Question regarding "job abandonment"

[laffter]

This is a serious question. Please no "try it and let us know" type of answers.

This shouldn't vary by region or supplement, but I could be wrong.

I do understand that leaving in the middle of work without prior agreement constitutes job abandonment and can lead to termination without progressive discipline. (right?)

But, what if you walk into the building, DO NOT "punch in", then leave (people would have seen you walk in). Would this be treated the same and would the union uphold a termination for job abandonment? Or, would this be considered a "no show"?

 

[Indecisi0n]

You walked in but didn't punch in and left with people seeing you and never call out later?

 

[Wally]

Pretty hard to not show, once you are there, no?

 

[FrigidAdCorrector]

But, what if you walk into the building, DO NOT "punch in", then leave (people would have seen you walk in). Would this be treated the same and would the union uphold a termination for job abandonment? Or, would this be considered a "no show"?

Was work done? Because I think that makes it all matter. If you walked in, forgot to punch in, and started working then walked out that may be considered job abandonment. But I'm not exactly sure why you would do either of those things.

 

[laffter]

This is a hypothetical question. I didn't do it, nor did anyone I know do it.

You walk in. People see you walk in. You do not clock in. A few minutes later you leave the building. At no point do you do any work. You do not "call in". Would it still be considered job abandonment?

 

[bleedinbrown58]

This is a serious question. Please no "try it and let us know" type of answers.

This shouldn't vary by region or supplement, but I could be wrong.

I do understand that leaving in the middle of work without prior agreement constitutes job abandonment and can lead to termination without progressive discipline. (right?)

But, what if you walk into the building, DO NOT "punch in", then leave (people would have seen you walk in). Would this be treated the same and would the union uphold a termination for job abandonment? Or, would this be considered a "no show"?

You were scheduled to work. You came in...so it's not a NC/NS. You left without permission....job abandonment.

 

[oldngray]

This is a hypothetical question. I didn't do it, nor did anyone I know do it.

You walk in. People see you walk in. You do not clock in. A few minutes later you leave the building. At no point do do you do any work. You do not "call in". Would it still be considered job abandonment?

If you were scheduled to work it would be a no call/no show. If you clock in then walk out it would be job abandonment. 3 straight no shows is job abandonment also.

 

[oldngray]

You were scheduled to work. You came in...so it's not a NC/NS. You left without permission....job abandonment.

If he never clocked in then he wouldn't have officially been there in my opinion.

 

[laffter]

I was under the impression that clocking in makes all the difference. If you never clock in then, technically, did you ever report to work?

Likewise, if you clock out after you've finished your work and a sup asks you (on your way out of the building) to clock back in and help so and so, don't you have the right or say no and leave?

 

[retiredTxfeeder]

If you are there, seems like you are a "show". If you turn around and leave without calling in a hour before your start time to allow management to cover your work, sounds like a "no call". So I'm calling it a "no call, no work."

 

[bleedinbrown58]

I was under the impression that clocking in makes all the difference. If you never clock in then, technically, did you ever report to work?

Likewise, if you clock out after you've finished your work and a sup asks you (on your way out of the building) to clock back in and help so and so, don't you have the right or say no and leave?

Yes but you were GIVEN permission to clock out the first time. You didnt just decide...Okay I want to be done now...and punch out.

And according to your clock in theory...if I forget to clock in...and work a shift....should I not get paid for my shift because technically "I didn't report to work??

 

[cosmo1]

This was always my fantasy:

Win the lottery two weeks before Christmas, walk in like normal, look at the load on my truck and just walk away.

 

[laffter]

Yes but you were GIVEN permission to clock out the first time. You didnt just decide...Okay I'm done now...and punch out.

Typically, I'm only told when I need to go help someone else, not when I'm free to leave. I generally wrap up and head out on my own.

And according to your clock in theory...if I forget to clock in...and work a shift....should I not get paid for my shift because technically "I didn't report to work??

FrigidAdCorrector makes a good point about work performed. I'd say that's just as important as whether you clocked in or not.


You could very well be right, though. I'm just throwing this out for opinions.

 

[bleedinbrown58]

Typically, I'm only told when I need to go help someone else, not when I'm free to leave. I generally wrap up and head out on my own.



FrigidAdCorrector makes a good point about work performed. I'd say that's just as important as whether you clocked in or not.


You could very well be right, though. I'm just throwing this out for opinions.

I have never clocked out without a sup telling me I could go.

 

[FrigidAdCorrector]

Typically, I'm only told when I need to go help someone else, not when I'm free to leave. I generally wrap up and head out on my own.

I'd change that habit. You should always make sure you are good to go.

FrigidAdCorrector makes a good point about work performed. I'd say that's just as important as whether you clocked in or not.

In my eyes as a supervisor, it does. Especially if I saw you. That to me says you are here and working. Whether or not it would hold up at a panel if you grieve it is anybodys guess. But that's being present and working in my eyes.

 

[clean hairy]

Seems there has to be more to this, who goes to work, walks in the building then decides not work? This makes no sense.
IF, prior to punching in the Sup asks if you want the day off (not enough work) then not a problem.
BUT, if you are scheduled to work that day, show up but decide you do not wish to work, that would be an unexcused abscene the way I see it.
At the very least, speak to Managment before leaving, as one of the others who saw you could claim you said "the (bleep) with this place, I am gone" which could then be construed as a voluntary quit.

 

[FrigidAdCorrector]

I have never clocked out without a sup telling me I could go.

Which is the way to go. About 99.9% of the time everybody knows what they need to do and can go home without asking. But it's that .1% of the time where you will get in hot water.

 

[laffter]

Seems there has to be more to this, who goes to work, walks in the building then decides not work? This makes no sense.
IF, prior to punching in the Sup asks if you want the day off (not enough work) then not a problem.
BUT, if you are scheduled to work that day, show up but decide you do not wish to work, that would be an unexcused abscene the way I see it.
At the very least, speak to Managment before leaving, as one of the others who saw you could claim you said "the (bleep) with this place, I am gone" which could then be construed as a voluntary quit.

I always find it curious when people say there has to be more. Why does it matter what the reasoning behind the action is? The reasoning is only relevant to the person performing the action.

For example, when you "call in" that you're not coming into work, they always ask why. IF it's going to be considered a no show and not a sick day, why does it matter why?

UPS typically doesn't concern itself with reasons. If you're going to be written up for a no show, for example, you're going to be written up whether you had a legitimate reason or not.

I don't believe that "my car won't start" will work as an excuse if they're really serious about people showing up.


Anyway, I'll leave it at this and see if maybe one of the stewards on the forum sees the thread and has an opinion. I'm curious how they'd handle such a situation.

 

[FrigidAdCorrector]

Seems there has to be more to this, who goes to work, walks in the building then decides not work? This makes no sense.
IF, prior to punching in the Sup asks if you want the day off (not enough work) then not a problem.
BUT, if you are scheduled to work that day, show up but decide you do not wish to work, that would be an unexcused abscene the way I see it.
At the very least, speak to Managment before leaving, as one of the others who saw you could claim you said "the (bleep) with this place, I am gone" which could then be construed as a voluntary quit.

If one of my guys told me that happened I would call first. If I got no answer I would clear you and put Rehire "NO" Reason for Leaving "Quit Voluntarily, no notice"

I always find it curious when people say there has to be more. Why does it matter what the reasoning behind the action is? The reasoning is only relevant to the person performing the action.

Okay but who just walks into work and turns right around and leaves? It's like cooking dinner but then just throwing it out when it's ready.

 

[bleedinbrown58]

I always find it curious when people say there has to be more. Why does it matter what the reasoning behind the action is? The reasoning is only relevant to the person performing the action.

For example, when you "call in" that you're not coming into work, they always ask why. IF it's going to be considered a no show and not a sick day, why does it matter why?

UPS typically doesn't concern itself with reasons. If you're going to be written up for a no show, for example, you're going to be written up whether you had a legitimate reason or not.

I don't believe that "my car won't start" will work as an excuse if they're really serious about people showing up.


Anyway, I'll leave it at this and see if maybe one of the stewards on the forum sees the thread and has an opinion. I'm curious how they'd handle such a situation.

The reason is irrelevant. If he didn't have the common courtesy or the balls to go up to his sup and say Something happened....I have to leave now, I can't work today... he obviously doesn't value his job very much.