Production termination!

[705red]

To be honest, whats even worse is that arbitration's are precedent setting. I guess luckily for the majority of us that we are not in local 804.

 

[trickpony1]

It's my understanding that the grievance procedure must be exhausted before the individual can seek the services of an attorney.
If this case has gone to arbitration then I would say the grievance procedure has been exhausted.
I would highly recommend that this individual file with the EEOC claiming discrimination immediately. There has to be other drivers who are over 3-3.5 stops per hour.
If the EEOC finds no fault, they will issue the grievant a "right to sue" letter which pretty much opens the door for an attorney to assist in his case. I would also have the attorney pursue retaliation charges against the company.

 

[beentheredonethat]

Which in my opinion would be great for the grievant. This was a three day arbitration, that is broken down in to a 36 page summary. I'm obviously reading it through glasses worn by a union supporter, but i do not see how the arb could say that his union activity did not play a role in this termination.

Red, let's face it we are all to some extent a bit prejudiced (for lack of a better word) and will take sides be it union or mgmt. That's normal. Again with no knowledge of this story, besides what you wrote down. The moral i take away if I were a teamster, would be don't throw a boatload of rocks if there's a chance part of your house is glass. Are there some mgmt who do the wrong thing and violate the contract? Yeah. Are there some hourlies who do the wrong thing and don't do a fair days pay? Yeah.

Let's face it, the hourly has more to lose in most cases then the company. If I were a driver and decided to become a steward, I'd make damn well sure that there would be nothing on me. Everything by the book.

A lot of this kind of reminds me of the news story tonight over in the Middle East with Israel and the Gaza strip and the Hamas (sp?) Is either side 100% right or 100% wrong. I don't think so, (I'm no foreign expert). But All I see from a distance, is both sides are beating on the other and what you end up with is carnage, death.

That may be a bad analogy since I don't think the UPS \ Teaster is like the current Middle east, I'm just pointing out that fighting isn't always the best answer and coming to understandiing where each side feels like they win, gives us both sides who are happy and with mutual respect. A lot easier said then done.

But I wonder if this person had it all to do over again, knowing what he knows now. I'm willing to bet he'd probably still be a steward and probably still have filed grievances. But I'm also willing to be, he'd have filed less. But just a guesss.

 

[brownrodster]

Correct me if Im wrong but the lawyer would be useless at this point because both sides agree to uphold what the arb. says?

Well now I hope UPS goes and fires every driver on their payroll who happens to miss their sporh by 1.5 stops per hour. Wouldn't have any left. I'm pretty fast, but there are days where it's impossible to meet UPS' goals.

 

[beentheredonethat]

Everyone should be very aware that now that ups has this victory under their belt, you can expect to see many more terminations for productions in the very near future......

CYA!!!!!!!!!!!

Red as someone else wrote here before. Work as if your boss were monitoring each activity. Did you follow methods, Did you follow SWM etc? If so, there shouldn't be anything to worry about. Note this goes for both hourly and mgmt.

Jut my 2 cents......

 

[705red]

But I wonder if this person had it all to do over again, knowing what he knows now. I'm willing to bet he'd probably still be a steward and probably still have filed grievances. But I'm also willing to be, he'd have filed less. But just a guesss.

So the company has created well over a hundred grievances that they have been caught violating, how many did they get away with?

And the steward who was elected to uphold the contract that ups agreed to honor is the bad guy here?

Cmon!!!!!!!!!!!!

Well i wish this driver all the best and i hops he exhausts all of his legal recourse to right this wrong!

 

[pickup]

It's my understanding that the grievance procedure must be exhausted before the individual can seek the services of an attorney.
If this case has gone to arbitration then I would say the grievance procedure has been exhausted.
I would highly recommend that this individual file with the EEOC claiming discrimination immediately. There has to be other drivers who are over 3-3.5 stops per hour.
If the EEOC finds no fault, they will issue the grievant a "right to sue" letter which pretty much opens the door for an attorney to assist in his case. I would also have the attorney pursue retaliation charges against the company.

EEOC is the equal employment opportunity commission which investigates cases where someone is denied a promotion or job or is fired due to age, ethnicity, etc, etc. I don't think eeoc applies here. I think a case must be made to the NLRB , national labor review board. A person can not be fired for his activities pertaining to a union, obviously this is not the stated reason for his dismissal but we all know that's why he was fired. The shop steward has to know this because he has dealt with the nlrb so i'm not saying anything he doesn't know. Hopefully, if he goes this route, that the nlrb will be a little more labor friendly than it has been under our current president .

 

[Coldworld]

In my building the drivers who received production rides had erratic performances in SPOHR and over/under. When they were off utility drivers would routinely out perform them on similar volume days. Hard to imagine a
experienced driver with area knowledge being in this type situation while making an honest effort.

There are some cover drivers who skip their breaks and lunch and also RUN to get done faster....now I know there are a few drivers that are slackers, but dont compare my day to the cover driver doing this BS. If they are running and cutting major corners they will get done quite a bit faster than someone walking at a brisk pace and who takes their lunch... thats not fair.

 

[local804]

Red as someone else wrote here before. Work as if your boss were monitoring each activity. Did you follow methods, Did you follow SWM etc? If so, there shouldn't be anything to worry about. Note this goes for both hourly and mgmt.

Jut my 2 cents......

Like Red said, The member was not a favorite by any means of UPS. He was a very good shop steward and stuck up for the contract and enforced it. From what I understand, he was on a slate also to run for office in November. I really dont think he didnt follow methods and I really cant say what he did or didnt do because I wasnt there. Bottom line is the man had a target on his back and they went after him hard. The ruling was binding but from what I understand, there is one option. It was just a case in arbitration that one person hears 2 stories and makes a ruling. If UPS wants you, they will do anything under the sun to get you, we all know that. Lets just wait and see what happens here.

 

[dilligaf]

I would do as Trick said. Check EEOC. I have won an EEOC before.

http://www.eeoc.gov/



And check through this to. http://www.eeoc.gov/policy/docs/harassment.html

 

[dilligaf]

EEOC is the equal employment opportunity commission which investigates cases where someone is denied a promotion or job or is fired due to age, ethnicity, etc, etc. I don't think eeoc applies here. I think a case must be made to the NLRB , national labor review board. A person can not be fired for his activities pertaining to a union, obviously this is not the stated reason for his dismissal but we all know that's why he was fired. The shop steward has to know this because he has dealt with the nlrb so i'm not saying anything he doesn't know. Hopefully, if he goes this route, that the nlrb will be a little more labor friendly than it has been under our current president .

Actually EEOC and NLRB work hand in hand. EEOC can give a case to NLRB if it is warranted.

 

[pickup]

I would do as Trick said. Check EEOC. I have won an EEOC before.

http://www.eeoc.gov/



And check through this to. http://www.eeoc.gov/policy/docs/harassment.html

I checked your link,states" includes protected activity", so i stand corrected as i stated in earlier post that eeoc doesn't apply but I do know that the nlrb route is also valid for I have a friend who is shop steward in a different industry who was fired once( he was a thorn in the side of the employer on behalf of his fellow workers and went through the nlrb to successfully get his job back. This was a long time ago during the clinton administration. I know when bush got into office that the nlrb shifted sharply towards favoring employers over employees.

 

[pickup]

I was posting while you typed the followup regarding nlrb and eeoc going hand in hand dilligaf. Nice catch. thanks

 

[redshift1]

There are some cover drivers who skip their breaks and lunch and also RUN to get done faster....now I know there are a few drivers that are slackers, but dont compare my day to the cover driver doing this BS. If they are running and cutting major corners they will get done quite a bit faster than someone walking at a brisk pace and who takes their lunch... thats not fair.

The key is, if the driver demonstrates a specific level of performance while the supervisor is on car for consecutive days then it's reasonable to expect that same level of performance when he is by himself. For example if the driver runs 17.5 SPOHR on the ride along and suddenly runs 17.2 SPORH when by himself then there is an obvious problem. As a reminder these rides are done over a period of consecutive days so the statistical samples are more reliable. I cannot recall a production termination in my district usually something else is going on as well this driver in question may have been promoting a contentious and divisive personal agenda very few companies big or small will tolerate that behavior.

 

[trplnkl]

The key is, if the driver demonstrates a specific level of performance while the supervisor is on car for consecutive days then it's reasonable to expect that same level of performance when he is by himself. For example if the driver runs 17.5 SPOHR on the ride along and suddenly runs 17.2 SPORH when by himself then there is an obvious problem. As a reminder these rides are done over a period of consecutive days so the statistical samples are more reliable. I cannot recall a production termination in my district usually something else is going on as well this driver in question may have been promoting a contentious and divisive personal agenda very few companies big or small will tolerate that behavior.

0.3 per hour less is a problem? At the end of a 9 hour day, that is almost 3 stops difference total for the day.

You can't recall one because it's never happened. If something else is the problem as you suggest, why go after the driver over SPORH? Care to give any examples of what you mean by promoting a contentious and divisive personal agenda ?

 

[JimJimmyJames]

For example if the driver runs 17.5 SPOHR on the ride along and suddenly runs 17.2 SPORH when by himself then there is an obvious problem.

If a difference of .3 stops per hour is a major problem than everyone in package is doomed.

Ridiculous.

 

[redshift1]

If a difference of .3 stops per hour is a major problem than everyone in package is doomed.

Ridiculous.

How would you do it then?

 

[redshift1]

0.3 per hour less is a problem? At the end of a 9 hour day, that is almost 3 stops difference total for the day.

You can't recall one because it's never happened. If something else is the problem as you suggest, why go after the driver over SPORH? Care to give any examples of what you mean by promoting a contentious and divisive personal agenda ?

Actively soliciting and inciting dissension between collective parties for
personal benefit.

 

[trplnkl]

Actively soliciting and inciting dissension between collective parties for
personal benefit.

I'm not freakin lawyer...what the heck does that mean?

 

[UPSNewbie]

I'm not freakin lawyer...what the heck does that mean?

Bringing every hourly to his side to fight the good fight against UPS, basically.

I wouldn't know, but it seems like this steward is not doing that. Seems like he was upholding the contract that BOTH UPS and Teamsters agreed upon, making sure all of the employees file for every wrong-doing, instead of laying down and taking it.