so how should performance issues be handled?

UnconTROLLed

perfection
Are they doing the SPORH thing in your area to?

Me having a 19 or greater SPORH for 3 days in a row was one of the requirements of me qualifying 30 day last year. The only time 19 SPORH was done on this route(this told to me by an on-car) was by a seasonal cover driver who worked lunches and breaks. Steward did not have any problem with it.
 

SWORDFISH

Well-Known Member
Me having a 19 or greater SPORH for 3 days in a row was one of the requirements of me qualifying 30 day last year. The only time 19 SPORH was done on this route(this told to me by an on-car) was by a seasonal cover driver who worked lunches and breaks. Steward did not have any problem with it.

I would have had a problem w/ it.
 
Sounds like the union is not fighting this performance issue too much. Makes me curious..

Isn't it straight up harrassment if you are held to impossible standards?? Your load is perfect, preload goes down smooth, no misloads... And that is all taken care of before you even clock in. This harrassment doesn't even include all the things that occur on road. Heel kicking, red zone curb and double parking encouragement, encouragement of blocking driveways, break time dictation, that list goes on and on and on.

This is HARASSMENT. Why isn't it being fought harder?? Just the load massaging and no misload issue should be enough to deem every load invalid. We are all going to be held to performance numbers that are unrealistic. We need to fight back.

Our union is encouraging the use of all methods, including safe parking selection and calling in for help with over 70's.
 

beatupbrown

Well-Known Member
When I had an OJS ride the stupid visor would only pick days that my load was easy. I would not let him hold the door open took my full lunch down to the minute he tried to get me to leave early I said no I go off of diad time. He tried to get me to speed I refused told him that is against the law, what A ride it was.:peaceful:
 

lmd557

counting down to retire
those "tools" must be used consistantly across the board with everyone by management in order for them to be effective.
 

tieguy

Banned
When I had an OJS ride the stupid visor would only pick days that my load was easy. I would not let him hold the door open took my full lunch down to the minute he tried to get me to leave early I said no I go off of diad time. He tried to get me to speed I refused told him that is against the law, what A ride it was.:peaceful:

you are soooooooooooooo clever. were you patting yourself on the back as you typed this?
 

Theichii

Well-Known Member
i woke up monday and decided i really wanted to work, so i took about 20 more stops than needed for 8 hours and worked till 2300 and was 1.8 over. Tuesday about 25 more than needed worked till 2200 and was 1.3 over. Wednesday till about 25 mored than needed,worked till 2230 and was .83 over. Thursday took 40 more than needed and worked till 2225 and was 1.11 over. Today i could only have 9 hours so i took that. My center manager told me "If you can't keep your numbers down then next time you slip up...." and he trailed off. I laughed and said i am taking all the work in the building and only running only about an hour over while people are taking 3/5 the stops i'm taking and running 2 hours over you can go to hell. (i was off the clock at this time) The point is, with the miles being the same and the packages being roughly the same the amount of time they gave me varies a ridiculous degree and i think performance issues should be handled by a supervisor that knows the route doing it and being recorded the whole day for a week and the formula for his average during the week should be used. And my steward thinks what my center manager said was a threat...hmmm....
 

just interested

Well-Known Member
Me having a 19 or greater SPORH for 3 days in a row was one of the requirements of me qualifying 30 day last year. The only time 19 SPORH was done on this route(this told to me by an on-car) was by a seasonal cover driver who worked lunches and breaks. Steward did not have any problem with it.

Sleeve~did you move from another position to driver? Wouldn't that other position have counted towards "qualifying". To get the 30 day qualifying - was that how you established seniority in your area?

I heard another person say they busted their a#% just to get his 30 day status complete. After that, he did things the way the company "policies" required.
 

Raw

Raw Member
Me having a 19 or greater SPORH for 3 days in a row was one of the requirements of me qualifying 30 day last year. The only time 19 SPORH was done on this route(this told to me by an on-car) was by a seasonal cover driver who worked lunches and breaks. Steward did not have any problem with it.
Used to be the driver`s 3 day ride established the SPOHR, now they have the SPORH set before the ride? :dissapointed:
 

Magnus

Well-Known Member
From what I’ve seen during Peak (I was a helper for two years), it boils down to being a “Runner” or a “Slacker” – there’s no allowances for the “in-between” to Management (to them, it’s purely black and white, with no other considerations besides “volume and numbers”). “Runners” are the guys who cut every single corner they can, especially safety corners, and the “slackers” are the guys that take to heart what Management pounds into their (and Helper’s) heads about safety this and safety that – and that “YOU’RE NOT ALLOWED TO GET HURT!!!”.


“Runners” set the bar higher over the “slackers” making the “slackers” look bad that they can’t do the job as quickly as the “runners” – WHILE keeping things safe and smooth, unlike the “slackers” and so “runners” get all the glory (because their “volume and numbers” look good on paper), while the “slackers” take all the crap and just for doing the job exactly as prescribed by Management (when the unspoken double-speak is left aside).


So, what’s the point I’m trying to make here? Management needs to figure out what the hell they want – SAFE drivers (and helpers) who compromise a bit of speed for safety AND efficiency, OR UNSAFE drivers (and helpers) who cut corners and leave the “safety rules” back at the center, forgotten for their so-called “efficiency” which is just a disastrous set up for some major injuries or accidents someday.

I may have only ever been a Driver Helper the last two Peak Seasons, but we pick things up pretty quickly. We see what you guys see, and we experience it and I can tell you, most of us Helpers think it’s a crap situation that NEEDS some rectification on MANAGEMENT’S end, not the Drivers.


By the way, “Helpers” are used as “Runners”… Management tells us one thing in Orientation, but then they expect unspoken expectations and performance when you’re actually out there doing the job – as in, we’re unknowingly expected TOO cut corners, TOO risk our safety and health, TOO do the job more quickly than is safe or necessary to save a couple cents – TOO ignore the safety rules and TOO disregard everything they trained us to do!!! So I know exactly what the problem is here – it’s the “unspoken rules/unspoken expectations” coupled with absolutely asinine and unrealistically impossible “quotas”.


There needs to be REALISTIC goals and rules, so that we DON’T have to push ourselves so far and so hard to meet these absolutely ridiculous and hazardous quotas that someday, you and us don’t get hurt in the process (breaking rule number one: you are NOT ALLOWED to get hurt!)… no more of this say one thing, mean another crap. The question is here, do they want super-speedy, or do they want super-safety? Because you really CAN’T have both at UPS!


They tell us Helpers in Orientation that we ARE NOT “allowed” to get hurt, because it costs them thousands and thousands of dollars – but then they turn face after you’re “in” and doing the job, to push you to do the EXACT opposite of what they SAID they wanted you to do – or the boogie man will get you!


I’m amazed that all UPSers don’t complain about this crap and strike out to get it changed. Isn’t it these kinds of grievances which the unions are supposed to be PROTECTING you and us from? Lord knows they take enough of our wages to do something, but they’re not doing ANYTHING about these specific problems here – and then UPS big-wigs wonder why there are so many injuries and accidents… BECAUSE of their BS, IMPOSSIBLE expectations that FORCE you guys and Helpers also to cut corners and leave all the safety precautions and procedures out the window!!!


Big Brown, get your act together and make up your mind already! Speedy Volume and numbers, or realistically-paced safety and efficiency! REMEMBER, YOU REALLY CAN’T HAVE BOTH!!! :knockedout:
 

fxdwg

Long Time Member
Simply put..............If they friend**&* up and did so knowingly; theyre gone. If it was an honest mistake; retrain and watch
 

UnconTROLLed

perfection
Used to be the driver`s 3 day ride established the SPOHR, now they have the SPORH set before the ride? :dissapointed:

finally someone got it! yes, exactly. There was a check of 10 or 15 items to qualify. One was demonstrating and maintaining 19 SPORH because the seasonal cover who burned the route did. Steward reviewed it and agreed to the terms.
 

Magnus

Well-Known Member
Magnus, it may come as surprise to you, but it is possible to both work quickly and safely.
I have never seen this in the Center I was located at. I only ever saw the old-timers (with tons of seniority) working safely (and compromising some speed for it), with all the younger drivers working like maniacs (leaving the safety rules out the window because they don't want management on their backs). But that's not going to be my realm anymore soon enough, and who knows it could be different in each center depending on location, volume and the managers involved there.

But, with Management's expectations of 5 seconds a package for handlers (load/unload), I don't see how you could possibly move those packages that quickly without disregarding most, if not all of the safety rules (especially for the first 3 months when you're being watched like a hawk).

I've spoken with many drivers who started out in handling and they all said the same thing: just get it done, however you can and ignore the rest. And that's exactly what I'm going to do, because that's exactly what management wants (no matter how much they shove safety down our throats - it's doublespeak, and they only say if because they HAVE to, not because they want to or because that's actually what they want from you - they want the numbers and the volume HOWEVER you can get them).

In fact, I was on a ride along with a manager (following us around in a separate car) when my other driver went out sick for a week and I was with a brand new, fresh out of training driver, and he never said a word when BOTH of us were forced to disregard the safety rules (full-out running, no contact points on entry/exit [literally jumping into the P7], not cutting the engine off at stops, bulkhead door always open, lifting the packages however you could get them up and out the quickest, most of the time no seatbelts etc. etc. etc.) to get the job done within their mission-impossible time limits!

But this is all just my experience, your experience is likely very different than what I've had. I've only ever seen Peak, and maybe that's the only time of year everybody forgets the rules. I don't know, but I hope it's not going to be that way inside all the time.
 

stucrew

Well-Known Member
Define performance issues? Being over allowed is not a perfromance issue in most cases, its due to a bad time study. I had a driver 3 to 4 hours over every day, with the new time study he is now a bonus to scratch driver with the same route. Unless your willing to go to battle for your drivers with IE just suck it up.

Time study?? Time study?? Oh, I haven't seen one of those in 15 years. The closest we have had to a time study is when one of our bonus drivers bid on a route that had been 1hour overallowed for years. A couple weeks after she got it the center manager found a "glitch" in her routes standards and "fixed" it. She has been bonus ever since. Are you ready to puke now?
 

stucrew

Well-Known Member
Sounds like the union is not fighting this performance issue too much. Makes me curious..

Isn't it straight up harrassment if you are held to impossible standards?? Your load is perfect, preload goes down smooth, no misloads... And that is all taken care of before you even clock in. This harrassment doesn't even include all the things that occur on road. Heel kicking, red zone curb and double parking encouragement, encouragement of blocking driveways, break time dictation, that list goes on and on and on.

This is HARASSMENT. Why isn't it being fought harder?? Just the load massaging and no misload issue should be enough to deem every load invalid. We are all going to be held to performance numbers that are unrealistic. We need to fight back.

You are the union. And I am the union. All of us are the union. When you have a ride and the sup tells you to park where you shouldn't it is up to you to park safely and record the crap that the sup tells you to do that is wrong. You are the driver. That car and your safety is your responsibility. Follow orders but not quickly. Split your lunch and break time into atleast 5 entries (it takes time to stop the car and get out into traffic again). Walk! Always let the sup get there first, after all he doesn't have to do anything but stride. Always go out the passenger door and around the back. Go out and open the rear door everytime you can for bulky stops (it takes more time than you think to descend the passenger steps, walk to the rear and open that rear door, step up and get to the stop on the floor and get it to the rear door and out onto the ground and close that door again. And use the handcart. You have to open the door again to put it in the back and then close the door again. If you have to pee.. do it. It takes time and is not Lunch or Break time. Drive 5Mph under speed limit anytime you can for safety sake.
 
In all my years as a driver I can't remember a sup on a ojs tell me to park in an unsafe place. Why do you think the speed limit posted is unsafe. Guess what, anybody with half a brain can see that you are attempting is nothing more than what I have heard mgmt call "stealing time". It is drivers like you that give the majority of us a bad name.
 
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