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<blockquote data-quote="The Other Side" data-source="post: 827538" data-attributes="member: 17969"><p>What strikes me odd, is when someone talks about pro this and pro that, but doesnt understand history.</p><p> </p><p>Prior to the late 1920's, there were no unions, no minimum wage, no benefits, no weekends off, no pensions, no job security and children in the workplace in the USA. We had sweatshops all over the country. We had worker injuries in every state without protection or compensation. We had employees go unpaid after weeks of work. We had employees working 7 days a week for pennies while corporations made millions.</p><p> </p><p>We imported slaves to do hard labor in order to turn a huge profit and then punished the slaves if they didnt work hard enough or complained.</p><p> </p><p>Why if the capitalist model is so perfect for the american worker did this concept fail? </p><p> </p><p>How did this countries employees learn to connect, educate one another and stand up to both corporate america and the federal goverment? </p><p> </p><p>Why is it, that unions and workers rights became a necessity to "legislate" versus just simply being offered to employees?</p><p> </p><p>Why is history ignored? Why is it that those that support capitalism would want to return to the original concept of employee compensation?</p><p> </p><p>This country was founded as a UNION and that UNION empowered our citizens to stand up for peoples rights. Those rights include a right to have a "living wage", to which most americans dont really earn in todays world.</p><p> </p><p>Our political parties chose a side in this fight. The democrats fight for our middle class and those that cant fight for themselves (the poor). The republicans fight for the corporations and the stockholders of those corporations who would rather see obsene profits and high turnover of employees through poor wages and zero benefits. You dont have to be a math major to figure out that if you have a high turnover of employees, the bottom line will increase.</p><p> </p><p>Since 1929, the american people chose to stand up to corporate america through their representatives, prior to that, they stood alone and tried to take this fight to employers themselves by taking action. That action was a national day of strike against corporate america to take place on the first monday of september in 1878. This national day of strike was observed by all industries and grew to a nationwide strike in a few years. The federal goverment acting upon a request by the corporations, took military action against the working protesters and strikers were killed by our military.</p><p> </p><p>Grover Cleveland (president at the time) made worker reconsiliation a priority in his adminstration and the worker rights movement was born. People died for our rights to strike for a fair wage. It took the people to create, mobilize and institute change in the way workers were treated in the United States and not corporate generosity.</p><p> </p><p>This day of strike today is called LABOR DAY. A recognized federal holiday giving the working american a monday off with pay in appreciation for the hard work all year.</p><p> </p><p>Today, some workers believe they dont need a labor union to negotiate wages or benefits cause they dont understand they are at the highest pay scale in modern times due to labor unions dedication to the american worker.</p><p> </p><p>I agree with big arrow up when he sez "he would like the choice" to belong to a labor union or not. I believe the labor laws should be changed to accomodate big arrow up. I am sure this would satisfy both big arrow and the republican party.</p><p> </p><p>I would change the law to reflect Big Arrows request and allow him his "idealogical" disagreement with the union. He can choose NOT to belong to the teamsters and work for UPS. The only fundamental difference would be that Big Arrow up would NOT be entitled to the negotiated wage and benefit package of the Teamster employees. Big Arrow up would have to solely negotiate his wages, benefits and pension programs as an individual. If UPS would like to match the teamster wage and benefit package for Big Arrow, it could, but its not likely to happen.</p><p> </p><p>If this was the case, BIG ARROW would be at the first union meeting in his local faster than you could say HYPOCRITICALPOLITICALROBOT.</p><p> </p><p>UPS would love the chance to exploit those dumb enough to leave a collective bargaining agreement and jump into the negotiation waters alone.</p><p> </p><p>I welcome this action. I wish the laws were as simple to change as this.</p><p> </p><p>For every person on this board who hates the teamsters, or feels that unions are of no value in todays business climate, I say, lobby for change to the laws and negotiate your own terms.</p><p> </p><p>From start to finish, from hire to retire, do it alone, hopefully you could do better.</p><p> </p><p>Demonstrate to all the other 99% of teamsters who believe they have the best contract because they are represented by the best union in our industry and that you alone could "out negotiate" the teamsters.</p><p> </p><p>Big Arrow, you and everyone else who follows your mindset should be forced out of the teamsters and placed at square one with UPS.</p><p> </p><p>I dont believe you have earned your right to be a union paid employee. You either believe or you dont. Taking a union paycheck and benefits and then biting the hand that takes it from UPS and places it in your hands is nothing more than a hypocrite.</p><p> </p><p>Its easy to talk smack while cashing a large paycheck that you had nothing to do with negotiating. It would be alot different if you were earning what a typical fedex driver is making and you were observing your union co-workers making 50% more than you were for the same job.</p><p> </p><p>Being a republican while working at a blue collar job makes no sense at all when the republicans are trying to reduce the pay and benefits of the people who are just like you.</p><p> </p><p>You are sold a bag of B.S. about making it, pulling yourself up by the bootstraps and becoming the next rush limbaugh. That P.O.S. will earn 2 billion dollars by the end of this year begining in 2000 when Bush took office.</p><p> </p><p>None of you right wing tea party sarah palin drones will ever see that number in 5 lifetimes combined, yet support them as they become the riches americans in the country and you become poorer.</p><p> </p><p>Give us a break and lobby for change, I will stand behind you in your efforts to rid yourselves of the collective bargaining agreement that was negotiated for you and the paycheck you currently cash weekly.</p><p> </p><p>Ask to start at square one and do it alone. I am sure the capitalist UPS will pay you accordingly to your qualifications.</p><p> </p><p>Prove us wrong or STFU.</p><p> </p><p>Peace.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="The Other Side, post: 827538, member: 17969"] What strikes me odd, is when someone talks about pro this and pro that, but doesnt understand history. Prior to the late 1920's, there were no unions, no minimum wage, no benefits, no weekends off, no pensions, no job security and children in the workplace in the USA. We had sweatshops all over the country. We had worker injuries in every state without protection or compensation. We had employees go unpaid after weeks of work. We had employees working 7 days a week for pennies while corporations made millions. We imported slaves to do hard labor in order to turn a huge profit and then punished the slaves if they didnt work hard enough or complained. Why if the capitalist model is so perfect for the american worker did this concept fail? How did this countries employees learn to connect, educate one another and stand up to both corporate america and the federal goverment? Why is it, that unions and workers rights became a necessity to "legislate" versus just simply being offered to employees? Why is history ignored? Why is it that those that support capitalism would want to return to the original concept of employee compensation? This country was founded as a UNION and that UNION empowered our citizens to stand up for peoples rights. Those rights include a right to have a "living wage", to which most americans dont really earn in todays world. Our political parties chose a side in this fight. The democrats fight for our middle class and those that cant fight for themselves (the poor). The republicans fight for the corporations and the stockholders of those corporations who would rather see obsene profits and high turnover of employees through poor wages and zero benefits. You dont have to be a math major to figure out that if you have a high turnover of employees, the bottom line will increase. Since 1929, the american people chose to stand up to corporate america through their representatives, prior to that, they stood alone and tried to take this fight to employers themselves by taking action. That action was a national day of strike against corporate america to take place on the first monday of september in 1878. This national day of strike was observed by all industries and grew to a nationwide strike in a few years. The federal goverment acting upon a request by the corporations, took military action against the working protesters and strikers were killed by our military. Grover Cleveland (president at the time) made worker reconsiliation a priority in his adminstration and the worker rights movement was born. People died for our rights to strike for a fair wage. It took the people to create, mobilize and institute change in the way workers were treated in the United States and not corporate generosity. This day of strike today is called LABOR DAY. A recognized federal holiday giving the working american a monday off with pay in appreciation for the hard work all year. Today, some workers believe they dont need a labor union to negotiate wages or benefits cause they dont understand they are at the highest pay scale in modern times due to labor unions dedication to the american worker. I agree with big arrow up when he sez "he would like the choice" to belong to a labor union or not. I believe the labor laws should be changed to accomodate big arrow up. I am sure this would satisfy both big arrow and the republican party. I would change the law to reflect Big Arrows request and allow him his "idealogical" disagreement with the union. He can choose NOT to belong to the teamsters and work for UPS. The only fundamental difference would be that Big Arrow up would NOT be entitled to the negotiated wage and benefit package of the Teamster employees. Big Arrow up would have to solely negotiate his wages, benefits and pension programs as an individual. If UPS would like to match the teamster wage and benefit package for Big Arrow, it could, but its not likely to happen. If this was the case, BIG ARROW would be at the first union meeting in his local faster than you could say HYPOCRITICALPOLITICALROBOT. UPS would love the chance to exploit those dumb enough to leave a collective bargaining agreement and jump into the negotiation waters alone. I welcome this action. I wish the laws were as simple to change as this. For every person on this board who hates the teamsters, or feels that unions are of no value in todays business climate, I say, lobby for change to the laws and negotiate your own terms. From start to finish, from hire to retire, do it alone, hopefully you could do better. Demonstrate to all the other 99% of teamsters who believe they have the best contract because they are represented by the best union in our industry and that you alone could "out negotiate" the teamsters. Big Arrow, you and everyone else who follows your mindset should be forced out of the teamsters and placed at square one with UPS. I dont believe you have earned your right to be a union paid employee. You either believe or you dont. Taking a union paycheck and benefits and then biting the hand that takes it from UPS and places it in your hands is nothing more than a hypocrite. Its easy to talk smack while cashing a large paycheck that you had nothing to do with negotiating. It would be alot different if you were earning what a typical fedex driver is making and you were observing your union co-workers making 50% more than you were for the same job. Being a republican while working at a blue collar job makes no sense at all when the republicans are trying to reduce the pay and benefits of the people who are just like you. You are sold a bag of B.S. about making it, pulling yourself up by the bootstraps and becoming the next rush limbaugh. That P.O.S. will earn 2 billion dollars by the end of this year begining in 2000 when Bush took office. None of you right wing tea party sarah palin drones will ever see that number in 5 lifetimes combined, yet support them as they become the riches americans in the country and you become poorer. Give us a break and lobby for change, I will stand behind you in your efforts to rid yourselves of the collective bargaining agreement that was negotiated for you and the paycheck you currently cash weekly. Ask to start at square one and do it alone. I am sure the capitalist UPS will pay you accordingly to your qualifications. Prove us wrong or STFU. Peace. [/QUOTE]
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