retirement crisis in america

[rickyb]

We are way off track anyway you started this thread blaming corporations for Americas retirement problem. Please explain why you think this is the case?

Why isn't it an individual's responsibility to spend less than they make?

The problem isn't the person with 3 kids working 2 jobs and scraping by. The problem is the people making 70k that spend every dime they make and never save. The problem is the mom with 7 kids by 5 different dads who lives solely on your and my dime.

worker pay, government policy is all linked to retirement.

the gap you have between productivity and pay to workers is the record corporate profits we've had for 20 years now. capitalism is the problem because workers dont have enough of a say in how the corporations are run. if we had a democratic system, workers would be voting more often at their jobs.

http://thecurrentmoment.files.wordpress.com/2011/08/productivity-and-real-wages.jpg

 

[oldngray]

many of those european countries have done far better than america during the past 7 years. roughly 10 did better. ones like greece and spain they are far worse off having their own great depression. but in spain its hard to compare, i would imagine their safety net to be better than the americans.

america is really strange, its one of the most resource rich countries on earth, and it has some of the worst social programs. america isnt "broke" either. it has the money, it just doesnt tax it. its a political crisis.

Most of Europe has done far worse than the US in recent years. And do you prefer the European system of taxing everything and then relying on government handouts to survive?

 

[rickyb]

Most of Europe has done far worse than the US in recent years. And do you prefer the European system of taxing everything and then relying on government handouts to survive?

the latter is a total myth. and no if u look at the unemployment rates of at least 10 of those european countries it never matched what happened in america. on top of that the safety net is far better so they didnt feel the pain like americans did.

 

[oldngray]

the latter is a total myth. and no if u look at the unemployment rates of at least 10 of those european countries it never matched what happened in america. on top of that the safety net is far better so they didnt feel the pain like americans did.

Look at the real numbers. You are very mistaken.

 

[Brownslave688]

not necessarily. it depends what the company does with the money: they could have less profits, they could charge more to the customer. so in australia they earn $16 USD /hr , and their big macs cost less than $0.50 more than americans who earn half as much per hour.

also recently the costs of things like food keeps rising, but wages dont rise. so that also debunks your idea about wages keeping up with costs of things.



i guarantee you herman cain was under total corporate control just like obama, bush, clinton, bush, and reagan...if everyone pays the same percentage rate on their income tax that is a flat tax.

its important to remember that Franklin Roosevelt created Social Security, Federal Minimum wage, Unemployment Insurance during the great depression when unemployment was 25%. nowadays we have cuts or talks of getting rid of those programs altogether

Look at north Dakota. That's what happens in the USA when you pay a cashier $15 an hour or more. You end up with $8 a gallon milk.

It's also important to note that most now believe FDR policies added many years to the depression.

You sound like you'd like to live in a communist state or at least socialist.

I'm all for cutting military spending and to stop being the worlds police. However that money doesn't need to be given to more people who contribute very little to society.

As much as they like to think they are everyone isn't entitled to a cellphone cable TV a new car or hell even to a comfortable retirement.

 

[rickyb]

Look at the real numbers. You are very mistaken.

yea go do it. the official numbers. im not saying there was countries that were worse. 5 or 6 were worse or comparable to america and some had really good safety nets like france, italy, etc.

http://www.google.ca/publicdata/exp...0&tend=1416988800000&hl=en_US&dl=en&ind=false

 

[Brownslave688]

many of those european countries have done far better than america during the past 7 years. roughly 10 did better. ones like greece and spain they are far worse off having their own great depression. but in spain its hard to compare, i would imagine their safety net to be better than the americans.

america is really strange, its one of the most resource rich countries on earth, and it has some of the worst social programs. america isnt "broke" either. it has the money, it just doesnt tax it. its a political crisis.

You can't cherry pick countries in Europe. If you do that I get to cherry pick states in the USA. Just take out illinois California Michigan and the USA may not look too bad over those 7 years.

Funny the states that did the worst tax the most isn't it?

 

[Brownslave688]

worker pay, government policy is all linked to retirement.

the gap you have between productivity and pay to workers is the record corporate profits we've had for 20 years now. capitalism is the problem because workers dont have enough of a say in how the corporations are run. if we had a democratic system, workers would be voting more often at their jobs.

http://thecurrentmoment.files.wordpress.com/2011/08/productivity-and-real-wages.jpg

They can vote in a union anytime they want.

 

[rickyb]

You can't cherry pick countries in Europe. If you do that I get to cherry pick states in the USA. Just take out illinois California Michigan and the USA may not look too bad over those 7 years.

Funny the states that did the worst tax the most isn't it?

i "cherry picked" developed western european countries. there are more which are not on that list that have done better than america last 7 years like norway.

 

[rickyb]

They can vote in a union anytime they want.

voting for which dictator treats you the best does not make it democratic..;

 

[rickyb]

Look at north Dakota. That's what happens in the USA when you pay a cashier $15 an hour or more. You end up with $8 a gallon milk.

It's also important to note that most now believe FDR policies added many years to the depression.

You sound like you'd like to live in a communist state or at least socialist.

I'm all for cutting military spending and to stop being the worlds police. However that money doesn't need to be given to more people who contribute very little to society.

As much as they like to think they are everyone isn't entitled to a cellphone cable TV a new car or hell even to a comfortable retirement.

please...

north dakota is exactly what the the other states should be doing. it has the only socialist bank in teh country and it has far outperformed the private banksters. the money invested into it is returned to the state treasury. this is a republican state. other states have introduced legislation for the same thing.

http://www.alternet.org/corporate-a...lism-doing-so-darn-well-deep-red-north-dakota

FDR hired 12 million americans close to 10% of the population back then. he did the rational thing and said if the private sector is unwilling to hire, then the government should do it. if america had a clue nowadays, they would have done the same thing and fixed the crumbling infrastructure, and put in renewable energy. the pain suffered in america was totally unnecessary past 8 years. and no what got america out of a depression was a massive stimulus called world war 2. FDR just eased some of the pain, and was president for 12 years. the main reason he did so good was because there was socialists, communists, and unions in the streets pressuring him with revolution.

 

[Brownslave688]

i "cherry picked" developed western european countries. there are more which are not on that list that have done better than america last 7 years like norway.

You mean Norway with a whole 5 million people?!?!?!? Wow that's smaller than Texas largest city.

You're arguing macroeconomics with microeconomics and you losing pretty bad.

 

[rickyb]

You mean Norway with a whole 5 million people?!?!?!? Wow that's smaller than Texas largest city.

You're arguing macroeconomics with microeconomics and you losing pretty bad.

no im comparing individual developed countries to each other. the aussies and new zealand also did better than the states and are more socialist...canada did better and is more socialist.

 

[oldngray]

please...

north dakota is exactly what the the other states should be doing. it has the only socialist bank in teh country and it has far outperformed the private banksters. the money invested into it is returned to the state treasury. this is a republican state. other states have introduced legislation for the same thing.

http://www.alternet.org/corporate-a...lism-doing-so-darn-well-deep-red-north-dakota

FDR hired 12 million americans close to 10% of the population back then. he did the rational thing and said if the private sector is unwilling to hire, then the government should do it. if america had a clue nowadays, they would have done the same thing and fixed the crumbling infrastructure, and put in renewable energy. the pain suffered in america was totally unnecessary past 8 years. and no what got america out of a depression was a massive stimulus called world war 2. FDR just eased some of the pain, and was president for 12 years. the main reason he did so good was because there was socialists, communists, and unions in the streets pressuring him with revolution.

If you want a snapshot of Europe look at Belgium. The Dutch (Flemish) speaking section in the north is much more capitalist and has a very sound economy. The southern French (Walloons) area is very socialist and an economic mess only surviving by draining resources from the Flemish.

 

[Brownslave688]

If you want a snapshot of Europe look at Belgium. The Dutch (Flemish) speaking section in the north is much more capitalist and has a very sound economy. The southern French (Walloons) area is very socialist and an economic mess only surviving by draining resources from the Flemish.

He can't see no one has agreed with him and while most agree the USA is by no means perfect I think most would agree with me when I say. I sure as hell know it's better than just about all of my other choices.

 

[rickyb]

i say if u want to compare america to another country it should be developed...its easy to say america has 1 of the worst social programs, and also had higher unemployment than most other developed "socialist" countries did.

 

[rickyb]

He can't see no one has agreed with him and while most agree the USA is by no means perfect I think most would agree with me when I say. I sure as hell know it's better than just about all of my other choices.

i dont base my beliefs on how many clueless people agree with me... most of what you said was just talking points. pure rhetoric. just because someone agree with you doesnt make it true.

 

[Brownslave688]

please...

north dakota is exactly what the the other states should be doing. it has the only socialist bank in teh country and it has far outperformed the private banksters. the money invested into it is returned to the state treasury. this is a republican state. other states have introduced legislation for the same thing.

People are free to bank where ever they please. I agree most should choose credit unions and small local banks.

I also believe the big banks should of been allowed to fail. There are thousands and thousands of small banks that were plenty stable enough to buy up the pieces that were left of the big banks.

 

[rickyb]

People are free to bank where ever they please. I agree most should choose credit unions and small local banks.

I also believe the big banks should of been allowed to fail. There are thousands and thousands of small banks that were plenty stable enough to buy up the pieces that were left of the big banks.

its important to note that these were the banks and corporations that were cheering the miracles of privatization and capitalism and free markets, and they were the same banks that came running to the government for bail out money.

 

[Brownslave688]

its important to note that these were the banks and corporations that were cheering the miracles of privatization and capitalism and free markets, and they were the same banks that came running to the government for bail out money.

Hey I agree and the biggest socialist president we have maybe ever had bailed them out. Bush bailed out the auto industry and I didn't believe with that either.