Home
Forums
New posts
Search forums
What's new
New posts
Latest activity
Members
Current visitors
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
New posts
Search forums
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Home
Forums
Brown Cafe Community Center
Current Events
There Will Be No Economic Recovery. Prepare Yourself Accordingly.
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="wkmac" data-source="post: 1102551" data-attributes="member: 2189"><p>My point was that if Obama was a real Marxist, the stock market would have tanked because a real Marxist would have taken control of all means of production and placed it into the hands of the state. Even if ObamaCare was a Marxist grab of healthcare, how do you explain certain healthcare stocks that have since passage have continued an upward trend in stock price? </p><p></p><p>The stock market did well because the policies of the State, some of it by Obama's hand eg market interventions thus benefited certain stock market players. I would re-assert my point that you might want to read Marx before asserting that Obama is a true Marxist or even left socialist. Some of the best condemnation of Obama that I've heard have in fact come from real Marxists and Socialists but if you want to assert Obama is a socialist more along the lines of a right wing socialist I would agree but then we are moving into the realm of fascism which would thus explain why favored corporatist factions of capital has done so well. Would also explain why both sides of the current political landscape no more want a true free or rather freed market than they want their bank accounts to go empty. </p><p></p><p>If one further reads Joseph Pierre Proudhon or even Bakunin, I don't see 20th century state communism as much from the left but more from the right but then I see the left/right spectrum along the <a href="http://wconger.blogspot.com/2005/08/karl-hess-left-right-spectrum.html" target="_blank"><span style="color: #ff0000">model of Karl Hess</span></a> rather than from the more mass accepted model most are familiar with. And in the case of Marx, he may have been a lot less dedicated to the true left causes of socialism but rather more about brute power and control.</p><p></p><p>To quote Noam Chomsky in regards to Marx:</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Maybe the idealism of socialism in the case of Marx may be more fiction than fact.</p><p></p><p>Something you might consider watching is the 1990's Adam Curtis documentary "Pandora's Box" which is free on the net to watch. </p><p></p><p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3gwyHNo7MI" target="_blank">Pandora's Box, E1: The Engineers' Plot - YouTube</a></p><p></p><p>There are 6 parts to this documentary if you care to watch it all.</p><p></p><p>The Soviet Union was built a lot more by American hands and engineering than we've been led to believe. The late Anthony Sutton of the Hoover Institute <a href="http://mailstar.net/sutton.html" target="_blank"><span style="color: #ff0000">proved that point</span></a> beyond dispute IMO.</p><p></p><p>As I asked earlier, could it really be that the captains of American Capitalism are the real marxists so to speak and that Obama, their store bought puppet is just following orders? If so, American so-called Conservatives and their blind allegiance to American exceptionalism and it's crony/finance capital economics may have been taken for a ride!</p><p><img src="/community/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/FeltTip/wink.png" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":wink2:" title="Wink :wink2:" data-shortname=":wink2:" /></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="wkmac, post: 1102551, member: 2189"] My point was that if Obama was a real Marxist, the stock market would have tanked because a real Marxist would have taken control of all means of production and placed it into the hands of the state. Even if ObamaCare was a Marxist grab of healthcare, how do you explain certain healthcare stocks that have since passage have continued an upward trend in stock price? The stock market did well because the policies of the State, some of it by Obama's hand eg market interventions thus benefited certain stock market players. I would re-assert my point that you might want to read Marx before asserting that Obama is a true Marxist or even left socialist. Some of the best condemnation of Obama that I've heard have in fact come from real Marxists and Socialists but if you want to assert Obama is a socialist more along the lines of a right wing socialist I would agree but then we are moving into the realm of fascism which would thus explain why favored corporatist factions of capital has done so well. Would also explain why both sides of the current political landscape no more want a true free or rather freed market than they want their bank accounts to go empty. If one further reads Joseph Pierre Proudhon or even Bakunin, I don't see 20th century state communism as much from the left but more from the right but then I see the left/right spectrum along the [URL="http://wconger.blogspot.com/2005/08/karl-hess-left-right-spectrum.html"][COLOR=#ff0000]model of Karl Hess[/COLOR][/URL] rather than from the more mass accepted model most are familiar with. And in the case of Marx, he may have been a lot less dedicated to the true left causes of socialism but rather more about brute power and control. To quote Noam Chomsky in regards to Marx: Maybe the idealism of socialism in the case of Marx may be more fiction than fact. Something you might consider watching is the 1990's Adam Curtis documentary "Pandora's Box" which is free on the net to watch. [URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3gwyHNo7MI"]Pandora's Box, E1: The Engineers' Plot - YouTube[/URL] There are 6 parts to this documentary if you care to watch it all. The Soviet Union was built a lot more by American hands and engineering than we've been led to believe. The late Anthony Sutton of the Hoover Institute [URL="http://mailstar.net/sutton.html"][COLOR=#ff0000]proved that point[/COLOR][/URL] beyond dispute IMO. As I asked earlier, could it really be that the captains of American Capitalism are the real marxists so to speak and that Obama, their store bought puppet is just following orders? If so, American so-called Conservatives and their blind allegiance to American exceptionalism and it's crony/finance capital economics may have been taken for a ride! :wink2: [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Home
Forums
Brown Cafe Community Center
Current Events
There Will Be No Economic Recovery. Prepare Yourself Accordingly.
Top