Smith and Thornton's Laugh-In

[vantexan]

With all due respect I have no idea why you guys are debating the how and why of trying to figure out what kind of raises they hand out. The day of yearly raises is over. That's gone. Memphis has set a precedent in the last 5 years that they will give out raises when they want and how they want and if they decide they don't want to, well too friggan bad. There's the door. Don't let it hit ya where the good lord split ya. That's the main reason I'm gone from this company in the next 3 months. We are all at FedEx or any job for that matter for the money.

My personal belief with the way they have handled the lack of raises the last few years, was they had a well thought out calculated plan. They stop handing out yearly raises altogether or hand them out very sporadically (one every 3-5 years). The topped out couriers eventually retire or quit or are fired. And no courier at FedEx ever makes that kind of wage again.

Are you actually a courier? In the last 5 years, 2008-2012, they only had one year that they didn't give a raise. Three years the raise was either 2% or 2.5% based on seniority, and in 2012 they gave 3% to topped out employees, and either 3, 5, or 6% to midrange employees based on where you were in the pay range. Which appears to be what they will be doing in October.

 

[Ricochet1a]

...but there is a new system in place.

If there is a 'system' in place, what is your raise in October going to be???

You can't answer this, since there is NO 'system' - only a decision cycle by Express management as to whether to give a raise or not. That's not a 'system'. Up until 2008, there was a system. Employees could look in PRISM and index their performance review score with the raise they would receive. That was a system. It wasn't much, but it did qualify as a 'system', since it had PREDICTABILITY for the employee. There hasn't been any predictability since 2009 - thus no system is in place.

The big question isn't whether there's a new raise system, but rather will they continue to raise starting and topped out pay. If so then it's just a farce for mid-range employees.

No, that isn't the 'big question' - since there isn't a system. The big question is whether Express will decide that it can get away with throwing out a few percentage points at intervals they decide upon, or whether they will be forced to bargain with employees in regards to the raises which will be MANDATED by contract. That is the only big question.

I'm still laughing by butt off....

 

[vantexan]

If there is a 'system' in place, what is your raise in October going to be???

You can't answer this, since there is NO 'system' - only a decision cycle by Express management as to whether to give a raise or not. That's not a 'system'. Up until 2008, there was a system. Employees could look in PRISM and index their performance review score with the raise they would receive. That was a system. It wasn't much, but it did qualify as a 'system', since it had PREDICTABILITY for the employee. There hasn't been any predictability since 2009 - thus no system is in place.



No, that isn't the 'big question' - since there isn't a system. The big question is whether Express will decide that it can get away with throwing out a few percentage points at intervals they decide upon, or whether they will be forced to bargain with employees in regards to the raises which will be MANDATED by contract. That is the only big question.

I'm still laughing by butt off....

I'm at less than 50% of range so my raise will be 3%, 54 cents. It's not rocket science man. It's clearly posted in stations with an explanation of how it works. Obviously FedEx can delay it, deny it, defer it, but if they are giving raises, this is how they say they are doing it. And since there's no union to negotiate with them, we have to just accept it as is or leave. You can wax poetic about what a union can do for us, but since there isn't one we have to take what we get.

 

[MrFedEx]

On the official notification that the March raise had been deferred to October it states that the annual raise will now take place in October. The new raise system has been posted in stations with explanation of how it works. Sorry if you don't believe it, but then others on here weren't even aware that it had been posted. I'm not thrilled about it being deferred to October, and it's not an adequate raise system, but there is a new system in place. The big question isn't whether there's a new raise system, but rather will they continue to raise starting and topped out pay. If so then it's just a farce for mid-range employees.

It's all crap. How many millions will they save by "deferring" it? That's just another 6 months for Fred to make more money off what he'd be giving us, which would undoubtedly be a pittance anyway. Our increased medical costs have us at around -3% for the year already. Oh, and this shaves a few million off the $1.7B Fred is supposed to be saving with all of the new and efficient programs at Express...like DRA.

Come October, we will likely get nothing, because they "won't be able to afford it". The failure (so far) of DRA will be a big part of that. I don't see them getting it straightened-out by October, so stiffing us will be compeletely "justified". After all, it's going to be our fault if DRA fails, not theirs, right?

 

[Ricochet1a]

So let's get this 'sorted out' (since I'm no longer in, I can't take a look at a station bulletin board)....

Does Express have a document posted or otherwise in existence, that states that come October, employees will receive "X" percent raise?

All those in management positions that I've corresponded to or talked with have CATEGORICALLY stated, that they have no idea what if ANY pay raise will be given to the wage employees this October. They were merely told in an email that there wasn't going to be a pay action in March, and that in October a POSSIBLE pay action may occur.

NO percentages, NO nothing. Merely a 'a decision will be made come October'. That was it.

That ISN'T a system, it is merely throwing out what they feel they can get away with.

 

[MrFedEx]

So let's get this 'sorted out' (since I'm no longer in, I can't take a look at a station bulletin board)....

Does Express have a document posted or otherwise in existence, that states that come October, employees will receive "X" percent raise?

All those in management positions that I've corresponded to or talked with have CATEGORICALLY stated, that they have no idea what if ANY pay raise will be given to the wage employees this October. They were merely told in an email that there wasn't going to be a pay action in March, and that in October a POSSIBLE pay action may occur.

NO percentages, NO nothing. Merely a 'a decision will be made come October'. That was it.

That ISN'T a system, it is merely throwing out what they feel they can get away with.

I have seen nothing, which means no guarantees. Pretty much what you said...what they feel they can get away with.

 

[Ricochet1a]

So that leaves me to ask our heroic poster, "What is the date on that document you reference?"

I HIGHLY suspect this document was placed on whatever bulletin board LAST YEAR, to explain the raises which were given in March 2012, and was LEFT UP. Leading some.... to think that a 'system' was in place.

Get the date on the document....

 

[MAKAVELI]

So let's get this 'sorted out' (since I'm no longer in, I can't take a look at a station bulletin board)....

Does Express have a document posted or otherwise in existence, that states that come October, employees will receive "X" percent raise?

All those in management positions that I've corresponded to or talked with have CATEGORICALLY stated, that they have no idea what if ANY pay raise will be given to the wage employees this October. They were merely told in an email that there wasn't going to be a pay action in March, and that in October a POSSIBLE pay action may occur.

NO percentages, NO nothing. Merely a 'a decision will be made come October'. That was it.

That ISN'T a system, it is merely throwing out what they feel they can get away with.

You would be correct R1a, but for some reason van seems to think the" new raise system" is actually a contract and FedEx will not change it. They have already shown that they can and will change the raise system to suit their needs. Everyone one knows this except van who is in denial for some reason.

 

[Ricochet1a]

You would be correct R1a, but for some reason van seems to think the" new raise system" is actually a contract and FedEx will not change it. They have already shown that they can and will change the raise system to suit their needs. Everyone one knows this except van who is in denial for some reason.

That is what I'm trying to illustrate. A 'system' requires predictability. The wage employees don't have that.

There was a system used up to 2008. In the years leading up to 2008, Express did indeed change the percentages given and the frequency at which raises were given. But it had the element of predictability. An employee could look in PRISM, cross index their review score, and get the pay raise they were going to receive in March. No being jerked around, no "we'll let you know". The employees knew what to expect.

That disappeared in 2009. Getting nothing one year, then 2% the next, then 2.5%, then something indexed to pay progression, then an announcement "sorry, no raises this March yet again".

The only thing 'systemic' to that, is that no one knows what the hell they'll get. If one wants to call that a system, have at it. It appears our hero thinks that is a system.

 

[vantexan]

So let's get this 'sorted out' (since I'm no longer in, I can't take a look at a station bulletin board)....

Does Express have a document posted or otherwise in existence, that states that come October, employees will receive "X" percent raise?

All those in management positions that I've corresponded to or talked with have CATEGORICALLY stated, that they have no idea what if ANY pay raise will be given to the wage employees this October. They were merely told in an email that there wasn't going to be a pay action in March, and that in October a POSSIBLE pay action may occur.

NO percentages, NO nothing. Merely a 'a decision will be made come October'. That was it.

That ISN'T a system, it is merely throwing out what they feel they can get away with.

There's a notification posted at my station giving all the usual corporate double talk about needing to defer the raise until October. It states that the annual raise from now on will occur in October. Last year, and it's still posted, they came up with a new payraise system. It's not much of a system, takes forever to get to better raises, only rewards those who spend a long time with FedEx and it's not much of a reward. But it is a new system. And I've seen it posted in two stations. I can remember back when we were getting up to a 7% raise based on our review and every year I'd hear couriers ask if we were getting raises this year? Same people would act shocked to learn they had a pension at FedEx. And no clue as to the formula for determining their pension benefit. So I'm not shocked that people are unaware of this. I've even explained to mgrs in the past how the pension plan worked. Had one tell me that if you don't stay all the way until 55 you don't get a pension. Had no idea how vesting worked.

 

[vantexan]

That is what I'm trying to illustrate. A 'system' requires predictability. The wage employees don't have that.

There was a system used up to 2008. In the years leading up to 2008, Express did indeed change the percentages given and the frequency at which raises were given. But it had the element of predictability. An employee could look in PRISM, cross index their review score, and get the pay raise they were going to receive in March. No being jerked around, no "we'll let you know". The employees knew what to expect.

That disappeared in 2009. Getting nothing one year, then 2% the next, then 2.5%, then something indexed to pay progression, then an announcement "sorry, no raises this March yet again".

The only thing 'systemic' to that, is that no one knows what the hell they'll get. If one wants to call that a system, have at it. It appears our hero thinks that is a system.

Just so you know, if one is below the midway point in the pay range, he gets 3%. If his current pay is in the 3rd quartile, he gets 5%. If he is in the 4th quartile, he gets 6% but can't go over the current top out amount. The problem with this "system" is if either starting pay or top out is increased, the midpoint of the pay range moves up too. So those in the lower half will be seeing 3% raises for a very long time. It's essentially rigged. I think they are content with this idea as they know they have to give people something to keep them at it and reduce turnover. 3% barely covers inflation and increased healthcare costs. If even.

 

[Ricochet1a]

... Last year, and it's still posted, they came up with a new payraise system. ... But it is a new system.

That notice that was posted LAST YEAR (I read a copy of that) was merely explaining the pay action which would occur in March 2012 - that was it. It in no way referenced ANY sort of permanence. TO THE CONTRARY, the announcement was accompanied by a statement that those beyond 50% progression were to be given either the "2 or 3% bonus" as a way to "accelerate their top out". Bullsheet. It was Express attempting to throw some extra scratch at those in high progression to get them to be a bit less agitated.

This year they weren't too concerned...

That document applied to March 2012 ONLY. It stated CLEARLY that the 'bonus' received by those past 50% progression 'could not be guaranteed in future pay actions'.

Tell you what. Go ahead and copy that document, scan it, then post it here. If there is anything in that document which was posted LAST YEAR which references any sort of permanence or establishment of a 'systemic' nature to pay actions, I'll eat a plate of crow.

 

[MAKAVELI]

... Last year, and it's still posted, they came up with a new payraise system. ... But it is a new system.

That notice that was posted LAST YEAR (I read a copy of that) was merely explaining the pay action which would occur in March 2012 - that was it. It in no way referenced ANY sort of permanence. TO THE CONTRARY, the announcement was accompanied by a statement that those beyond 50% progression were to be given either the "2 or 3% bonus" as a way to "accelerate their top out". Bullsheet. It was Express attempting to throw some extra scratch at those in high progression to get them to be a bit less agitated.

This year they weren't too concerned...

That document applied to March 2012 ONLY. It stated CLEARLY that the 'bonus' received by those past 50% progression 'could not be guaranteed in future pay actions'.

Tell you what. Go ahead and copy that document, scan it, then post it here. If there is anything in that document which was posted LAST YEAR which references any sort of permanence or establishment of a 'systemic' nature to pay actions, I'll eat a plate of crow.

Not only was it a ploy to pacify those over 50% progression, it cut the raises below 50% in half. Which only pissed off anyone under 10 years. They only moved money from the lower and midrange to the top. This " system" was the most idiotic I have seen anywhere I have worked.

 

[Route 66]

Friends and colleagues, here's DRA - the next Zapmail, HotelPak and Sunday Service all rolled into one!

don't forget SSS....everybody remember that one? That got Express some unwanted exposure on 20/20 as I recall.

 

[whenIgetthere]

don't forget SSS....everybody remember that one? That got Express some unwanted exposure on 20/20 as I recall.

How about that service about 9 or 10 years ago, where a customer could drop off a package at the station until about 2000, and an employee would run it to the ramp. This was an hour after the last CTV and shuttle had left for the ramp at my location. We had one guy who would run them in, wound up getting about 2-1/2 or 3 hours a night to run one package to the ramp! That was a success!

 

[ManInBrown]

So let's get this 'sorted out' (since I'm no longer in, I can't take a look at a station bulletin board)....

Does Express have a document posted or otherwise in existence, that states that come October, employees will receive "X" percent raise?

No. Nothing is promised in October. There was a pamphlet distributed last Friday and in it MT3 states that come October it will be re-evaluated. No promise of any raise.

 

[thedownhillEXPRESS]

It's all crap. How many millions will they save by "deferring" it? That's just another 6 months for Fred to make more money off what he'd be giving us, which would undoubtedly be a pittance anyway. Our increased medical costs have us at around -3% for the year already. Oh, and this shaves a few million off the $1.7B Fred is supposed to be saving with all of the new and efficient programs at Express...like DRA.

Come October, we will likely get nothing, because they "won't be able to afford it". The failure (so far) of DRA will be a big part of that. I don't see them getting it straightened-out by October, so stiffing us will be compeletely "justified". After all, it's going to be our fault if DRA fails, not theirs, right?

There will be a man on mars before they get DRA even remotely straightened out.

 

[ManInBrown]

Are you actually a courier?

Uhhhh....Yes unfortunately I am. Was it only one year in last 5? The raises are such a joke(3% to a 10+ year employee who isnt even at mid-range) that seemed like more were skipped then 1. I distinctly remember one year only getting 2%? Pretty sure that was across the board for everyone. It's such a miserable company to work for all the years blend together

 

[FedUpRTD]

Not being in the courier world anymore (thank you Jesus!), what is DRA?

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

DRA--think of it as "Delivering for Dummies". Our version is PAS/EDD.