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The Black Market Is Becoming The Dominate Marketplace
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<blockquote data-quote="av8torntn" data-source="post: 936826" data-attributes="member: 8259"><p>I'm a fan of Corky's. Can I talk you into springing for the rib and pork killer combo? <img src="/community/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/FeltTip/happy2.png" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":happy2:" title="Happy2 :happy2:" data-shortname=":happy2:" /> My favorite. </p><p></p><p>Smart people can argue all day long on the question of if the middle class has grown or not and cite valid numbers to back up their claims. I tend to believe that the power to obtain goods and services has grown so much(due to a number of reasons both good and bad) that it in effect has increased the size of the middle class by default. There is an argument to be made, not by myself, that the devaluation of the currency to support the growth of the state has supported a growth in purchasing power by the middle class.That would be an example of the bad. I tend to believe that efficiencies by our market based economy has done more to support a middle class than any other thing. An example could be the number of homes with large screen TV's. That would be an example of the good. I do not however see this occurrence as an effect of government imposed wages. I had the intention of using a couple fallacies the pro state crowd use to support my argument but I think it is best to save those for later. </p><p></p><p>To summarize or oversimplify the above you can point to statistics that show real wages have been stagnant while real consumption has increased. You can argue over what that means and also point to the fact that the real hourly wages of production workers has declined while total compensation has increased. Explanations of those can be found in "The Intellectual and the Marketplace"-G. Stigler You can draw your own conclusion but I could make a good argument that inflation to support government is much more destructive than big business is to the wealth of an individual and market based efficiencies have helped increase real consumption. </p><p></p><p>All of that aside I feel that government barriers to market entry do more to keep people oppressed than anything I can think of. I found it interesting that you made that statement as I had just watched an episode of Gold Rush and one of the miners had been shut down by government regulators for "safety" violations. I do not remember his exact words but it can be summarized by your statement above and was very insightful. I have always thought that two things were central to a free society being private property rights and low governmental barriers to market entry and a free society was the best support system for a middle class or the very poor for that matter as it gave everyone a chance at wealth. </p><p></p><p>Something that I would consider very important to my belief and one of the reasons that I had posed the question of "why hate the poor" is that the majority of households in the bottom 20% of the income bracket do not even have a year round full time worker. To keep this in perspective of what I am talking about the bottom one fifth of households has about 25 million fewer people than the top one fifth of households. I have seen no valid reason put forth here to price these people out of labor markets either through wage laws or excessive governmental regulation. I wonder if this could be where the perception of increasing income inequality begins. If household A does not hold a year round full time job but household B does would the B household not see their wages rise over time at a faster rate? I am not talking about disabled people or drug addicts but there are people that would work but do not have the skills to demand a minimum wage and are therefore priced out of the workforce. This tends to be a compounding effect. </p><p></p><p>Just some random thoughts on the subject.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="av8torntn, post: 936826, member: 8259"] I'm a fan of Corky's. Can I talk you into springing for the rib and pork killer combo? :happy2: My favorite. Smart people can argue all day long on the question of if the middle class has grown or not and cite valid numbers to back up their claims. I tend to believe that the power to obtain goods and services has grown so much(due to a number of reasons both good and bad) that it in effect has increased the size of the middle class by default. There is an argument to be made, not by myself, that the devaluation of the currency to support the growth of the state has supported a growth in purchasing power by the middle class.That would be an example of the bad. I tend to believe that efficiencies by our market based economy has done more to support a middle class than any other thing. An example could be the number of homes with large screen TV's. That would be an example of the good. I do not however see this occurrence as an effect of government imposed wages. I had the intention of using a couple fallacies the pro state crowd use to support my argument but I think it is best to save those for later. To summarize or oversimplify the above you can point to statistics that show real wages have been stagnant while real consumption has increased. You can argue over what that means and also point to the fact that the real hourly wages of production workers has declined while total compensation has increased. Explanations of those can be found in "The Intellectual and the Marketplace"-G. Stigler You can draw your own conclusion but I could make a good argument that inflation to support government is much more destructive than big business is to the wealth of an individual and market based efficiencies have helped increase real consumption. All of that aside I feel that government barriers to market entry do more to keep people oppressed than anything I can think of. I found it interesting that you made that statement as I had just watched an episode of Gold Rush and one of the miners had been shut down by government regulators for "safety" violations. I do not remember his exact words but it can be summarized by your statement above and was very insightful. I have always thought that two things were central to a free society being private property rights and low governmental barriers to market entry and a free society was the best support system for a middle class or the very poor for that matter as it gave everyone a chance at wealth. Something that I would consider very important to my belief and one of the reasons that I had posed the question of "why hate the poor" is that the majority of households in the bottom 20% of the income bracket do not even have a year round full time worker. To keep this in perspective of what I am talking about the bottom one fifth of households has about 25 million fewer people than the top one fifth of households. I have seen no valid reason put forth here to price these people out of labor markets either through wage laws or excessive governmental regulation. I wonder if this could be where the perception of increasing income inequality begins. If household A does not hold a year round full time job but household B does would the B household not see their wages rise over time at a faster rate? I am not talking about disabled people or drug addicts but there are people that would work but do not have the skills to demand a minimum wage and are therefore priced out of the workforce. This tends to be a compounding effect. Just some random thoughts on the subject. [/QUOTE]
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