The lesser of 2 (or 3) evils to avoid late air

Discussion in 'UPS Discussions' started by bigmistake, Sep 6, 2009.

  1. bigmistake

    bigmistake Member

    Some experienced drivers have shared options with me in avoiding late air. I know all are wrong, or at least questionable.

    I have been a Saturday Air driver for 1 year and 4 months since being DQ due to an accident. I deliver to a town which is actually not serviced by our center, only on Saturday. I left with way too much work this past Saturday, sent a message to the center asking for help with enough notice. I get a message to call center ASAP 20 minutes later. Was told no one is available and to deliver everything on time.

    Some suggestions I have been given:

    1. Deliver business/signature required stops first, then DR everything before the commit time.

    2. Use a zip code for a town that has a relaxed commit time. An additional 90 minutes is allowed, commit time would be 1:30pm.

    3. After the commit time, don't sheet the package, just deliver it without scanning.

    I know all of these are wrong, or at least highly questionable. Whoever said there isn't pressure driving Saturday Air is misinformed. Anyways, I gave in to the pressure, DR everything by the commit time. Which is the lesser of those 3 evils?
  2. GeorgiaBrown

    GeorgiaBrown New Member


    I am telling you, with this new technology, "they can hear a snake fart in Egypt"..... to quote Armand Assante playing John Gotti...... you did the right thing by sending the message early and requesting help......... I would suggest you document the time you sent the message..... the exact verbiage that you used.... the circumstances you were working under (how many air stops, the breakdown of those stops, the distance you had to cover and anything else you may think important).......... then I would document everything that the Center sent back you....(time, info, reccomendations....etc..)........ If they don't help you then attempt all the business 1st, and when the commit time comes and goes, continue to deliver........BUT DON'T make up fake zip codes, forge deliveries (DR's), or forget to sheet the packages..... they will kill you for dishonesty for that and YOU WILL NOT be able to cover your backside.....
  3. upsmanclt

    upsmanclt Member

    None of the above. The only way to avoid late air is to deliver before the commitment time. Any manipulation on your part is stealing and lying. Tell your sup you will have late air. If they don't respond with help, then it's on them, period. Good luck.
  4. grgrcr88

    grgrcr88 No It's not green grocer!


    What you need to do is let management know before you leave, after you leave and several times before the commit time that you WILL have air late. If they cannot or do not help you then it is not your fault, and you should not be in any trouble. Always protect yourself by following the methods as prescribed by the company in the 340 methods handbook. Also alwys deliver the earliest commit time first and only them when there is a chance of any being late. (meaning do not deliver any saver packages while delivering NDA if you think you might have late NDA)

    I will tell you, any of the 3 items you mentioned above are terminateable offenses!! Always cover your own a** by putting the decisions on management!!!
  5. wot_racing

    wot_racing New Member

    All of these are dishonesty and can get you fired... Do your job, do your best, and if they say anything about the late air, tell them that you asked for help but there was none. Then ask them to show you what you can do if this situation arrises again. Don't argue with them, it only makes it worse in the long run.

    Keep your head down and say "Ill try to do better"...
  6. tieguy

    tieguy Banned

    4) Do the best you can and keep your integrity at all times. I would look at the geographical grouping and go after the grouping that is tightest and allows me to get the most packages delivered. Then record whatever is left accurately.
  7. UpstateNYUPSer

    UpstateNYUPSer Very proud grandfather.

    Changing zip codes? DRing just to beat the commit time?

    Consignees use Saturday air and are willing to pay extra for it for one reason--they really need whatever it is they are getting on time.

    Tie had perhaps the best advice.
  8. dannyboy

    dannyboy From the promised LAND

    Why is it you know right from wrong, but yet ask what to do.

    Any of the suggestions will get you fired on the spot, with no chance of ever continuing your employment.

    As tie said, go to the tightest group you have, with the most packages (notice I did not say stops) and deliver the largest chunk of air you can on time.

    Then deliver and record the rest properly.

    anything else will put you on the cross by yourself.

  9. soberups

    soberups Pees in the brown Koolaid


    Tieguy and I dont always agree but here he speaks words of wisdom.
  10. cino321

    cino321 Active Member

    Do your best, don't screw around. If you need help, you need help man. Not your problem that you were over dispatched.

    My advice to you is to do the following. When you send your message in, don't ask for help. Send a message saying you have X amount of stops done and X amount left; you cannot make commit time on all packages and you will have late air. That's it. Now you put the responsibility on your management team to make a decision on how to handle the situation. When you ask for help, they'll reply with no help is available and deliver everything on time, there by putting the responsibility on you.

    If you do not get any help, and you can't deliver everything on time, then sheet everything accurately and whatever is late is late.

    Perhaps you need to demonstrate to your management team that you are indeed being over dispatched and cannot finish everything by commit time.

    It's not your fault that you are being over dispatched, so why should you have to put your job on the line to falsify records?
  11. Jack4343

    Jack4343 FT DR Specialist

    I agree what everyone else is saying. Saturday Air is our most expensive service and one that is usually the most anticipated packages by our customers. Many are well aware of the commit time and know if the packages are received late. All it takes is for one of them to call about a package you delivered late and it shows that you delivered it on time. Anything someone tells you verbally will most likely not save your job. UPS takes Saturday air commits quite seriously and will deal with people being dishonest swiftly and harshly. We had two supervisors that ran out Saturday operation terminated for falsifying records in regards to showing packages delivered that were not attempted by the commit time. If they will drop the hammer on two sups that had over 10 years of service each out on their keisters for it they will think nothing about doing it to you. If you think you are leaving with too much air and won't be able to deliver it on time, speak with your supervisor before you leave and tell him you will not be able to deliver it all on time and that you will not work dishonestly. The ball is in his court. If he lets you leave with too much work, immediately send a message via the DIAD letting them know you will not deliver everything on time. I know that you don't want to get your immediate supervisor angry with you for fear of retailiation but that will be the least of your worries if someone doesn't get their package on time and calls the 1800# before you arrive with the package. Your head will be directly on the chopping block with no recourse.
  12. soberups

    soberups Pees in the brown Koolaid

    A similar situation once happened to me; IE changed the commit time in my loop from 1200 to 1030 while at the same time refusing to allow additional routes to be dispatched.

    I was instructed to go up and down the belt in the AM and find a way to "make it work" by begging for help from other drivers...who were in the same boat I was in.

    After working as instructed, I then got a nasty note in my box....for "excessive AM time"!

    It became apparent to me at that point that management had no intention of solving the problem and that no matter what I did they would bitch about I quit worrying about the commit time altogether. I did the best I could, delivered everything else late, and messaged in "late air, impossible commit time".

    This went on for over a week, I probably had 30 late air in that time. Whoever was pulling the strings from IE got so sick of all the late air that they finally authorized an additional route to be put in to stop the service failures. There was a cut route next to mine that had only been going out part of the time, so as a result of the change in commit times and me sheeting the stops as "late" this route started going out daily and an unassigned driver on my center was able to bid for it. Problem solved!

    What your management team needs is some "tough love". Be honest, get a much of the air off as you can, deliver the rest late, and force them to own up to problem instead of allowing them to live in denial of it. All you are doing is taking their problem...and giving it back to them.
  13. badpal.

    badpal. avoiding brown kool-aid

    Everyone here is giving sound advice. Late air does make us look bad in a time where we don't need to but sometimes it takes things like that to open the eyes of the higher-ups who don't deal with the day-to-day operation but yet call the shots for our management team. Ultimately you need to do the honest thing which is sheet when your at the stop and not before. They can only yell or make idle threats but they'll be on to something else sooner or later and you'll still have a job.
  14. Mike23

    Mike23 Guest

    I used to average around 30-50 late air a week. Where I am it was never a big deal. Since they've started being organized though they tried to get me in poop two weeks back for 18 late air. I was asked why it was late. I made notes of the reason for it.

    1. I had an air bulk stop on a second floor and had requested a dolly three weeks prior. I was not given one so it ate up around 15min of my time going up and down the stairs three or four times.

    2. My preloader asked to have 28 guitars bulked (they were each worth 1k and boy was that company mad when they saw +70 boxes had fallen on them) because it cubed out my truck. I barely got the door down in the 1000 when I left. Since it was cubed out and my 1200 were at the back half of the truck I couldn't get to them without getting this stupid stop off first.

    I also had to load my own truck in the morning since my preloader couldn't work efficiently around those stupid guitars so got out of the building at around 0910 instead of 0855.

    That ate up around 30 min of delivery time in total for two of managements errors.

    He blinked at me a few times and said, 'try harder in the future please'. I told him I was trying as hard as I could with the limited equipment and assistance given. That was all I heard about it. I always put it back on them since they're the ones supposed to be managing the situation. If they over dispatch, not your problem as long as they know you need help it's theirs.

    As for calling in for help. Keep it simple. I was dragged into the office a little while ago for asking a sup, 'what would you like me to miss? Pickups or deliveries' he said niether and I said I'd try my best. He apparently didn't think I was serious so I got in trouble for poor communication. Anyways, now when I need help, I page in, 'I NEED HELP' and phone him and yell, 'I NEED HELP!' That way they can't claim there's poor communication since it's simple enough for them to understand.
  15. some1else

    some1else Active Member

    wow the minute he requested a phone call so he could comm with you off record it should have been a sign!

    the underlying problem here is your managers dishonesty.

    1st he will instruct you to do w/e it takes to get these on time.

    2nd eventually someone somewhere will figure out what is going on

    3rd that same manager you have been "helping" will through you under the bus (package car) and claim he never told you that and had no idea it was going on.

    when i used to run sat. air we got a new sup and he decided to up everyones count by 10-15% i told him i would have late and he gave me the same crap you got. just do it, get it on time etc. use these tricks blah blah. i asked for a minute to look up a few and wrote up a nice note stating what he just told me to do and that he would take all responsibility/possible disciplinary action.

    priceless, really priceless. when i asked him to sign it he didnt even get through the second sentence, went into my car and grabbed 5 airs and told me to gtfo!

    worst part is if you do this once, next week you will do it, and then you will do it everyday until you get fired for it.
  16. Baba gounj

    Baba gounj pensioner

    honestly I have "fudged" more Sat airs than I can recall, very few customers have bothered to track their packages, most just accept the fact that I showed up when I did. And never has mgt done anything about it. Most knew I was "fudging " , sometimes we were so short handed that it was the only option.
  17. stevetheupsguy

    stevetheupsguy sʇǝʌǝʇɥǝndsƃnʎ

    The right thing to do is always the right thing to do. You get paid to deliver pkgs, not fudge numbers, as that job belongs to MGMT. If you get sent out with so many air that you can't make the commit time, it's on them. Sheet the pkgs when you get there and don't be dishonest. Even if the late air will be your own fault, sheet it when you get there. Send a message stating that you had a late air and it was your fault, sorry.

    Like I said, your job is to deliver the pkgs the best that you can. If you are overloaded, then you get there when you get there. You shouldn't even apologize to any customers, unless they ask why you're late, as most customers just needed the pkg the next day and not absolutely before 10:30am.
  18. Jack4343

    Jack4343 FT DR Specialist

    Not really an option in our hub. We deliver to UPS Corporate as well as tons of corporate employees who are well versed (well, somewhat versed) on our commit times and policies. We even reguarly delivered Sat. Early AM's to our former CEO, Mike Eskew. The corporate types won't file for a refund but you can bet they'll tell their corporate buddies what happened. Had that happen to me once. I had a package for a corporate guy that was Signature Required and he had a very tall locked gate leading to his front door. I rang the bell attached to the gate with no answer. Sheeted as NI, left InfoNotice on the gate and continued on. Got a call from my center manager on Monday and asked me what happened? I told him the story and he told me I should've indirected the package to a neighbor. I told him it seemed like he didn't really want to be bothered with his neighbors since he was the only guy on the street with a 10-ft. tall fence surrounding his property and that it was drivers discrection regarding indirect deliveries. I was covered because I followed proper procedures. However, had I attempted that package after the commit time after showing a NI1 earlier, that could've been it for my career at UPS and even though we all have our bad days, I would hate to lose my job over something that I had control over.
  19. Funfact

    Funfact Well-Known Member

    Why is this so hard just deliver the packages the quickest way that is usually the closest first and the farthest last. You should be able to tell if you can get all the air off in time before you leave the center so you can tell the SUP at that time. If not then send them a message and keep delivering.
  20. faded jeans

    faded jeans just a member

    Send the message early. If you get no help, do the best you can but do not alter any delivery information for any reason. It is what it is. To

    do otherwise would = your screen name.