TNT Deal?? & Billion Dollars?? What??

beentheredonethat

Well-Known Member
Sorry but I see zero correlation here.


The correlation is that agreements were clearly spelled out in the contract (and in my example of the house). UPS is fulfilling the wording of the contract that even other teamsters say is in the contract. My point is just because costs go up, UPS isn't required to go above and beyond the contract just to be a nice guy. Also, if we do this, and pay more for a year or two then stop, you can and probably will file a greivance for past precedence.
 

beentheredonethat

Well-Known Member
MilkMan... I appreciate the work the drivers do, heck I was one about 23 years ago. I am not aware of many (if any) large fortune 500 companies that doesn't spend money advertising. FDX advertises way more then we do, it has been shown that this helps to maintain and win new business. If it didn't, we would not spend the money. Yet somehow, because we advertise for busines, we should instead take that money and give it away to what is not contractually obligated. While at the same time, FDX air drivers make less and FDX ground drivers make way less then our drivers. I guess we have to agree to disagree. However whatever you or I think doesn't really matter. The issue is HW costs have gone up and as I said, I already pay 650+ month for HW and Flex spending Acct. I've been paying similar amounts (although rising) for many many years. How is it fair that for the last 1/2 dozen or more years an active mgmt person pays more for HW then a retired teamster. That makes no sense. If it were somewhat fair they would be the same.
 

The Milkman

Well-Known Member
MilkMan... I appreciate the work the drivers do, heck I was one about 23 years ago. I am not aware of many (if any) large fortune 500 companies that doesn't spend money advertising. FDX advertises way more then we do, it has been shown that this helps to maintain and win new business. If it didn't, we would not spend the money. Yet somehow, because we advertise for busines, we should instead take that money and give it away to what is not contractually obligated. While at the same time, FDX air drivers make less and FDX ground drivers make way less then our drivers. I guess we have to agree to disagree. However whatever you or I think doesn't really matter. The issue is HW costs have gone up and as I said, I already pay 650+ month for HW and Flex spending Acct. I've been paying similar amounts (although rising) for many many years. How is it fair that for the last 1/2 dozen or more years an active mgmt person pays more for HW then a retired teamster. That makes no sense. If it were somewhat fair they would be the same.

Yes I will Agree to Disagree:fightings:
 

brownmonster

Man of Great Wisdom
The correlation is that agreements were clearly spelled out in the contract (and in my example of the house). UPS is fulfilling the wording of the contract that even other teamsters say is in the contract. My point is just because costs go up, UPS isn't required to go above and beyond the contract just to be a nice guy. Also, if we do this, and pay more for a year or two then stop, you can and probably will file a greivance for past precedence.

How do we know the cost went up? Because UPS says it did? Let us see a copy of their policy and bill.
 

beentheredonethat

Well-Known Member
How do we know the cost went up? Because UPS says it did? Let us see a copy of their policy and bill.

Really? talks of health cost going up has been going on for years, obamacare was introduced to deal with the spiraling costs. Others have already posted how expensive family insurance costs to buy. The price listed by UPS for the shared portion fits right in with what you could pay for insurance in the market. How do we show all the costs down to the penny to satisfy you without dealing with HIPPA violations?
 

moreluck

golden ticket member
Really? talks of health cost going up has been going on for years, obamacare was introduced to deal with the spiraling costs. Others have already posted how expensive family insurance costs to buy. The price listed by UPS for the shared portion fits right in with what you could pay for insurance in the market. How do we show all the costs down to the penny to satisfy you without dealing with HIPPA violations?
Obamacare is introduced gradually 'til 2020 and all of it is up,up, up !!! He lied about reducing your medical costs.
 

brownmonster

Man of Great Wisdom
Really? talks of health cost going up has been going on for years, obamacare was introduced to deal with the spiraling costs. Others have already posted how expensive family insurance costs to buy. The price listed by UPS for the shared portion fits right in with what you could pay for insurance in the market. How do we show all the costs down to the penny to satisfy you without dealing with HIPPA violations?

Is UPS self insured? Im not blind to the fact rates are going up. Just would like to know the figures. As a side, if my insurance in retirement is only 475 a month I'll be tickled pink.
 

oldngray

nowhere special
Don't retired hourly employees get a golden parachute like top management? Oh, yea. I forgot. That was put in writing for people at the top but at the bottom was just vague promises with no requirements to honor the spirit of the agreements.
 

sortaisle

Livin the cardboard dream
I'm part time with a family of 3. This year on my w2 form the value of my insurance was 14500. That's a lot of scratch. I agree that we both should comply with what was contractually agreed upon. UPS makes billions in profit...that would be after we're paid, ups buys properties, upgrades equipment, buys new package cars...all that. Profits in the billies. I think they can afford to maintain. If they don't profit anymore, then discussions will come up at THAT time. Not before. UPS is a good corporation for sure. It's sad that it's not what it was before with a shared culture between management and employees. It's all about that free money they get from stocks now. No matter how you look at it, that's sad. No matter who's fault it is/was.
 

beentheredonethat

Well-Known Member
I'm part time with a family of 3. This year on my w2 form the value of my insurance was 14500. That's a lot of scratch. I agree that we both should comply with what was contractually agreed upon. UPS makes billions in profit...that would be after we're paid, ups buys properties, upgrades equipment, buys new package cars...all that. Profits in the billies. I think they can afford to maintain. If they don't profit anymore, then discussions will come up at THAT time. Not before. UPS is a good corporation for sure. It's sad that it's not what it was before with a shared culture between management and employees. It's all about that free money they get from stocks now. No matter how you look at it, that's sad. No matter who's fault it is/was.

The billions is after we are paid. However, after we are paid, UPS uses the money for a variety of things. For example, when we put in Worldport additions, Or buy vehicles or purchase aircraft, or invest in new servers etc. That is all "spent" after we list our profits. (It's how all the companies do it per GAAP). Things like current use, (ie purchasing gas, oil, electricity, repairing a pkg car, etc) are before the profit numbers are calculated. Also, after the profit we also use it to do stock buybacks (purchase stock on open market and retire it) also to pay dividends.
 

beentheredonethat

Well-Known Member
I'm part time with a family of 3. This year on my w2 form the value of my insurance was 14500. That's a lot of scratch. I agree that we both should comply with what was contractually agreed upon. UPS makes billions in profit...that would be after we're paid, ups buys properties, upgrades equipment, buys new package cars...all that. Profits in the billies. I think they can afford to maintain. If they don't profit anymore, then discussions will come up at THAT time. Not before. UPS is a good corporation for sure. It's sad that it's not what it was before with a shared culture between management and employees. It's all about that free money they get from stocks now. No matter how you look at it, that's sad. No matter who's fault it is/was.


I think you contradicted yourself, you said we should comply with what is contractually agreed to. We agreed to pay out a certain dollar amount and if costs go beyond that the cost is shared. So per what you said in that sentence you agree that the retiree should pay more per month to cover the extra costs. Then you said, UPS should we should "maintain" benefits. I'm assuming, you mean UPS pay more then what was contractually agreed to.
 

sortaisle

Livin the cardboard dream
Do you always assume the worst? I said we should comply with the contract and UPS can maintain. There's no contradiction. Do you really think it's going to fly if UPS cries foul and locks us out (hopefully and probably not) when they profit in the billions? I'm not saying you should give give give. I'm saying they could maintain. At the least maintain. In 2011 UPS net income was 3.84 billion. That's money after all expenses. Just a sitting there.
 

beentheredonethat

Well-Known Member
In 2011 UPS net income was 3.84 billion. That's money after all expenses. Just a sitting there.


It's not money after all expenses, In order to grow, UPS needs to reinvest in itself such as building worldport (or expanding worldport) buying airplanes, buying vehicles. All that is used with the money that is listed as Profit. Also, UPS uses that for stock buyback to make the stock remaining more valuable and also uses it for dividends. We also use some of it to invest in other companies. (Granted the last attempt didn't work out well).
 

beentheredonethat

Well-Known Member
Do you always assume the worst? I said we should comply with the contract and UPS can maintain. There's no contradiction. Do you really think it's going to fly if UPS cries foul and locks us out (hopefully and probably not) when they profit in the billions? I'm not saying you should give give give. I'm saying they could maintain. At the least maintain. In 2011 UPS net income was 3.84 billion. That's money after all expenses. Just a sitting there.

I'm pointing out the contradiction. The contract does not say, UPS will cover 100% of all retiree medical costs (less 50/month copay).
What it does say is per other posters, is the contract states UPS covers the first x dollars of medical costs beyond that, UPS and retiree split the cost. (which by the way is better then what mgmt retiree's like myself will be paying). You stated we should abide by contract and follow it. (Which I agree with). We already pay our drivers higher then our competition and our benefits are already higher then our competition. Although I disagree with what the top mgmt at UPS has gotten for increases, they are still paid less then others in other companies.

I just don't get why people complain when UPS makes profits, and feel it's not right a company makes profit. It's as if the company and the people running it are wrong if they make money. Companies exist to make money. if they didn't people wouldn't risk their own money and time to create a company.
 

The Milkman

Well-Known Member
Do you always assume the worst? I said we should comply with the contract and UPS can maintain. There's no contradiction. Do you really think it's going to fly if UPS cries foul and locks us out (hopefully and probably not) when they profit in the billions? I'm not saying you should give give give. I'm saying they could maintain. At the least maintain. In 2011 UPS net income was 3.84 billion. That's money after all expenses. Just a sitting there.
:goodpost:



Can't Argue with Beenthere.....He's been there so long.........Typical Company Man/Woman who will bleed Brown and sell their souls for the needs of UPS..
 

Catatonic

Nine Lives
UPS makes billions in profit...that would be after we're paid, [-]ups buys properties, upgrades equipment, buys new package cars...all that. [/-]

1 out of four ain't bad ... but it ain't too good either.
After tax dollars are used to
buy properties
upgrade equipment
buy new package cars
---- any capital purchases have to be depreciated according to their investment class if they are over $500
UPS has to purchase them and then depreciate over the years - 3 to 35 years depending on class and depreciation schedule.

They also use after tax to pay dividends
Buy back stock
Fund other capital and non-capital investments you did not mention.
 

DainGrant

Well-Known Member
I think UPS can do way better than they are doing now. Starting wage still at the same place since the 80;s. The.morale amongst the teamsters are very low no form of motivation or anything of the sort. I think the subject of damages needs urgent attention..too many damaged pkgs..imagine i pay to ship a pkg with u im all excited to recieve my pkg only to get it broken or get a tracking message damaged in transir..but then again thats on mgmt ive seen unloaders rushed by mgmt to unload real fast which results in broken wine bottles,wet pkgs,even a case of damaged court documents...and we talk crap about buying and expanding when we cant handle what we have already..why buy 5 dogs when u cant control the one u already have? Jus sayin until we improve quality of service with the customer in mind at all times we will continue on the path to destruction..it takes a whole lot to get to the top of a ladder but nothing to fall right off! Peace...
 

The Milkman

Well-Known Member
I think UPS can do way better than they are doing now. Starting wage still at the same place since the 80;s. The.morale amongst the teamsters are very low no form of motivation or anything of the sort. I think the subject of damages needs urgent attention..too many damaged pkgs..imagine i pay to ship a pkg with u im all excited to recieve my pkg only to get it broken or get a tracking message damaged in transir..but then again thats on mgmt ive seen unloaders rushed by mgmt to unload real fast which results in broken wine bottles,wet pkgs,even a case of damaged court documents...and we talk crap about buying and expanding when we cant handle what we have already..why buy 5 dogs when u cant control the one u already have? Jus sayin until we improve quality of service with the customer in mind at all times we will continue on the path to destruction..it takes a whole lot to get to the top of a ladder but nothing to fall right off! Peace...

:youreright:
 
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