Who do you blame?

Discussion in 'Brown Cafe Polls' started by IVE GOTTA PACKAGE 4U, Sep 24, 2014.

?

who do you blame?

Poll closed Nov 3, 2014.
  1. Shooter

    68.8%
  2. UPS

    12.5%
  3. Management

    18.8%
  1. UPS or the shooter ,or management?
     
  2. Seriously?
     
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  3. jumpman23

    jumpman23 Oh Yeah

    As more information comes out, and im still not backing down from my opinion of what a cowardly act this man acted out, but its pretty apparent in my opinion that ups burned this guy with some dishonesty on their part to get rid of him. Don't know why but we know how the game and the scenario goes as we see it everyday. Im not sticking up for him in any possible way, cause what he did is total BS and the fact that he killed himself also after taking these other individuals life is what he deserves. But we can all kind of understand what drove him to this, maybe not completely but we sorta understand. Don't misconstrue what im saying, as i would agree that we all think what he did is horrible and cowardly act. Just my opinion as of right now as things are coming out.
     
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  4. Rainman

    Rainman Its all good.

    The shooter made the decision, so in the end it's his fault. Management had its impact on his behavior by their actions. Not knowing all the details, maybe their actions were totally justified, or not.
    Too much management bashing has been going on. These guys are just like us, just trying to make a living and take care of their families. Some management people are scuzzbags, but most are reasonable people just trying to do a job. And their jobs suck much worse than ours. Have a little compassion here. These people are at the mercy of corporate just like us, while not having the job security we have.


    Kmart sux. So does Walmart. And Orion.
     
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  5. greengrenades

    greengrenades To be the man, you gotta beat the man.

    Of course it was the shooters fault. However we all know how much management are pieces of garbage and treat employees like dirt. I'm not saying they deserved to die or forced the guy to do it, but some people can only take so much. I would like to know why he was fired. With all that said I want to repeat before anyone tries to argue with me for no reason, the shooter was wrong, nobody deserved to die, and he was pretty much a psychopath.
     
  6. oldngray

    oldngray nowhere special

    Who do you balme? Is this poll about Inde?
     
  7. gman042

    gman042 Been around the block a few times

    There are many things that contributed to the final act of this man. Some will be known, some never will be known.
    One thing is for sure. Decisions were made by UPS that impacted more than just the man involved.
    Maybe if it was not an US against THEM mentality and we worked together in harmony for the betterment of the company things could have been handled differently. As it was, there were some honesty issues on the part of someone that caused this tragedy.
     
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  8. bleedinbrown58

    bleedinbrown58 ahhh....the mouth breathers

    We will never know the whole story behind why Joe was fired. But we all know that we are all pieces of schnit and will never be good enough....so we play the game....we've been playing it for years. We also know that if management wants you gone...they will find a way...however shady and underhanded.

    But how could anyone be such a coward and abandon his family like that? A real man would've stood up, dusted himself off and moved on....it's a job! There are other jobs out there. You made your
    family...it's your responsibility to take care of them.
     
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  9. brown bomber

    brown bomber brown bomber

    BB,...totally agree,...with your reply
    couldn't imagine taking it to that extreme,....some day I'll tell you of my struggles
     
  10. Packmule

    Packmule Well-Known Member

    Don't know the details of why he was fired, but his actions afterwards suggest a mental disorder that may have been the cause of his termination in the first place.
     
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  11. gman042

    gman042 Been around the block a few times

    Depression is a monster that can wreck the most sane of minds.
     
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  12. Packmule

    Packmule Well-Known Member

    Bipolar, narcistic, and borderline personality disorders are exploding in numbers these days, largely due to the breakdown of the family and good role models.
    Everyone gets their buttons pushed in life, but some are not equipped to handle it responsibly. The only thing any of us can do is be aware that quirky behavior may be a serious warning sign and don't pass it off as harmless.
     
  13. Packmule

    Packmule Well-Known Member

    Bipolar, narcistic, and borderline personality disorders are exploding in numbers these days, largely due to the breakdown of the family and good role models.
    Everyone gets their buttons pushed in life, but some are not equipped to handle it responsibly. The only thing any of us can do is be aware that quirky behavior may be a serious warning sign and don't pass it off as harmless.
     
  14. 1989

    1989 Well-Known Member

    I blame bush
     
  15. TheOneTheyDontLike

    TheOneTheyDontLike New Member

    I blame The shop steward
     
  16. bleedinbrown58

    bleedinbrown58 ahhh....the mouth breathers

    Sure, sir. I'm all ears...
     
  17. Big Arrow Down...D

    Big Arrow Down...D Leave the gun,take the cannoli

    T&Ears?
     
  18. browned out

    browned out Active Member


    Management can be extremely disparate when it comes to discipline and also disgustingly dishonest; even at higher levels. This most likely played a part in the murderer's actions. No one can justify his actions.

    I expressed a safety concern many years ago. It ruffled some feathers and would end up costing UPS $$ to comply with new Federal Safety Regulations.

    Long Story; Short: Division and Center Manager(s) were :censored2: off and retaliated. Multiple drivers were observed and disciplined. I was one of the drivers disciplined. I was observed one day towards the end of the hottest summer ever recorded at the time. I may had some minor methods infractions and received a warning letter. Other drivers had major infractions ( talking on the phone while driving, parking on the wrong side of the road, etc. ) Most of their discipline was rescinded; mine was not. It is nearly impossible to be 100% when it is over 96 degrees outside, and 120 degrees in the back of the truck.

    I took my warning letter and made a commitment to be 100% from there on out. The murderer, no matter how wrong his actions were, felt he was treated disparity in the discipline. I can relate. Some of the events that happened to me follow: I was retaliated against due to a safety concern. First; I received a warning letter for some very minor methods infractions. The Division Manager and Center Manager observed me a second time. I noticed them as soon as their observation began. I knew they were photographing me and most likely video taping the observation. I knew exactly how perfect my methods were that day. Management lied about what occurred and I was suspended. Next step in progression would be discharge. I had evidence of their dishonesty and I still was suspended. It caused me immense stress knowing I could be discharged based on the lies of 2 or more retaliating managers who do not have to provide evidence. I ground my teeth to the point of fracturing. I even fractured a crown due to stress. I had immense trouble falling asleep. When I did fall asleep; I would wake with nightmares of new falsified management observations. I had to see a physiatrist to find out how to deal with the everyday every stop anxiety. Everyday; I feared I would lose my livelihood due to dishonest reports from mgmt. I withdrew from my family. I was consumed by the fear of mgmt. fabricating future discipline. I found justice through Federal OSHA. Federal OSHA found that UPS had retaliated against me and that UPS violated Federal Law.

    My family had some major medical issues and bills at the same time all this was happening. I do not know how I would have reacted if I had lost my livelihood due to dishonest, retaliating managers.

    I am glad that I had options that were mentally within my grasp. I dealt with it another way instead of violence. Grinding teeth, loss of sleep, nightmares, withdrawing from my family, psychiatrist visits and finally OSHA finding UPS in violation. The discipline was ordered to be removed. UPS was ordered to make me whole in terms of back pay, etc.

    The management philosophy needs to change at UPS.
     
  19. jumpman23

    jumpman23 Oh Yeah

    Yeah agree and feel ya dude. Its all a mind game, up to you to figure out how to play and win at the game. Everybody has a different approach and mindset as to how you want and need the game to play out. That's the big question you have to ask yourself in the end. Be a hardazz and be on the radar 24-7 or play the game a lil bit n make life easier for yourself. Only you know the answer to that question. Everybody is different and every center is different on how the rules are played. The job to me is just a means to an end to me. Not there to make friends or enemies, its all about me in the end and its all about you also. I could care less about UPS its just a job to make a paycheck is how I look at it and don't care about what anybody else does or says. People will have their opinion and are entitled to it but like I said its just a game.
     
  20. 10 point

    10 point Well-Known Member

    If all the hourly had your backbone it would change a lot quicker.