The Western Conference and Local 177 H&W DISASTER!

Discussion in 'UPS Union Issues' started by Hoffa SUX, Oct 23, 2013.

  1. Hawfuh Sux

    Hawfuh Sux Old Guard Assassin!

    The Western Conference and Local 177 “carve-out” has been/being designed to cover eleven western locals and New Jersey’s Local 177 for approximately 32,000 UPS Teamsters.
    Since there have been no handouts to the members or any source of information other than the power-point presentation presented by Andy M, it has been claimed by the supporters that it’s similar to the current superior company plans the members enjoy.

    The major problem with this “carve-out” is the fact that members will be paying heavily by diverting a significant amount of their pension contributions into the new health plan.

    Out of the regressive $2.50 pension increase over the life of the 5 year contract, members belonging to the Western Conference and Local 177 Health and Welfare Fund a.k.a. “Carve-Out” will receive the least amount of pension contributions than the rest of nation.

    For Local 177 who's pension is already in the RED/NEGATIVE this deal would be disastrous and would not be able to survive!

    Under the original proposed contract (TeamCare) that was voted down in the Southwest Rider and Local 177, Teamsters were guaranteed to receive a $1.25 pension increase over the life of the 5 year contract.

    Under the new “carve-out” being promoted by Andy M these members are only being guaranteed a .25 cent pension increase over the life of the 5 year contract.
    It’s to say the members of the Southwest Rider and Local 177 will get:

    .25 cent pension increase on the 1st year of the contract, the other .25 cents will be diverted to cover the cost of the “carve-out.” Thus meaning that a full-time employee will be paying for their healthcare on the 1st year; 2080 hours x .25 cents = $520 on the 1[SUP]st[/SUP] year.

    On the 2[SUP]nd[/SUP] and 3[SUP]rd[/SUP] years of the contract, members covered by this “carve-out” will not receive a cent in pension increases. Thus meaning that a full-time employee will be paying for their healthcare on the 1[SUP]st[/SUP] and 2[SUP]nd[/SUP] years; 2080 hours x .50 cents = $1,040 on years 2 and 3.

    On the 4[SUP]th[/SUP] and 5[SUP]th[/SUP] years of the contract there is no guarantee that the members will receive .50 cent increments on each of the years: as there is a clause that states that the trustees of the “carve-out” have the right to divert those two remaining years into the rising cost of health-care.

    With the trend of America’s broken healthcare system healthcare costs are more than certain to rise.

    Last but not least, if further healthcare cost were to rise, the trustees of the Western Conference and Local 177 H&W Fund would also have the right to divert a portion of the members yearly raises.

    In other words members are paying for their healthcare and this "carve-out" should be rejected by all the members!

    VOTE NO!!!!
     
  2. The Other Side

    The Other Side Well-Known Troll Troll

    Excellent explanation. But dont tell Laguna Brown. He thinks its "the same".

    Good post brother.

    TOS.
     
  3. PiedmontSteward

    PiedmontSteward RTW-4-Less

    At least with TeamCare, the affected members would know what they were getting and would also enjoy the financial strength of being in a H&W fund with hundreds of thousands of other participants. One of the major knocks members had with TeamCare were potential GWI diversions to H&W in case the plan became underfunded.. which is still going to be the case in any Taft-Hartley plan with CBAs that contain a wage diversion caveat.

    What's the alternative? The members in 177 and the Western Conference didn't want TeamCare and instead opted for a carve out. Now, the carve out seems less financially secure and I don't really understand how it can offer comparable/better benefits than the C6 enhanced plan. H&W and pension plans always do better when they have a large pool spanning a diverse array of industries.
     
  4. LagunaBrown

    LagunaBrown Well-Known Member

    The Western Conference and Local 177 H&W DISASTER!

    Over the last two contract pension contributions has increased from $4.10 an hour to 9.85 (with .25 increase) that's higher than minimum wage and 20,000 a year into our pension. Fyi
     
  5. LagunaBrown

    LagunaBrown Well-Known Member

    The Western Conference and Local 177 H&W DISASTER!

    And it is to go up to $10.85 by the end of the contract.
     
  6. East coast navy

    East coast navy Veteran

    Where does it say that it's less financially secure?
     
  7. East coast navy

    East coast navy Veteran

    Where does it say this will happen.
     
  8. brownmonster

    brownmonster Man of Great Wisdom

    My daughter turns 26 soon. She can buy her own insurance for about 100 bucks a month. 30 dollar co-pay, 5000 dollar deductible, no vision, no dental, no prescription drugs unless she pays an extra 40 a month plus a 10 dollar copayment, pregnancy and birth not covered. I'm just realistic I guess.
     
  9. LagunaBrown

    LagunaBrown Well-Known Member

    The Western Conference of of Teamsters Pension plan is in the green as required by the Pension Protection Act and each full timer in the west will have at least 20,000 per year contributed. What is your pension plan rated at and contributions so we can compare?
     
  10. PiedmontSteward

    PiedmontSteward RTW-4-Less

    I'm in the IBT/UPS plan and never said anything bad about the Western Conference Plan -- it's actually one of the best in the country. Peer 80 kicks the :censored2::censored2::censored2::censored2: out of anything any other Teamster in the country has from how I understand it. Additionally, the higher rate of unionization on the west coast ensures that those pension contributions are coming from many different industries, which increases the overall security of the plan.

    According to Hoffa Sux, the way the funding is planned won't necessarily be bad for the Western Conference but it's not such a good deal for Local 177 as they have an underfunded pension and more of their H&W contributions will be going to the health care fund rather than their struggling pension plan.
     
  11. LagunaBrown

    LagunaBrown Well-Known Member

    If you look on the 177 website they posted this on June 6th in preparation for Teamcare......... Was the Teamcare health plan considered a disaster since their Pension is struggling? This is an example of how either way they will be looking to the GWI for pension relief. Many members in the Western Teamsters Conference Pension Plan that were covered by the UPS H/C plan have little knowledge of how Taft Hartley works and need to be educated. Lets not scare people in the WTCP plan (especially when it really is one of the best in the country) when we should use 177 as and example of how the system operates. However the membership chooses to vote is up to the individual but these issues should be touched on without bias.

    From Local 177 website IN JUNE BEFORE THE FIRST VOTE:
    "Upon ratification of the National Master and Local 177 agreements, the UPS/Local 177 Pension Plan Trustees have agreed to permit UPS full-time members to reallocate .30 cents each year from the GWI to the pension fund. This reallocation will be done by a special vote of the UPS full-time members only. If this vote passes, the .30 cents, along with addition contributions from UPS which were negotiated by our Local, will generate an additional $402.00 per month, raising the top monthly benefit to $4102.00 per month beginning on August 1, 2013. For members that retire with less than the top monthly benefit, their pension would rise proportionately to their years of service."
     
  12. The Other Side

    The Other Side Well-Known Troll Troll

    Again, give us the details of this "plan" that you are now calling "one of the best in the country".


    Another superlative with nothing to back it up. Your worse than andy M. and the crap coming out of the southwest.


    TOS
     
  13. LagunaBrown

    LagunaBrown Well-Known Member

    The Western Conference and Local 177 H&W DISASTER!

    Can you even read? It clearly say the WTCP is funded in the green and has peer 80. You are like a child arguing about facts. Go see for yourself on the Western Teamsters Pension website. As I said before pension contributions all 5 years of the proposal will be contributing over 20,000 a year into the fund. How is this bad? Why don't you compare it to you TDU local 804 pension that is in the red! TDU is an acronym meaning Too Dumb to Understand. Time for you to get schooled TOS
     
  14. LagunaBrown

    LagunaBrown Well-Known Member

    The Western Conference and Local 177 H&W DISASTER!

    Like your TDU reformers got schooled n Laguna this election. 322 votes....... Pathetic.
     
  15. Hawfuh Sux

    Hawfuh Sux Old Guard Assassin!

    Yes its in the green but not 100% funded. As people retire, there's a need to maintain raises going into the pension funds. A primary example of how bad it is when you suspend or slow pension contributions was when YRC members got kicked out of the pension fund. As more people retire the pension fund decreases.

    The Central States Pension Fund was 76% funded when the last contract was ratified. Today its under 52% funded.

    If the Western Conference Pension Fund is funded at 94% today, by the end of this contract it will be less than 85% funded due to the enormous amount of people that will be retiring in the next 5 years.

    If this "carve-out" passes, the Western Conference Pension Fund will see the beginning of its fall. And unless anyone is looking to retire in the next 8 to 10 years, those who retire after will practically see the mess the Central States and Local 177 funds are experiencing.

    It is simple mathematics not chemistry.
     
  16. LagunaBrown

    LagunaBrown Well-Known Member

    The Western Conference and Local 177 H&W DISASTER!

    Wow you don't know what you are talking about do you... In 2002 our pension contributions were a meager $4.10an hour. That's roughly $8,528 into pension. The next contract it was raised to help out by adding $2.25 to $6.35 an hour and roughly $13,208 a year to pension. Then last contract we bumped it up even more up 3.25 to $9.65 an hour. So with the .25 increase in the proposed contact we will be dumping $9.85 into our totally green 94% funded plan. The simple math is roughly 20,488 a year. So if you think the old timers are gonna draw on our pension you are crazy! We will be putting $105,560 per full timer into the plan. Also since only the new retiree's will be in the union plan health care actives will far out number any draw from them as well.
     
  17. Hawfuh Sux

    Hawfuh Sux Old Guard Assassin!

    In the next 5 years theTeamsters will see the highest amount of UPSers retiring. The amount of people retiring in this next 5 years will be the highest in the history of the Teamsters. The Central States Pension will no longer exist after this contract.

    Never in the history of the world, will there be a generation that will retire like the one that is coming in the next 5 years. That's why the states have been going after public employees. They never expected this and miscalculated the amount of people that would retire. The IBT also didn't expect it.
     
  18. LagunaBrown

    LagunaBrown Well-Known Member

    The Western Conference and Local 177 H&W DISASTER!

    Our pension contributions are excellent and is skated to be at $10.85 an hour by contract end. That is 22,568 in contributions in 2018. We can easily afford to put more money into a start up health care plan and keep the awesome benefits we have in the west like the golden 80, surviving spouse and many other that we fought for. It may not be the plan you want but you can not say it is a bad contract. I mentioned the pension, your medical will be a platinum 90/10 plan (99% what you have now) and you will be making $37.03 an hour. ($55.55 an hour overtime). The west is the best!
     
  19. Hawfuh Sux

    Hawfuh Sux Old Guard Assassin!

    Amazing what people will promote simply to land a job at their respective locals.

    Some people sell out for a penny, others for a buck and few for a million.
     
  20. LagunaBrown

    LagunaBrown Well-Known Member

    The Western Conference and Local 177 H&W DISASTER!

    Edgar you keep getting owned by me..... It burns don't it.