trump 2016

[wkmac]

But then some industries would die off. Some assets will crash. And it doesn't solve the issue of companies fleeing.

Maybe they should die off. State interventionism to correct misallocation of resources/assets is what creates an unsustainable economic condition that requires constant bailout infusions in order to prop up a business or economic model. Death allows the deck to be cleared and other means to arise and take their place, typically a more scaled down model not as dependent as the previous and often more growth dynamic. And such new economy can also be more wide spread and not as consolidated to a central or single location spreading both work and economy to a wider population.

You bring up Boeing and Carrier but what happens when a small regional or local business with say 1500 employees faces closure, why should the Federal gov't favor Boeing and Carrier who are on the big stage while ignoring the misfortunes of this local business no one outside the local business area has ever heard of? And if for 1500, why not for 150 or for 15? Where does this all stop at? Or is politics purely about scale too?

Instead of arm twisting, why doesn't Trump get govt out of the entire interventionism market in the first place, part of Palin's point (to her credit), that just might suppress economic activity that more than fills the void of the Carrier jobs in the first place? Why do we assume maintaining the business/economic status quo is the only answer?

Even UPS one day will sunset to be replaced by something else that better fits the needs of economy. I question even now if both UPS and FedEx have gotten too big but I know in such circles as this, such thinking is heresy. But then I like heresy!

 

[wkmac]

Back to Trump's "revoke citizenship for flag burning" idea, if one's citizenship is revoked, does this also lift the burden of their portion of the national debt?

If so, then flag burning might become a positive economic action to take.


Political gum bumping by self inflated egomaniacs aside, revoking citizenship for flag burning will never pass SCOTUS muster and the Congress, even in their own ineptness, won't pass such a law in the first place. But Trump will get the mindless hayseed vote with it as it seems to have already done that.

 

[pickup]

Liberals freaking out??? HUH?

Dude, the GOP is the laughing stock of candidates, and believe me, there ISNT one democrat freaking out over ANY of the GOP candidates. Its a clown car for sure, and we thank you for supplying the daily laughs as your candidates say the stupidest things.

TOS.

You're welcome!

 

[rickyb]

ralph nader: Now, whether the presidency gets the better angels from him or whether a major terrorist attack from abroad turns him into a monster is really the big question of the day. Because he could turn into a dictatorial monster and using his short phrases, sway people to give up their liberties and crowd out their necessities, focusing on the war and terror, which of course just increases stateless terrorism and country after country"

this is from episode 141 of the ralph nader radio hour. guys i listen to have been warning about a police state under obama as well.

 

[rickyb]

How do you value a coop share?
Most cannot afford to buy in.
And most would be devastated in the case of Failure.

ive listened to a ton of richard wolff's economic update radio hour, in addition to alot of gar alperovitz's stuff, so ive probably heard this before but i forgot.

so check out democracyatwork.info , The Democracy Collaborative , Community-Wealth.org: Wealth-Building Strategies for America's Communities , rdwolff.com,

coops are not theoretical, its a very old way of running an economy, its interesting it hasnt developed more than it has

 

[1989]

ive listened to a ton of richard wolff's economic update radio hour, in addition to alot of gar alperovitz's stuff, so ive probably heard this before but i forgot.

so check out democracyatwork.info , The Democracy Collaborative , Community-Wealth.org: Wealth-Building Strategies for America's Communities , rdwolff.com,

coops are not theoretical, its a very old way of running an economy, its interesting it hasnt developed more than it has

My point is, it costs money to start a business. Who is supplying the capital? Are you in the position to put up $50,000 USD cash?

It also takes time to get going. You will have to work a ton of hours in the beginning. Maybe the whole time. My 9-12 hour days are nothing compared to what a successful business owner does. They're working 24/7.

Then you have a high possibility of failure. Who puts up more capital if needed? And you could starve until you start churning a profit. It could take months or even a year or two.

But my main concern is that you can't find any details about these coops. You don't see a problem with that? There must be a reason, this isn't highly classified information.

I have only seen them work on farms. The farm owner puts out "shares" class a share feeds 2-4 people. Class B feeds 4-6 people. Say $100-$150 a week. You pick up, or they will deliver (for a fee) once a week during the harvest season. The next year you have to buy in again.

 

[rickyb]

My point is, it costs money to start a business. Who is supplying the capital? Are you in the position to put up $50,000 USD cash?

It also takes time to get going. You will have to work a ton of hours in the beginning. Maybe the whole time. My 9-12 hour days are nothing compared to what a successful business owner does. They're working 24/7.

Then you have a high possibility of failure. Who puts up more capital if needed? And you could starve until you start churning a profit. It could take months or even a year or two.

But my main concern is that you can't find any details about these coops. You don't see a problem with that? There must be a reason, this isn't highly classified information.

I have only seen them work on farms. The farm owner puts out "shares" class a share feeds 2-4 people. Class B feeds 4-6 people. Say $100-$150 a week. You pick up, or they will deliver (for a fee) once a week during the harvest season. The next year you have to buy in again.

i didnt look, i gave a list of websites off the top of my head that would probably have some answers for you.

if i remember the coops have a harder time getting loans from banks because banks are partly ideologically opposed to their business model.

italy has something called the marcora law where if you get 8 or so unemployed people together, the government will give you all you EI money lump sum to start a coop. italy has the most coops in the world at 40,000 i believe.

coops are statistically more likely to succeed than capitalist businesses

 

[rickyb]

uh oh. i find this highly unlikely.

Michael Moore predicts Electoral College will deny Donald Trump: “He’s not president of the United States yet”

 

[wkmac]

But my main concern is that you can't find any details about these coops. You don't see a problem with that? There must be a reason, this isn't highly classified information.

Depends on what you mean by details. Co-ops are all around if you look. I'm a member of 3 co-ops. I joined REI, a mail order backpackers/climbers co-op in the 1970's that now has brick and mortar retail spaces and I get my electrical power from a electrical co-op. We are also members of a local food cooperative.

Every heard of Nationwide Insurance? Another Co-op, see here and also go to Nationwide's website and read about that history. There is a list at Wikipedia of cooperatives, many of those names you might even recognize.

And since on the subject, what about employee owned companies? Here is a list of the 100 largest employee owned companies in the US. Until 1998' UPS was likely on such list but many of us will remember the sad day when that was no longer the case. My daughter works for a construction materials manufacturing company that is employee owned and she loves it. Cisco-Eagle, a materials handling manufacturer, is another employee owned/employee managed company you might check out. Go to their products list and see what all they produce. Graybar Electric is an employee owned company that I do personal business with and we get electrical components from a subsidiary of theirs for our conveyors at UPS.

 

[wkmac]

italy has something called the marcora law where if you get 8 or so unemployed people together, the government will give you all you EI money lump sum to start a coop. italy has the most coops in the world at 40,000 i believe.

From what I've read of the Italian model you speak of, this is an option in which you can either go on normal welfare or get a lump sum payment up front in order to start a business. However, if you fail, you are then on your own and have no recourse to draw from public funds for your needs so the incentive is to be successful. Don't quote me on this as I read on the subject some time ago but I think some other European countries has like or similar models in their systems as well. Not sure which however.

That said, this is how I understand the model to work.

 

[rickyb]

i heard trump is going to get rid of the estate tax aka the death tax.

this tax only kicks in after the first 10.9 million dollars. so essentially he wants to get rid of a tax that only the richest pay. and on top of that its probably already been watered down.

if you don't know how this tax works, you might question your news sources.

 

[Babagounj]

I still love how Sen Ted Kennedy got his mother's estate probated in FL. Where the estate taxes were lower than in Ma.
It was quite comical since she spent her last years in Ma. and hadn't been in FL. for almost a decade .

 

[Catatonic]

 

[Catatonic]

 

[pickup]

i didnt look, i gave a list of websites off the top of my head that would probably have some answers for you.

if i remember the coops have a harder time getting loans from banks because banks are partly ideologically opposed to their business model.

italy has something called the marcora law where if you get 8 or so unemployed people together, the government will give you all you EI money lump sum to start a coop. italy has the most coops in the world at 40,000 i believe.

coops are statistically more likely to succeed than capitalist businesses

I always knew running a pigeon coop could be fun but I didn't realize that it could be profitable as well.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

Trump is at the Army/Navy game.

 

[DriveInDriveOut]

View attachment 108626

Funny.
Of course neither of those is an electoral or crime map.
It's also funny that fictional memes and fake news stories played such a large part in making up people's minds this election cycle.

 

[Catatonic]

Funny.
Of course neither of those is an electoral or crime map.
It's also funny that fictional memes and fake news stories played such a large part in making up people's minds this election cycle.

I was pretty sure they were made up but I thought it was funny.

 

[BrownArmy]

I was pretty sure they were made up but I thought it was funny.

wow.

 

[Catatonic]

wow.

Dude! It's Current Events!