schedule work week question

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

Before you do all of this talking, talk to your shop steward (stewart in some franchises), let him/her do all the talking for you, this way you don't end up putting your foot in your mouth. JMHO

Steve, I really think that it is not going to get to that point. His sup will talk with him, maybe give him a verbal, and that should put the issue to rest. Dave.

 

[over9five]

I was also thinking that HandtasticHands shouldn't even mention this when he reports tomorrow.
Maybe, seeing they didn't even bother to call him Saturday, they forgot they told him to come in.

 

[UnconTROLLed]

Steve, I really think that it is not going to get to that point. His sup will talk with him, maybe give him a verbal, and that should put the issue to rest. Dave.

He should ask before any conversation begins whether or not he is getting disciplined. If the answer is yes, then tell the sup /center manager he's getting a steward. If the answer is no, continue the conversation.

 

[stevetheupsguy]

Steve, I really think that it is not going to get to that point. His sup will talk with him, maybe give him a verbal, and that should put the issue to rest. Dave.

True, that is possible.

He should ask before any conversation begins whether or not he is getting disciplined. If the answer is yes, then tell the sup /center manager he's getting a steward. If the answer is no, continue the conversation.

Lately, I don't make a move without my steward. It's a freaking stugfest over here. Though I did call my center manager today and inform him that my wife was flying out. He said I could take as much time as needed.

 

[UnconTROLLed]

Hands, here is language from the NE supplement. I haven't read your supplement yet but will do either tonight or tomorrow and will get back to you. Here's a link to your regions supplement.

http://tdu.org/files/ups_western_supplement.pdf


Arti 57 sec. 4 (J) Stewards shall be granted super seniority for contract administrative purposes and layoff purposes.

 

[UnconTROLLed]

And also, Western Supplement states that the employer (UPS obviously) must post a seniority list. It's right in the front of the supplement. It makes no mention of the union doing this, so thats probably why your B.A. blew you off. I suggest you talk to your friend/T sup on the preload, and if that doesn't hlep locating this list, go higher up or talk to local HR.

 

[HandtasticHands]

And also, Western Supplement states that the employer (UPS obviously) must post a seniority list. It's right in the front of the supplement. It makes no mention of the union doing this, so thats probably why your B.A. blew you off. I suggest you talk to your friend/T sup on the preload, and if that doesn't hlep locating this list, go higher up or talk to local HR.

UPDATE::: sup guys, just wanted to give u guys all an update for thos who chimed in on my thread, and thanks for everyone then did. i had no talk with any sup today, monday may 11, 2009. i guess 1 day down, 9 more business days to go tell the coast is clear =)

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hey Sleeve, you're a man of ur word. u said u were going to follow up with me in the topic i posted, much respect to you. also just to let u know (and brownman15) i requested everything in writing at the union hall today. i had them make a copy of it and stamp it. i didn't receive all that i ask for (yet) but i did end up receiving my local bylaw's and the IBT constitution. so thats a start.
also just to make a quick point and statement, Sleeve. the company gives the union a detail list of seniority of all employees, and by classification. i already tried getting it through the division manager, labor manager and both referred me to my B.A. who was present at time of that request. both management and my B.A. are refusing to give me that seniority list. i havent tried the avenue of going through HR. but thats definitely the direction im going to next, as soon as tomorrow.

quick question to u Sleeve, about "super seniority." is that language in ur eastern region supplement? not sure if u have a separate and independent contract from the national agreement like 705 in your local. as you know im covered under the western supplement and we have no separate or independent contact from the national agreement. so in the NMA ours only goes up to Article 45. im just curious, thanks.


Hands.

 

[UnconTROLLed]

UPDATE::: sup guys, just wanted to give u guys all an update for thos who chimed in on my thread, and thanks for everyone then did. i had no talk with any sup today, monday may 11, 2009. i guess 1 day down, 9 more business days to go tell the coast is clear =)

- - - - - - - -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

hey Sleeve, you're a man of ur word. u said u were going to follow up with me in the topic i posted, much respect to you. also just to let u know (and brownman15) i requested everything in writing at the union hall today. i had them make a copy of it and stamp it. i didn't receive all that i ask for (yet) but i did end up receiving my local bylaw's and the IBT constitution. so thats a start.
also just to make a quick point and statement, Sleeve. the company gives the union a detail list of seniority of all employees, and by classification. i already tried getting it through the division manager, labor manager and both referred me to my B.A. who was present at time of that request. both management and my B.A. are refusing to give me that seniority list. i havent tried the avenue of going through HR. but thats definitely the direction im going to next, as soon as tomorrow.

quick question to u Sleeve, about "super seniority." is that language in ur eastern region supplement? not sure if u have a separate and independent contract from the national agreement like 705 in your local. as you know im covered under the western supplement and we have no separate or independent contact from the national agreement. so in the NMA ours only goes up to Article 45. im just curious, thanks.


Hands.

Hey Hands,
Our supplement , New England supplement, has the language regarding stewards.

I definitly think they're trying to pull the wool over your eyes on this one. I don't have much exp. though, and not a union rep or anything. There are quite a few stewards that post here, most know there stuff. I wonder if 705Red could chime in on these questions, he definitely could help you.

The supplement clearly states that you should be able to see a seniority list and it's made "easily accessible" by UPS. If it isn't and neither side is going to cooperate, then I am not sure what avenue to take, but it's clearly a big problem. Especially since you are laid off and other 22.3s with less seniority are working.

 

[stevetheupsguy]

I think the 10 days will come and go and Hands will have worried about nothing. JMHO

 

[Dustyroads]

I've discovered that sups at work have memory problems brought on by working in a continual crisis situation. although this was a huge thing to you, hands, you worried about it all weekend, and probably still do, however, your sup has had so many problems since then, he's pretty much forgotten it. Maybe he didn't even recall asking you to be there for the clusterruck.

 

[Livin the Dream?]

Handy, you are making this way too complicated.

+1


What a perfect example of making a mountain out of, well, not even a molehill, making a mountain out of nothing.

You were asked to work, you said yes, you didn't show. Steve nailed it as well, it will depend on the Sup's mood what happens, but, thankfully, you missed a Saturday, and there is a day in between to Monday. This is like 4 years in SUP years, and you won't hear anything.

Why get the contract language, stewards (stewarts) involved at all? You screwed up, no big deal, move forward & sin no more.

 

[stevetheupsguy]

+1


What a perfect example of making a mountain out of, well, not even a molehill, making a mountain out of nothing.

You were asked to work, you said yes, you didn't show. Steve nailed it as well, it will depend on the Sup's mood what happens, but, thankfully, you missed a Saturday, and there is a day in between to Monday. This is like 4 years in SUP years, and you won't hear anything.

Why get the contract language, stewards (stewarts) involved at all? You screwed up, no big deal, move forward & sin no more.

I hope you carry a license for absolution of sins.

 

[HandtasticHands]

+1


What a perfect example of making a mountain out of, well, not even a molehill, making a mountain out of nothing.

You were asked to work, you said yes, you didn't show. Steve nailed it as well, it will depend on the Sup's mood what happens, but, thankfully, you missed a Saturday, and there is a day in between to Monday. This is like 4 years in SUP years, and you won't hear anything.

Why get the contract language, stewards (stewarts) involved at all? You screwed up, no big deal, move forward & sin no more.

i just want to touch up on something... i wasnt "asked" to work. i was mandated to work and what am i suppose to say. no, i have a problem with working as directed or no, i have a problem with complying with instructions?? why would i be defiant when i have nothing to be defiant of. they told me i had to work. management has every right to do so. so i told them ok no problem. because its not. further more i was told of this mandate the week before not the week of the schedule work date. it wasnt posted in my start time and week schedule to report on Saturday, and also i wasnt told verbally the day before Saturday. i think everybody pretty much got that clear.
i feel like im stressing that point a little to much. so i can see why it seems like im worried or paranoid =) but im not, really. i acknowledge that i was aware that they instructed me to work the day before mother day, and i take responsibility for my negligence. all i was asking was if they want to document it. does it hold merit based on the information/facts i have given. everybody that chimed in had a different view of things whether it was in my favor or not. i just appreciate everyone who took the time to respond, thanks.
lastly though, i wish i had reported to work. cause i dont have a problem working saturdays. its easy money, u got like 4 hours to deliver a 12pm commit time. compared to during the regular work week were u got about an hour and a half by the time u make it to ur area with the same number of stops. =)


Hands.

 

[HandtasticHands]

I think the 10 days will come and go and Hands will have worried about nothing. JMHO

UPDATE:: 2 days down 8 to go.


Steve, i would have to be in agreement with you...besides i investigated my case a little more.through networking with my peers. theres fellow co-workers who are in the same position as myself. who have the option to drive on saturday but elect not too. who where not mandated to work this passed saturday, not verbally nor put on the saturday driving list (meaning to report to work on saturday).based on the seniority i am senior to 3 who were not mandated (and thats only 3 to whom i know of if there was any other violation).if scheduling needs cannot be met, management may force qualified employees in reverse seniority order.and it appears it wasnt done in this case. management still has the right to write me up if the like. but i think its pretty much case closed.

brownman15, was right in the 1st response, "file a grievance" and i will. thanks brown =)

P.S. i wont continue doing the countdown lol. if management writes me up. i'll post it.


Hands.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

File a grievance on what? You were told that you would be mandated to work on so-called "Super Saturdays" and you agreed to do so. You were told one week prior to this past Saturday that you would be needed and you agreed. You "forgot" and didn't show up.

Personal responsiblity is something I take very seriously and have worked hard to instill in both of my children.

 

[stevetheupsguy]

File a grievance on what? You were told that you would be mandated to work on so-called "Super Saturdays" and you agreed to do so. You were told one week prior to this past Saturday that you would be needed and you agreed. You "forgot" and didn't show up.

Personal responsiblity is something I take very seriously and have worked hard to instill in both of my children.

And, what's his name.

 

[705red]

Hey Hands,
Our supplement , New England supplement, has the language regarding stewards.

I definitly think they're trying to pull the wool over your eyes on this one. I don't have much exp. though, and not a union rep or anything. There are quite a few stewards that post here, most know there stuff. I wonder if 705Red could chime in on these questions, he definitely could help you.

The supplement clearly states that you should be able to see a seniority list and it's made "easily accessible" by UPS. If it isn't and neither side is going to cooperate, then I am not sure what avenue to take, but it's clearly a big problem. Especially since you are laid off and other 22.3s with less seniority are working.

https://web.archive.org/web/20090412144231/http://www.tdu.org/node/2951

ARTICLE 16.
LEAVE OF ABSENCE
Section 1​

The Employer agrees to grant the necessary time off, without discrimination or loss of seniority rights and without pay, to any
employee designated by the Union to attend a labor convention or serve in any capacity on other official business, provided fortyeight
(48) hours written notice is given to the Employer, by the Union, specifying length of time off. The Union agrees that, in making
its request for time off for Union activities, due consideration shall be given to the number of employees affected in order that there
shall be no disruption of the Employer’s operations due to lack of available employees.
A Union member elected or appointed to serve as a Union official shall be granted a leave of absence during the period of such​

employment, without discrimination or loss of seniority rights, and without pay.

We do not have super seniority in our contract and as long as we give 48 hours notice we receive the day or days off.

As to the 22.3s being laid off we have filed for everyone on them here. UPS is laying off by job description and not full time seniority within the classification. I would file a grievance for being laid if there are junior 22.3s working.

 

[UnconTROLLed]

Sorry Red, my posts were not related to the Hands original thread.

We had a chat, and Hands was laid off from his 22.3 in the Western Region. The B.A. said "tough chit" basically and has been unhelpful. There are junior 22.3s working and he has filed grievance on it. It has been bounced up and back down, apparently. One junior 22.3 working is a steward. Here in NE, stewards are not laid off and I posted the language for super seniority. Apparently most regions don't work that way. Anyway I figured that would be why one of the at least 3 junior 22.3s are working ahead of him, but the others aren't stewards anyway.

His supplement indicates that a seniority list must be posted in an area easily visible to all employees. Hands asked for this list and the B.A. said he cannot see it. The question I have is, if UPS and the union both will not adhere to the contract or supplement, what should one do? This is a good learning lesson for me personally, I wouldn't know where to take that type of situation.

It seems to be the union there is selling the members out (likely "certain" ones) from what I can see. there is no reason that Hands should not be able to bump into someone elses 22.3 bid and the junior 22.3 is laid off until "volume returns"

 

[705red]

Sorry Red, my posts were not related to the Hands original thread.

We had a chat, and Hands was laid off from his 22.3 in the Western Region. The B.A. said "tough chit" basically and has been unhelpful. There are junior 22.3s working and he has filed grievance on it. It has been bounced up and back down, apparently. One junior 22.3 working is a steward. Here in NE, stewards are not laid off and I posted the language for super seniority. Apparently most regions don't work that way. Anyway I figured that would be why one of the at least 3 junior 22.3s are working ahead of him, but the others aren't stewards anyway.

His supplement indicates that a seniority list must be posted in an area easily visible to all employees. Hands asked for this list and the B.A. said he cannot see it. The question I have is, if UPS and the union both will not adhere to the contract or supplement, what should one do? This is a good learning lesson for me personally, I wouldn't know where to take that type of situation.

It seems to be the union there is selling the members out (likely "certain" ones) from what I can see. there is no reason that Hands should not be able to bump into someone elses 22.3 bid and the junior 22.3 is laid off until "volume returns"

Our language allows a laid off employee the right to bump a junior fulltime employee within the district except feeder drivers. They are allowed to bump a junior feeder driver in our local area which covers 3 districts.

If the union wont hear him or represent him he should really understand his contract language and if its being violated then he should file a complaint with the NLRB and DOL.
http://www.nlrb.gov/
http://www.dol.gov/

 

[Billy Boxtosser]

If the supe is happy on Monday, no write up. If the supe is sad on Monday, warning letter. Does that help?

Makes perfect sense to me!!