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<blockquote data-quote="wkmac" data-source="post: 756182" data-attributes="member: 2189"><p>Daniel Ellsberg (Pentagon Papers fame) <a href="http://antiwar.com/radio/2010/07/28/daniel-ellsberg-9/" target="_blank"><span style="color: red">on the recently Wikileaks situation</span></a></p><p> </p><p>And right after Scott Horton interviews Ellsberg, he does the same with <a href="http://antiwar.com/radio/2010/07/28/julian-assange-2/" target="_blank"><span style="color: red">Julian Assange</span></a>, the face of Wikileaks</p><p> </p><p>Assange may be a villian but 2 things to keep in mind. First,<a href="http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/politics/how-wikileaks-shone-light-on-worlds-darkest-secrets-1938729.html" target="_blank"><span style="color: red"> wikileaks exposed the emails</span> </a>in what came to be known as Climategate of which many here used to support their positions that global warming is a fraud. Also you Fox News lovers should be grateful as Fox more than any other got a ton of mileage out of that disclosure. </p><p> </p><p>The second concerns Ellsberg who at the time of the Pentagon Papers release was also considered a villian as well but history has an irony that proved Ellsberg correct. It worked so well that even years later former Defense Sec. under Kennedy/Johnson, Robert McNama publically admitted that the Gulf of Tonkin incident in fact "never happened!" (direct quote). <a href="http://www.google.com/search?q=the%20fog%20of%20war&rls=com.microsoft:en-us:IE-SearchBox&oe=UTF-8&rlz=1I7ACGW_en___US324&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbo=u&tbs=vid:1&source=og&sa=N&hl=en&tab=wv" target="_blank"><span style="color: red">Google Video "The Fog of War"</span></a> <a href="http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB132/tapes.htm" target="_blank"><span style="color: red">Tapes released</span> </a>from security archives reveal a lot more was behind the Gulf of Tonkin incident including our covert actions to provoke a response. This same ploy IMO was pulled with Iran recently by the US but the Iranian navy responding was little more than suped up rubber bass boats and stood no chance and thankfully so.</p><p> </p><p>If you think those in power can't skew the data then <a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2005/12/02/politics/02tonkin.html" target="_blank"><span style="color: red">think again</span></a> as it's a well worn path in the corridors of power. Even some Senators in the day <a href="http://stevenjohnhibbs.wordpress.com/2010/07/15/transcripts-reveal-senators-knew-gulf-of-tonkin-was-a-false-flag/" target="_blank"><span style="color: red">suspected not all was as it seemed!</span></a> Looking back, one has to wonder if Vietnam proved the perfect election vehicle for a sitting President who was running for re-election just as events served a later President who was elected with many questions left about the entire process. Did both Presidents use war to serve their own political ends?</p><p> </p><p>What will history in 20 or 30 more years reveal about recent and today's events as it relates to actions of gov't? Might Assange and Wikileaks prove like Ellsberg to go from villian to the ironic hero?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="wkmac, post: 756182, member: 2189"] Daniel Ellsberg (Pentagon Papers fame) [URL="http://antiwar.com/radio/2010/07/28/daniel-ellsberg-9/"][COLOR=red]on the recently Wikileaks situation[/COLOR][/URL] And right after Scott Horton interviews Ellsberg, he does the same with [URL="http://antiwar.com/radio/2010/07/28/julian-assange-2/"][COLOR=red]Julian Assange[/COLOR][/URL], the face of Wikileaks Assange may be a villian but 2 things to keep in mind. First,[URL="http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/politics/how-wikileaks-shone-light-on-worlds-darkest-secrets-1938729.html"][COLOR=red] wikileaks exposed the emails[/COLOR] [/URL]in what came to be known as Climategate of which many here used to support their positions that global warming is a fraud. Also you Fox News lovers should be grateful as Fox more than any other got a ton of mileage out of that disclosure. The second concerns Ellsberg who at the time of the Pentagon Papers release was also considered a villian as well but history has an irony that proved Ellsberg correct. It worked so well that even years later former Defense Sec. under Kennedy/Johnson, Robert McNama publically admitted that the Gulf of Tonkin incident in fact "never happened!" (direct quote). [URL="http://www.google.com/search?q=the%20fog%20of%20war&rls=com.microsoft:en-us:IE-SearchBox&oe=UTF-8&rlz=1I7ACGW_en___US324&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbo=u&tbs=vid:1&source=og&sa=N&hl=en&tab=wv"][COLOR=red]Google Video "The Fog of War"[/COLOR][/URL] [URL="http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB132/tapes.htm"][COLOR=red]Tapes released[/COLOR] [/URL]from security archives reveal a lot more was behind the Gulf of Tonkin incident including our covert actions to provoke a response. This same ploy IMO was pulled with Iran recently by the US but the Iranian navy responding was little more than suped up rubber bass boats and stood no chance and thankfully so. If you think those in power can't skew the data then [URL="http://www.nytimes.com/2005/12/02/politics/02tonkin.html"][COLOR=red]think again[/COLOR][/URL] as it's a well worn path in the corridors of power. Even some Senators in the day [URL="http://stevenjohnhibbs.wordpress.com/2010/07/15/transcripts-reveal-senators-knew-gulf-of-tonkin-was-a-false-flag/"][COLOR=red]suspected not all was as it seemed![/COLOR][/URL] Looking back, one has to wonder if Vietnam proved the perfect election vehicle for a sitting President who was running for re-election just as events served a later President who was elected with many questions left about the entire process. Did both Presidents use war to serve their own political ends? What will history in 20 or 30 more years reveal about recent and today's events as it relates to actions of gov't? Might Assange and Wikileaks prove like Ellsberg to go from villian to the ironic hero? [/QUOTE]
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