"To all UPS Employees concerned about their pensions & Benefits" !!!!!!

Discussion in 'UPS Union Issues' started by wildgoose, Sep 22, 2006.

  1. wildgoose

    wildgoose WILDGOOSE

    UPS employees you must read this document !!!!!!!!!!!! Let me know if thumnail is readable otherwise i have to wait till administrator sends me a bigger version to upload. Very hard to upload on webpage. wildgoose.
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    {edited by moderator to add resized files}
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2006
  2. Working4TheBene's

    Working4TheBene's New Member

    Cannot read it.....
     
  3. Working4TheBene's

    Working4TheBene's New Member

    What was the general summary of it?
     
  4. wildgoose

    wildgoose WILDGOOSE

    try again it should show up now
     
  5. hoser

    hoser Industrial Slob

    Wow what a fair unbiased analysis of the issues!

    Is this vote going to hit Canada?
     
  6. Financially, the apwa is the obvious way to go. What about labor issues? What do we have to give up?
     
  7. wkmac

    wkmac Well-Known Member

    I think it is very important to point out that the figures given for APWA retirement payouts are for only folks who complete a 30 year term under their plan. If you currently have 15 years with Central States and then switch to APWA and work another 15 years expecting the big payout, you are in for a rude awaking. You will recieve a pro-rated payout for your 15 years which last time I saw would be itself about $3k per month but for the other 15 years service you would have to go back to Central States and qualify under their current rules which by then you may have to be 65 or even 70 years old. It's already been changed once and could be changed again and not in the direction many of us would like.

    APWA has no plan at all to allow for prior years to be carried over for credit so whatever years you now have under CS or other IBT plan will stay there. Although I have 25 FT years under IBT CS, because of my age I do like the possibility under the APWA. Where I differ is how they advertise the pension such as the example above and it tends to mislead IMO. IBT does the same thing all the time as an example would be the lastest pension changes that took place over the summer and then described in the CS Quarterly publication entitled TeamWork.

    I really think APWA should be upfront and above board on this specific issue but like the example above they don't and I think it's ashame. By being upfront and honest, not only would that demonstrate to all that even in bad news you get the straight scoop but it also opens up a potential dialogue that in this manner a broader solution could be found that would make a transition for 20 plus year IBT folks over to an APWA system more appealing. I think for many with 15 plus years in and even moreso for those with 20 or more, if you solve the pension as it relates to past years credit, APWA would really rocket forward in mass appeal at UPS. Teamsters knew exactly what they were doing in demanding control of Health and Welfare from the get go!

    JMO.
     
  8. I read this on a teamsters site. Interesting to say the least.
    "I went to a UPS contract meeting Last week. This is what I found out. 40,000 Contributors In UPS Centrel States Fund At @ $238( 2007 Rate). 40,000 x $238 Thats 9,520,000.00 A WEEK!!!!!!!!!!! THATS A LOT OF Zeros. Thats Just Central states Teamsters, not the rest of the country! Yellow has 8,625 retirees collecting and 6,546 contibuting. Consoladated has 7,792 retirees collecting 0 contributing. Roadway has 7,520 retirees collecting 6,385 contributing . UPS has 6,865 retirees collecting and 40,0000 contributing. ABF has 4,666 retirees collecting and 2,655 contributing. Which Trailer is the lead Trailer in this scenario?? WAKE UP BROWN BROTHERS! We may Bleed blue and gold, but when it comes time to collect we all need GREEN."
     
  9. wkmac

    wkmac Well-Known Member

    If your facts and figures are true, then it does speak volumes for sure!
     
  10. sendagain

    sendagain Member

    I have yet to see how APWA expects to attain the money it will need to cover these promised benefits. With unions in a decline, how will they ever get the necessary funds to cover the pensioners? It is like the housing market; you can't go wrong when everyone wants a house, and their value is increasing. Everybody wants in. However, the unions are not popular today, and they are not signing up new members. It is just like social security: the payouts are not sustainable without an increase in people paying into the system. Older teamsters will watch their benefits steadily drop, and newer drivers will be decades away from being able to see these promised benefits came to fruition.
     
  11. brett636

    brett636 Well-Known Member

    Those are the small details they will work out once they take your money and representation away.
     
  12. dragracer66

    dragracer66 Active Member

    If the APWA is so great why aren't they representing other package companies. Good point where are they getting there fund's from??
     
  13. brett636

    brett636 Well-Known Member

    Goodluck getting them to tell you that. They won't even say how much money they have or how many members they have recruited to date. I'm willing to bet they either have poor funding at this point or have a source of funding they don't want to disclose. Either way, hide information like that from me and you won't get my vote.
     
  14. Pip

    Pip New Member

    The proposed numbers APWA has been putting up does at the very least make you think about what their offering vs. the IBT. Some of the numbers seem on the verge of " too good to be true". Whether they are, or not, would have to played out with time. The only thing I would have reservations about is the pension. Everything thing else i have no problem with.

    My big sticking point about APWA is this and to me This is a major sticking point. and wkmac touched on it. Hypothetically speaking at this point in time. There are a large number of UPSers that do in fact have 10 yrs and up of time invested with the IBT. To switch now to APWA right in the middle of their careers, it is in essence, starting over on building your years of service til retirement, just to get the 20 yr pension.

    The people that have 10+ yrs of service accrued would be hit the hardest, they would be in a catch22, so to speak. not enough time acrued to get full retirement from the IBT( not to mention if UPS were to pull out of the IBT at this point, the cash flow would all but stop.then there would be nothing left.) and would be under the proposed retirement guidelines for APWA to collect a meaningful pension.

    The incentive is there with people under 10 yrs of service to change. For those over 10+ yrs, The incentive to switch at this point is not very attractive.

    Until this is addressed in great detail how to handle the problem of seniority already established, I don't see how it would benefit to change from the IBT to APWA at this point.

    For the new employee coming in now and in the future, yes APWA looks like the way to go with the proposed numbers. But there is going to be sacrifice from the older members if a switch was made and I don't think it would be fair to the older people.

    From my thinking, somewhere along the line, if in fact a switch was made in unions, somebody is going to have to take one for the team, and it will not just be a couple people affected. If APWA has already addressed this potential problem, I just haven't seen it yet, and that could very well be the case, that i haven't heard about it yet.

    I can't help but think there are others with 10+ yrs invested wondering the same thing about there future.
     
  15. wildgoose

    wildgoose WILDGOOSE

    Excellent post ! The people with 10 + years will be acruing a rate of for every 5 years under APWA $1000 will go to their retirement. So if one would stay 15 years = $3000 under their plan. Collecting your $ will start approximately the time you retire at any age with 20,25,30 etc. And if Central states retains your money you will receive that upon the 57,62 or 65 age like now.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2006
  16. wildgoose

    wildgoose WILDGOOSE

    You voted for the teamsters and they are not disclosing all the details ! The balance keeps going down and the folks keep saying its going to get better ?
     
  17. wildgoose

    wildgoose WILDGOOSE

    The same place the union is getting them from a negotiated conctract with Ups ! Its no magic but the amount that will be put to the drivers will be a much higher ratio than the 40% + we are getting !
     
  18. dragracer66

    dragracer66 Active Member

    How do you figure? Parcel is not going to negotiate a contract with some fly by night wanna be union alternative! Secondly any driver with 10+ years of service would never vote them in. Like it was said earlier the apwa can't dovetail any current teamster pension over to themselves you might as well quit and get another job and start over again!!! And do all these number's they are throwing out at you guy's have any merit!! I'm not saying the teamster's are perfect but anybody with alot of year's would be foolish to leave now!!
     
  19. wildgoose

    wildgoose WILDGOOSE

    What makes you an authority on who will and won`t negotiate a contract with UPS. 10 + year drivers are ready for a change its the younger ones that have a right to vote but could care less ? You pay the teamsters not them paying you to represent but they tell you what you can do and can`t. Something is wrong with this senario. To tell you what you can do once you leave is just wrong ! You pay them to control your life ? Catro in Cuba runs just like that so his people are afraid to say anything for fear of getting a as# whooping. And you wonder why they intertube to the states ?
     
  20. wildgoose

    wildgoose WILDGOOSE

    Dragracer are you under the IAM UNION ? Because they really are going to enjoy their pension. Big bucks for 30 years. Up to $10k a month !