Sweet Irony: UPS Salespeople Take Note

tracker2762

Well-Known Member
You cannot possibly know that it is the norm, just as I cannot possibly know that it isn't. Neither of us have a large enough sample size. As I said, I've been hurt, on a couple of occasions actually, and that's not been my experience.

As for the 90 days, consider this. Our government (which certainly isn't the standard to judge by but it's what we have) enacted a law in 1993 giving many employees 84 days of job protection. FedEx has had 90 days of protection for as long as I can remember. Often those 90 days turn into more than that because unless you know that someone is just not coming back, you cannot replace them until after 90 days. There's a minimum of 4 days lead time to post a position. The position is posted for a week and then there's another 30 days at least before the successful employee starts the new job. That's assuming an internal posting. So it's about another 41 days minimum. If the person on leave is expected back after say 100, 110, 120, even 150 days, there's not much point in hiring someone else. I have seen this happen on a number of occasions. Unlike you I am not going to claim it is the norm but it does make sense from both the employee's and FedEx's perspective.

The flip side of this is an employee who is out and there isn't a timeline for their return. At some point you may have to replace them. You cannot simply keep covering their job which for the sake of discussion is most likely a courier position. So when do you draw the line? Another thing to consider is if a station has less volume than the year before, which many have had the last couple of years, routes get cut. Do you tell someone who is ready, willing, able, and at work, sorry your route is cut and we don't have anything for you? Do you tell them this while they are asking about the route that's open because someone is out on disability and has been for four months with no return in sight. Is that the way to treat someone? There are always going to be decisions made and trade-offs happening that positively impact one employee while negatively impacting another. As long as the positives happen more often than the negatives, at least you are on the right track. Obviously if you are the one negatively impacted you would disagree but that doesn't make it the wrong decision. The flip side of this example is a station that has either gained volume or had some employees leave. As the station is most likely hiring somewhat regularly, there will likely be something for the employee to come back to when they can return to work.

I was trying to find out what UPS does as far as the 90 days thing goes. I couldn't find an answer but I did find out that if you are not eligible for FMLA (e.g. not enough hours worked), you only get 42 days of leave and only then after working at least 3 years at UPS. At least FedEx gives you the 90 days regardless of whether you qualify for FMLA or not. My point being there is no perfect solution that covers 100% of the people 100% of the time. It's easy for both of us to take our experiences and say "see what FedEx does" but the reality is that neither one of us is always right.

I guess this is a huge difference between fedex and ups. We've had several drivers come back to work after being out for a year or more. One was work related and the other was personal. When they were able to come back, they were put back in the same spot when they left. I couldn't imagine working for a company that throws you out to pasture like fedex. That's pathetic.
 

quadro

Well-Known Member
I guess this is a huge difference between fedex and ups. We've had several drivers come back to work after being out for a year or more. One was work related and the other was personal. When they were able to come back, they were put back in the same spot when they left. I couldn't imagine working for a company that throws you out to pasture like fedex. That's pathetic.
And FedEx has had employees come back after being out for a year or more. I'd be willing to bet that UPS has had employees out less than 90 days that didn't have a job to come back to. It goes both ways.
 

quadro

Well-Known Member
Whatever. So I can assume you're absolutely in agreement with everything FedEx says and does, right? That's extremely rational.
Nope. I've stated before I don't agree with everything FedEx does.
My arguments are based on many years of experience working for FedEx and from the vast majority of employees I work with and have worked with over the years. Because I'm a 25 year+ employee and have worked at many locations, that's a large number. Sure, some people feel like you do, and I've never denied that.
Your arguments/anecdotes are the same as my arguments/anecdotes inasmuch as they come from 25+ years experience and working in many locations. Neither one of us really has enough data points to prove anything. All we can do is share our experiences and, yes, rationally, debate them.

Your methodology seems to always be the same. If I (or someone else) criticize FedEx or one of their policies, you are on here either defending it or attempting to rationalize it away.
And your methodology is if someone likes FedEx or one of their policies (and states why), you are either dismissing it away or belittling the poster. Doesn't make us very different does it?
FedEx consistently represents itself as being a "different" company to work for, as in better than the rest, and one of America's Top 100 Employers. That's an outright lie, but FedEx is excellent at providing smokescreens and testimonials (like yours) that make it seeem like it isn't a lie. You are perpetuating a false image and living the lie every time you hop on here and defend the indefensible.
FedEx doesn't vote for itself in those Top Employer things so how is it a lie? Either employees are voting or customers or other businesses, etc. How can something I've seen, lived, experienced be a lie? If it's a fact, it's hardly indefensible. I get that it's not a perfect company and I never said it was. It does appear though that, as others here have noted, nothing will appease you. You've even stated as much when you admit that the Teamsters have some major issues but you'd take that over the current situation. Commonly known as out of the frying pan and into the fire.
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
Nope. I've stated before I don't agree with everything FedEx does.

Your arguments/anecdotes are the same as my arguments/anecdotes inasmuch as they come from 25+ years experience and working in many locations. Neither one of us really has enough data points to prove anything. All we can do is share our experiences and, yes, rationally, debate them.


And your methodology is if someone likes FedEx or one of their policies (and states why), you are either dismissing it away or belittling the poster. Doesn't make us very different does it?

FedEx doesn't vote for itself in those Top Employer things so how is it a lie? Either employees are voting or customers or other businesses, etc. How can something I've seen, lived, experienced be a lie? If it's a fact, it's hardly indefensible. I get that it's not a perfect company and I never said it was. It does appear though that, as others here have noted, nothing will appease you. You've even stated as much when you admit that the Teamsters have some major issues but you'd take that over the current situation. Commonly known as out of the frying pan and into the fire.

If faced with a choice between Fred and Hoffa, I'll take good old Jim. He's also a crook, but at least we have a chance that he'll force a few dollars our way. That will appease me...some.
 

quadro

Well-Known Member
If faced with a choice between Fred and Hoffa, I'll take good old Jim. He's also a crook, but at least we have a chance that he'll force a few dollars our way. That will appease me...some.
MrFedEx, I say this with the utmost respect: If even having Hoffa represent you will only appease you some, what the heck are you doing sticking around at FedEx? Clearly by your own admission you won't be happy even if you get what you want. Why put yourself through that? Life's too short to go around unhappy. I understand that at this point with 25+ years it is very difficult to make a change but it seems not making that change is just creating more and more anguish for you. I'm not telling you to "quit if you're unhappy". I don't mean it like that. I just don't get why people put themselves through a living hell when they don't have to.
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
MrFedEx, I say this with the utmost respect: If even having Hoffa represent you will only appease you some, what the heck are you doing sticking around at FedEx? Clearly by your own admission you won't be happy even if you get what you want. Why put yourself through that? Life's too short to go around unhappy. I understand that at this point with 25+ years it is very difficult to make a change but it seems not making that change is just creating more and more anguish for you. I'm not telling you to "quit if you're unhappy". I don't mean it like that. I just don't get why people put themselves through a living hell when they don't have to.

I just said that to pull your chain. Forcing Fred to the bargaining table would make me very happy, and I think that many of the RLA-enabled policies that have made FedEx a miserable place to work would either be eliminated or modified substantially.
 

vantexan

Well-Known Member
MrFedEx, I say this with the utmost respect: If even having Hoffa represent you will only appease you some, what the heck are you doing sticking around at FedEx? Clearly by your own admission you won't be happy even if you get what you want. Why put yourself through that? Life's too short to go around unhappy. I understand that at this point with 25+ years it is very difficult to make a change but it seems not making that change is just creating more and more anguish for you. I'm not telling you to "quit if you're unhappy". I don't mean it like that. I just don't get why people put themselves through a living hell when they don't have to.

Well that's just it, we've got no where else to go. And that should tell you everything you need to know. FedEx has positioned itself to take advantage of trade with China, greatly increasing it's profits. And yet is holding down our pay. No big deal for you, you're topped out and can get by fine. But I make much less than you after almost 12 years. But to hear you tell it I don't deserve as much as you, should just accept it or leave FedEx. All FedEx has to do to make me happy is top me out. You won't hear one complaint from me if they do. But they don't want to, and you support that. And I know for a fact that our mgrs told us at my station that FedEx was hurting financially, had a very bad June and July, a week after FedEx announced to Wall Street that first quarter 2011 profits were much higher than expected. Apparently they don't think we read the business section, let alone comprehend it. Tired of the manipulation, the manipulators, and their apologists.
 

bbsam

Moderator
Staff member
If faced with a choice between Fred and Hoffa, I'll take good old Jim. He's also a crook, but at least we have a chance that he'll force a few dollars our way. That will appease me...some.
So what's the status of bringing in Hoffa? Since the new ruling of "50+1"? Any movement anywhere?
 

bbsam

Moderator
Staff member
Well that's just it, we've got no where else to go. And that should tell you everything you need to know. FedEx has positioned itself to take advantage of trade with China, greatly increasing it's profits. And yet is holding down our pay. No big deal for you, you're topped out and can get by fine. But I make much less than you after almost 12 years. But to hear you tell it I don't deserve as much as you, should just accept it or leave FedEx. All FedEx has to do to make me happy is top me out. You won't hear one complaint from me if they do. But they don't want to, and you support that. And I know for a fact that our mgrs told us at my station that FedEx was hurting financially, had a very bad June and July, a week after FedEx announced to Wall Street that first quarter 2011 profits were much higher than expected. Apparently they don't think we read the business section, let alone comprehend it. Tired of the manipulation, the manipulators, and their apologists.

This being true, you may want to rethink voting republican. Unless, of course, you think it "can't possibly get any worse."
 

vantexan

Well-Known Member
This being true, you may want to rethink voting republican. Unless, of course, you think it "can't possibly get any worse."

In my book the only thing worse than far right conservatives run amok are far left liberals run amok. Doesn't leave much choice does it?
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
So what's the status of bringing in Hoffa? Since the new ruling of "50+1"? Any movement anywhere?

I've seen nothing. Let's just say that my opinion of Hoffa is only marginally higher than that of Smith. That isn't a compliment.
 
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