Telematics-who watches the watchers?
- Thread starter soberups
- Start date
pretzel_man
Well-Known Member
Sober,
This is a good intelligent question. I don't think I will be able to give you a good answer though.
From what I've seen, things like seatbelt usage and bulkhead door closing are pretty easy. Everyone gets pretty close to zero on these.
Other items like skipping lunch, speeding, going off area, etc. take some evaluation to see if there is a problem.
There is no corporate report that shows these areas, so the situation can exist like you say. While I have not seen anything like that to date, there is no systemic trigger to prevent it.
However, information is power. Its power not only for the company, but for you. If you think favorites are being played and allowing violations to be overlooked, the proof will be there in the system. Its a read only system and they cannot alter or delete any information.
P-Man
pretzel_man
Well-Known Member
Steve,
I don't think I want to go into details, but let me put it this way.
The telematics GPS unit is very accurate (for most routes). If GPS says you went 100 miles, and you recorded 120 miles on your time card, it will be noticed.
There are some valid reasons this can happen, but we all know that there are invalid ones too
If you made a simple mistake that's one thing. If you did it systematically every day, well telematics will show this.
Also, telematics will show where, when, and how long any lunch and break was. Don't complain about being overdispatched while taking a 2 hour break.
P-Man
dannyboy
From the promised LAND
Yes sir, and because of a lack of after market parts, they are junking a whole series of low riders that do have power steering, low steps, large work areas, and of course three point seatbelts.
WHat is that saying there UPS? Lack of proper planning........?
I would expect this system could also either help or nail down the coffin of a driver that is aledged to have "done something physically improper" to a person out on road.
For example, steve makes a delivery to a woman and she claimes he entered the house and forced himself on her. But telematics shows that he only spent 19 seconds there, all of which were needed to walk to the front door.
We had a driver here end up with a lot of heartache and trouble because of an allegation like that. No proof either way.......Whatdoya do?
BTW, whats next? Sensors on our legs and backs to make sure drivers are not running and lifting properly?
d
JimJimmyJames
Big Time Feeder Driver
PAS/EDD, telematics, 70+ plus pages of "3 40" methods, etc. All of these devices and systems were designed to make our jobs more efficient but they were also implemented to allow replacement drivers to do our jobs quickly with a minimum of actual on car supervision. God forbid if we ever need to strike nationally again.
As an added bonus to this master plan, by making so many rules to follow and having the technology now to implement and monitor them at a level undreamt of in the past, they always have a way to discipline anyone based on your performance or, as soberups suggests, even arbitrarily if they happen to like you or not.
I read or saw a fictional story once where the government felt it was needed for everyone to be equal and completely controlled in order for society to function properly. It was decided that if everyone was a criminal, everyone would in fact be equal. In order to implement this strategy, so many laws were created so that it was impossible for a person not to break at least one of them. Damn, I wish I remember the name of the story. Regardless, sounds familiar, doesn't it?
As an added bonus to this master plan, by making so many rules to follow and having the technology now to implement and monitor them at a level undreamt of in the past, they always have a way to discipline anyone based on your performance or, as soberups suggests, even arbitrarily if they happen to like you or not.
I read or saw a fictional story once where the government felt it was needed for everyone to be equal and completely controlled in order for society to function properly. It was decided that if everyone was a criminal, everyone would in fact be equal. In order to implement this strategy, so many laws were created so that it was impossible for a person not to break at least one of them. Damn, I wish I remember the name of the story. Regardless, sounds familiar, doesn't it?
stevetheupsguy
sʇǝʌǝʇɥǝndsƃnʎ
Yes sir, and because of a lack of after market parts, they are junking a whole series of low riders that do have power steering, low steps, large work areas, and of course three point seatbelts.
WHat is that saying there UPS? Lack of proper planning........?
I would expect this system could also either help or nail down the coffin of a driver that is aledged to have "done something physically improper" to a person out on road.
For example, steve makes a delivery to a woman and she claimes he entered the house and forced himself on her. But telematics shows that he only spent 19 seconds there, all of which were needed to walk to the front door.
We had a driver here end up with a lot of heartache and trouble because of an allegation like that. No proof either way.......Whatdoya do?
BTW, whats next? Sensors on our legs and backs to make sure drivers are not running and lifting properly?
d
The name, Harvey, wasn't available?
Man, I really need to start reading more. You guys are very knowledgeable.
diesel96
Well-Known Member
Was it the "Cold War" Animated Communist Cartoon by the name of "Animal Farm"? I remember they shown it in school when I was a little booger.
stevetheupsguy
sʇǝʌǝʇɥǝndsƃnʎ
Right, they'll finally realize that shutting the door and buckling the seatbelt didn't really waste that much time at all.
rocket man
Well-Known Member
HOW many people are they gonna hire ? TO do all that data. By the time they get to you it would be untimely.
dannyboy
From the promised LAND
Rocket
The computer does all that data. All they do is get a print out of who didnt do or did do things on their route. probably only generate one or two sheets max telling them what they need to know. Add that to the reams of paper our "paperless" system generates now. Nobody will even notice.
d
The computer does all that data. All they do is get a print out of who didnt do or did do things on their route. probably only generate one or two sheets max telling them what they need to know. Add that to the reams of paper our "paperless" system generates now. Nobody will even notice.
d
upsdude
Well-Known Member
trickpony1
Well-Known Member
pretzel man-
You claim the company will not abuse telemetics and use it to fire drivers.
Other posters have asked you why the system can't interlock with the ignition and the vehicle will not start unless the seatbelt is fastened and the bulkhead door is closed (if it truly was about safety and not projecting maintainence).
It's been my experience, in 25+ years, that if there's a system the company will abuse it.
Would you like some examples? The ones that come to mind right now are:
1) using air drivers to deliver ground. It's my understanding that air drivers are not to touch ground but the air drivers I talk to routinely deliver LIB's while delivering air.
2) when triples trailers came to a nearby state there was a mandate that max load was to be 230%. You know how long that lasted. 300% loads are routinely pulled and sometimes caught overweight when the enforcement agencies aren't turning a blind eye. Overweight double 45's are routinely pulled but, I guess, no one cares about "over grossing" that dolly axle.
So tell me again about how different systems won't be abused.
BTW, your contention that only one out of 1500 drivers using telemetics was fired, and supposedly substantiated, doesn't require a shred of evidence.
You claim the company will not abuse telemetics and use it to fire drivers.
Other posters have asked you why the system can't interlock with the ignition and the vehicle will not start unless the seatbelt is fastened and the bulkhead door is closed (if it truly was about safety and not projecting maintainence).
It's been my experience, in 25+ years, that if there's a system the company will abuse it.
Would you like some examples? The ones that come to mind right now are:
1) using air drivers to deliver ground. It's my understanding that air drivers are not to touch ground but the air drivers I talk to routinely deliver LIB's while delivering air.
2) when triples trailers came to a nearby state there was a mandate that max load was to be 230%. You know how long that lasted. 300% loads are routinely pulled and sometimes caught overweight when the enforcement agencies aren't turning a blind eye. Overweight double 45's are routinely pulled but, I guess, no one cares about "over grossing" that dolly axle.
So tell me again about how different systems won't be abused.
BTW, your contention that only one out of 1500 drivers using telemetics was fired, and supposedly substantiated, doesn't require a shred of evidence.
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feederdriver06
former monkey slave
The more technology that gets added to the job the harder the job gets. Glad my days of package car are in my past.
pretzel_man
Well-Known Member
I can only assume you have not read what I've posted on this previously. I've answered most of these items before. I'll recap:
First, I never said that this system will not be abused. As with anything, the potential exists. I've said that to date it has not been used as a tool for discipline and dismissal.
I mentioned the one case and you can choose to believe me or not. I have no reason to lie. If I'm incorrect, the union has the evidence to prove me wrong.
I'm certain that somewhere in America, a poor manager will use this tool improperly. I'm also certain that it will find a driver somewhere that is acting dishonestly. This does not make all drivers bad, all managers bad, or the tool improper.
As far as building an interlocking device, I said I don't know why they chose the path they did. Its likely because the system does more than only improve safety. Its also used for Automotive analysis. This was probably the most cost effective way to meet all goals.
I see your examples of where UPS has done wrong in some operations. This doesn't make the concept of triples or air drivers wrong. It just means that improper use must be addressed.
The same is true for this system. It has the potential to improve safety, reduce fuel costs, reduce automotive expense, and reduce breakdowns.
Again, you can choose to believe me or not.
P-Man
trickpony1
Well-Known Member
It's my understanding that telematics is coming to feeders.
I know we have IVIS but, supposedly, the new technology will measure even more important things like honking the horn, riding the clutch (a thread in itself), seatbelts, turn signals, farting etc.
I don't think the people calling for a system tied to the ignition have thought this thru. It seems like it would have the potential to be a huge liability.
Think about it. If the current system fails it either creates bad data or no data. If a ignition system fails it would leave a car stranded who knows where.
I got it pictured, A censer on the bulkhead door goes bad and what was going to be a quick resi delivery parked along a busy road, turns into a 90 minute ordeal sitting there waiting for a mechenic to come out.
soberups
Pees in the brown Koolaid
There is already a sensor on the newer cars that prevents the transmission from being put into "drive" unless the brake pedal is applied. To my knowledge there have been no road calls or liability issues with this device. It would be quite simple to tie in the seatbelt and door sensors into the same circuit. For that matter, you could also wire up an "override" toggle switch that would allow the vehicle to operate in case of a sensor failure.
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