff. Even your part-time sup is hinting that you should slow down. Like our union local president says , "you set the bar not the company".

    If making near impossible numbers and having them laugh at you behind closed doors is what you want, while you LOSE THE DOLLAR AN HOUR, then that is what you get.

    Believe me I have been in your shoes as a part-timer, 8 years ago, as a 23 year old preloader. I worked myself to death, learned every possible preload spot (before PAS!) in the building and could do anything. EVentually I slowed down because the company was abusing me putting me in a different set of brownies every night. It took about 1.5 to 2 years.

    After that guess where I went when I worked at a reasonable pace and did not kill myself anymore? pickoff!

    Also I agree with one of the posters that the pickoff is not peaches and cream. You can get some serious repetive stress injuries up there in your triceps, tendons, arms in general if you do it too long or are not taller and/or long reach.