oldngray
nowhere special
Except the grand jury decided otherwise.
Police Brutality & Executions
- Thread starter MAKAVELI
- Start date
Except the grand jury decided otherwise.
UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)
Well-Known Member
We receive a warning letter for failure to work as directed.
Did Garner deserve to die for doing the same?
UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)
Well-Known Member
So they are an absolute entity?
oldngray
nowhere special
A part of the legal process. One must assume they based their decision on the evidence of the case.
UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)
Well-Known Member
I'm sorry, 6 cops wrestling a large black man over failure to collect cigarette taxes is abuse of their power.
Nimnim
The Nim
Then why is only the officer under fire and not the SGT on scene for not stopping things when they went too far?
oldngray
nowhere special
The black female sgt watching the other cops restraining the large black man? It may be a police brutality issue but not about race.
Nimnim
The Nim
I didn't bring race into it, there was a sgt present, if the officers under her command were going too far she should have stepped in to at least attempt to stop it.
Edit: And if she didn't think they were going too far, either they weren't or she would be liable as well.
I don't know that they had too. Pepper spray is a mother.
And the resistance wasn't very impressive.
Pepper spray is a mother.
Nimnim
The Nim
If he were the rule rat her than the exception, you may have a point.
Check out other instances of pepper spraying and let me know what happens in the vast majority of instances. In Eric Gardner's case we'll simply never know.
Nimnim
The Nim
I agree, we'll never know in regards to Gardner. Hell given his medical troubles pepper spray may have caused his asthma to flare up to the point he died as well.
The point I'd like to make is the police never know what is going to happen much like the rest of us don't. There is no non-lethal use of force, only intended less than lethal because something can always happen that no one expected that makes it lethal. They attempt to enforce the law and protect themselves and others in the vicinity.There's so many variables that can influence what's going on the police have to make judgment calls many of us would never want to make.
I won't say what happened was right, but given what I've heard about it, I can't say there was malicious intent leading to brutality.
UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)
Well-Known Member
The cops went too far and the grand jury did not do their job. I would feel the same regardless of race, creed or color.
realbrown1
Annoy a liberal today. Hit them with facts.
There always seems to be 1 major factor in all these deaths that people just never mention.
DON'T RESIST ARREST. All of the deaths come from that. And who's at fault for resisting arrest? The perp. These guys bring it on themselves. Stop making them martyrs.
moreluck
golden ticket member
Enforcing the law ?......change the law if it's not to your liking.
I've now hear 4 different people say it was not a chokehold.....it was a takedown.
The guy was in poor physical shape and didn't survive the encounter. The cops were not aware of his physical issues. It was just a matter of size.
If he didn't participate in illegal activity and not resisted, this would not have happened. 30-31 arrests shows he was into the criminal stuff. I have no arrests in my long past. I know how to say "yes sir/maam" when told what to do by the police.
Nimnim
The Nim
The job of the grand jury is to determine if the evidence provided to them is enough for the charges presented. We have not seen the evidence provided nor know what charges they were asked to asses the evidence against. We can argue the police went to far, but we don't have anywhere near the information to say the grand jury didn't do their job.
The problem I have with the grand jury system is the evidence presented to them is not automatically put into the public records for the rest of us to view and form a proper opinion like the grand jury is supposed to.
realbrown1
Annoy a liberal today. Hit them with facts.
When I was in the army, we were tear gassed for training numerous times. It's not that bad. All that training with tear gas was to help us get into our chemicle protection suits as fast as possible while being gassed. After a few times, most soldiers just took their sweet time getting their suits on because you begin to realize after a few times of having tear gas grenades thrown at you, that it's just not that bad.
And pepper spray is weaker. It has to be sprayed into or around the eyes to be effective.
Bottom line is Gardner shouldn't have resisted arrest. You get hell brought down upon you when you do that. Just look at the above video as proof of that. It's the cops JOB to NOT LET PEOPLE RESIST BEING ARRESTED.
moreluck
golden ticket member
Warning letter = "stop, hands up, don't resist etc "
wkmac
Well-Known Member
First off I make no distinction between a so-called liberal or so-called conservative mayor. Both may differ in narrative but they fully agree on the ground in action. That said.
As a supporter of the idea of radical free markets myself, Garner IMO was ultimately killed because his free market actions threatened the privileged stores as well as the revenue streams of both the stores (sales) and the state (taxes). Others might catch on and then we'd have.....wait for it......ANARCHY but this time I'm using it in it's true etymological sense.
The police were there to suppress a competitor, thus the potential, who threatened a system that both the stores and the state economically benefit themselves which also limits competition. Competition being a hallmark of any truly free market. I mean just think of the disaster if we had an economy that promoted the idea of individual craftsman, sole proprietorship and entrepreneurism? Who would staff those "dark satanic mills"? Opps!
I fully support Garner's action as I support all such black and gray market economics as a means to undermine the existing monopoly economy and the State which protects it by monopoly force on behalf of privileged business interests. Garner in his own economic way was thus "burning this bitch to the ground" which is an action I wholeheartedly support.
Garner was also exercising his natural rights in seeking what Jefferson in the Declaration of Independence called, "the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness." Jefferson never argued one had to get permission from the State in order to do so. Albeit Jefferson did have his own contradictions.
The idea of any business and state alliance using taxpayer provided goons to violate Jefferson's ideal IMO speaks to the utter rotten core this nation has become.
The late Samuel E. Konkin called this form of radical economics Agorism after the greek word Agora meaning gathering place or assembly where in greek culture ideas, goods, knowledge were openly exchanged and without restriction or ruling oversight. Look up Agorism if you want to know more.
At the link I posted, free market and Austrian economics professor Tom DiLorenzo covers the point even better than I do. Dr. DiLorenzo's comments were in response to these comments made by William Grigg.
I also see where Shock Jock Michael Savage has also condemned the decision not to indict the cop for murdering Garner. Don't always agree with Savage but always liked that he never follows an absolute party line either.
