Will we go on strike if contract is voted down

[BrownShark2]

if voted down, ups will offer signing bonus $1000 ft $500 pt $$ then the pt will vote yes contract will pass then pt will always take the money they only make $8 and hour to start.

Brothers and Sisters,

The initial UPS offer included "signing bonuses" and only .30 cents an hour each year over five years. This was already shot down by hall in place of the $3.95 cent raise + .05 cents re-allocated from other contributions for a total of $4.00.

Here in local 396, "our" Officers thought they were beyond genius when they re-allocated an additional .25 cents from our hourly pension contributions towards our GWI for the first year.

They represented initially that "they" negotiated higher wages per hour when in fact they simply took it out of our left pockets to put it in our right pockets.

AS for going on strike, no way. You all have to recognize a simple concept.

Economic vs. Non-Economic.

The company will NEVER allow a strike to happen over NON-Economic disagreements.

They will ALWAYS renegotiate the disputes to a remedy. All the Economic issues seem to be well in hand for the company. Its the remaining language in the Master and the various riders that are in trouble.

To those who's locals are going to allow YEAR ROUND HELPERS, god help you. You will never see a new driver in the next contract without one being hired thru attrition.

Year round helpers do only one thing, TRAIN YOUR REPLACEMENT.

By the end of this new contract, if a strike was called (2013) these helpers would be ready to do your routes, handle your diads and drive your trucks, not to mention spend your paychecks. You'd better take a look further down the road on this issue.

Dont count on a strike happening if a shootdown of this contract happens. Another month of getting with the employees nationwide and then another 30 days negotiating and this thing is settled.

As far as showing the company that our leadership is in disarray, who cares, as long as the company recognizes that its member/employers still hold the reigns and instruct our leadership to follow our guidance.

Maybe next time, the Teamster leadership will consult with its members in earnest before they shake hands with the company and settle for something we are ready to shove up their high paid behinds.

Peace.

 

[rod]

Expect the unexpected

 

[satellitedriver]

If the contract doesn't pass, yes, there still is 9 months left to negotiate a new one.
Also, Jan 1st is a beginning point for the Gov. to be able to takeover CS.
So, the union is at an impasse. Losing control of a pension plan would be a great defeat in the ability of the teamsters to promote the notion that they can provide the benefits they claim they won. This is a gamble that union management doesn't wish to take.
If, CS pension goes south, it will have a profound effect on the teamsters future,in general.
PAX

 

[FIST]

Brothers and Sisters,

The initial UPS offer included "signing bonuses" and only .30 cents an hour each year over five years. This was already shot down by hall in place of the $3.95 cent raise + .05 cents re-allocated from other contributions for a total of $4.00.

Here in local 396, "our" Officers thought they were beyond genius when they re-allocated an additional .25 cents from our hourly pension contributions towards our GWI for the first year.

They represented initially that "they" negotiated higher wages per hour when in fact they simply took it out of our left pockets to put it in our right pockets.

AS for going on strike, no way. You all have to recognize a simple concept.

Economic vs. Non-Economic.

The company will NEVER allow a strike to happen over NON-Economic disagreements.

They will ALWAYS renegotiate the disputes to a remedy. All the Economic issues seem to be well in hand for the company. Its the remaining language in the Master and the various riders that are in trouble.

To those who's locals are going to allow YEAR ROUND HELPERS, god help you. You will never see a new driver in the next contract without one being hired thru attrition.

Year round helpers do only one thing, TRAIN YOUR REPLACEMENT.

By the end of this new contract, if a strike was called (2013) these helpers would be ready to do your routes, handle your diads and drive your trucks, not to mention spend your paychecks. You'd better take a look further down the road on this issue.

Dont count on a strike happening if a shootdown of this contract happens. Another month of getting with the employees nationwide and then another 30 days negotiating and this thing is settled.

As far as showing the company that our leadership is in disarray, who cares, as long as the company recognizes that its member/employers still hold the reigns and instruct our leadership to follow our guidance.

Maybe next time, the Teamster leadership will consult with its members in earnest before they shake hands with the company and settle for something we are ready to shove up their high paid behinds.

Peace.

Brown shark your a soldier but Jay was wrong it's only 20 Cents

 

[Damok]

It's amazing, what ever happened to "lets protect and improve our part time brothers".....You do realize the attitude shared by the author of this thread is throwing the lower senority part timers under the bus. A "no vote" and the threat of a strike looming is just what the doctor ordered for our competitors who are salivating at the opportunity and are more capable of handling UPS volume than in 97'. And a volume decrease equals layoffs and Zero progression for those expecting to move into full time positions.Then you turn to them and ask them to vote for their own damnation.

Beat me to it

 

[BrownShark]

It's amazing, what ever happened to "lets protect and improve our part time brothers".....You do realize the attitude shared by the author of this thread is throwing the lower senority part timers under the bus. A "no vote" and the threat of a strike looming is just what the doctor ordered for our competitors who are salivating at the opportunity and are more capable of handling UPS volume than in 97'. And a volume decrease equals layoffs and Zero progression for those expecting to move into full time positions.Then you turn to them and ask them to vote for their own damnation.

Diesel,

While I appreciate your many years of service, I continue to have some difficulties with your positions.

For starters, the doom and gloom you continue to preech about losing volume is one that strikes me the most.

How did you get convinced that this is a genuine scare? Indeed, in any dispute, volume is lost, however, BOTH Fedex and DHL are UNPREPARED to handle the enormous volume that UPS will leave stranded during a strike.

In 97, ALL the carriers available had to pick and chose what customers they wanted and they could not handle the volume with any efficiency.

FEDEX has its own internal problems right now. Its ground unit is blasted with class action lawsuits that will eventually kill that unit. In california, FEDEX has annouced that it will abandon its ground operations and adopt another method of handling business.

This means condensing its ops and NOT expanding them. Condensing units will NOT give them the capacity to handle any extra volume should we end up on strike.

AS a veteran, I find it troubling that you would sell out the younger members just to keep what you have. Yes, over the years you have paid your dues, however, if UPS is allowed to establish a practice of preventing new hires from staying with the company for any length of time, your pension will be worth ZERO.

Remember this formula, for every $1 dollar taken out by a retiree, you need $1 dollar in contributions to maintain the fund. When the company delays the hiring of new full time drivers (ie: year round helpers..) this is just the first of preventing a new full timer from making a contribution to the fund.

Its a slow death of the pension, but look at GM and Ford And Chrysler.

They began to outsource to foreign countries and the company didnt think about the consequences of the actions with respect to pensions. As each new employee became a mexican citizen in mexico, the contributions to the pension began to fall as the number of retiree's began to increase.

This deficit has put all three auto makers in financial trouble.

As for the new hires, in any contract neogiation, there are sacrifices and better to sacrifice those "unborn" rather than those already in the system.

If we strike, yes the "unborn" will be delayed, however, they will be better protected once "born" and those who stayed together to protect them would have done what was necessary to continue the life of our Union and workplace.

Its a proven fact that NO ONE wants a strike, and I dont think there are any posters on this board looking for one.

The Union has pinned us against one another, this is a fact. I dont blame the company for this, in fact I have congratulated the company on this board for doing a good job handling the Teamster leadership.

I hold the Teamster leadership solely responsible for this mess. We should not be argueing with each other and the Union leadership should have consulted with us before it decided to shake the hand of the company.

I dont know about you, but "I" never advised the Union that I wanted them to focus on the CS pension and give back 8 months of my current contract.

They continue to tell us that "the members" asked them to protect our pensions even though only one of them was in trouble. The others are fully funded and in no jeopardy.

Now, I dont mean to offend you in any way, I just want to know how you got to the doom and gloom position that you repeatedly post on this board.

Volume loss is a part of business. Why not take a complete 180 and look at it another way??

Why not think about taking volume from our competitors?? Why not insist that the company INCREASE or EXPAND its operations and take extra volume from FEDEX or DHL by increasing the number of trucks on the road? Why not aggressively increase the number of trucks in a heavy volume area (like Los Angeles) and put DHL out of business altogether??

Why not improve our hub operations by reducing the number of redundant managers and supervisors and using that money on preloaders and loaders or even drivers??

There are ways to improve the business Diesel without laying down and waving a white flag.

I only asked that you put yours down.

Peace.

 

[Damok]

...


How did you get convinced that this is a genuine scare? Indeed, in any dispute, volume is lost, however, BOTH Fedex and DHL are UNPREPARED to handle the enormous volume that UPS will leave stranded during a strike.


...

I'm curious how you come to this conclusion. FedEx has been ramping up facility capacity throughout their organization since '97 in hopes of and preparation for another opportunity similar to the one they failed to fully take advantage of back then. I'm not sure how well adapted DHL has become in the domestic market as they are or were primarily overseas.

 

[Damok]

There are ways to improve the business Diesel without laying down and waving a white flag.

I only asked that you put yours down.

Peace.

You had a nice post going right up until this - you really just can't resist can you?

 

[BrownShark]

I'm curious how you come to this conclusion. FedEx has been ramping up facility capacity throughout their organization since '97 in hopes of and preparation for another opportunity similar to the one they failed to fully take advantage of back then. I'm not sure how well adapted DHL has become in the domestic market as they are or were primarily overseas.

Damuck,

Indeed, FEDEX has in the past began a restructuring of its ops to handle increased volume. But as in any business, times change, the market place changes and the direction changes with it.

Today, the cost of operations for FEDEX is skyrocketing with higher fuel prices. Just last week FEDEX announced a HUGE increase in rates for its AIR and Ground operations.

You couple this with the ever growing monetary judgements against them for bad business practices ( California this year $125 million alone) and you will see that the future is not one of extra cash to throw around.

With the ever growing problem with its "contractors", it will be only a matter of time until the judgements against FEDEX will lead to the elimination of the ground units and a "combining" of its AIR and Ground OPS.

With Congress taking away its protections under the "National Railway Act" , FEDEX is doomed to see itself unionized in the next 10 years.

The higher wages and benefits it will foresee will prevent them from expanding their ops beyond what they can afford.

Fred S knows the handwriting is on the wall. Its only a matter of time.

Fedex however, is doing the right thing. Its expanding its local ops to better service its existings customers and reducing the area each hub services. They are in fact adding trucks.

UPS should do the same. Here is Los Angeles, we have outgrown our hubs with the exception of MAIN STREET.

Our surrounding hubs are packed to the gills, trucks are being loaded in the isles or even outside. Areas have grown to a point where capacity is at risk on some days and trailers are NOT unloaded into the morning sort and are held over till the next day.

If UPS was to dominate the market place, it would consider expanding by opening at least two new hubs and reducing the area covered by our current network.

Hours on road would be cut down, pickup capacity would increase, service failures diminished, preload errors reduced by not becoming overwhelmed by piece volume, Next day air efficiency would increase by having the capacity to pickup, transport and unload in a timely manner, unlike today where our hubs service fail 100's hundreds of NDA because of travel time and late pickups due to over dispatching.

These factors create business, UPS on the other hand has chosen to "constrict" its business and give business away.

Sure, they ask us to get more volume, but why most drivers out here ask? "we dont have enough guys to pick the stuff up now, what are we going to do with more volume"

Out here, businessess are held up waiting for us to try and get trucks to complete a pickup, some wait as long as 730 PM for us.

PM Dispatch finds itself sending 3 or 4 trucks at various times to compete 1 pickup account, not to mention having these 3 or 4 trucks break off what they are suppose to be doing (delivering) and delaying them till 9pm.

This isnt a simple business Damuck, its complications are plenty and it takes forward looking thinking to be successful.

Fedex will never grow to a point where it will surpass UPS unless UPS allows it to happen.

UPS knows its in full control.

Peace.

 

[Damok]

Damuck,

Indeed, FEDEX has in the past began a restructuring of its ops to handle increased volume. But as in any business, times change, the market place changes and the direction changes with it.

Interesting statement considering you said previously that they are unprepared to handle the increased volume they would get from a strike.

Today, the cost of operations for FEDEX is skyrocketing with higher fuel prices. Just last week FEDEX announced a HUGE increase in rates for its AIR and Ground operations.

FedEx increased their average shipping rate by 5.5% and offset it with a 2% reduction in fuel surcharge - a 3.5% net rate increase is far from huge.

You couple this with the ever growing monetary judgements against them for bad business practices ( California this year $125 million alone) and you will see that the future is not one of extra cash to throw around.

With the ever growing problem with its "contractors", it will be only a matter of time until the judgements against FEDEX will lead to the elimination of the ground units and a "combining" of its AIR and Ground OPS.

Interesting assumption... one of many that can be drawn from it's current position - you don't seem to leave any room for anything other than what you prohpesied

With Congress taking away its protections under the "National Railway Act" , FEDEX is doomed to see itself unionized in the next 10 years.

The higher wages and benefits it will foresee will prevent them from expanding their ops beyond what they can afford.

Fred S knows the handwriting is on the wall. Its only a matter of time.

More assumptions

Fedex however, is doing the right thing. Its expanding its local ops to better service its existings customers and reducing the area each hub services. They are in fact adding trucks.

UPS should do the same. Here is Los Angeles, we have outgrown our hubs with the exception of MAIN STREET.

Our surrounding hubs are packed to the gills, trucks are being loaded in the isles or even outside. Areas have grown to a point where capacity is at risk on some days and trailers are NOT unloaded into the morning sort and are held over till the next day.

If UPS was to dominate the market place, it would consider expanding by opening at least two new hubs and reducing the area covered by our current network.

Hours on road would be cut down, pickup capacity would increase, service failures diminished, preload errors reduced by not becoming overwhelmed by piece volume, Next day air efficiency would increase by having the capacity to pickup, transport and unload in a timely manner, unlike today where our hubs service fail 100's hundreds of NDA because of travel time and late pickups due to over dispatching.

These factors create business, UPS on the other hand has chosen to "constrict" its business and give business away.

Sure, they ask us to get more volume, but why most drivers out here ask? "we dont have enough guys to pick the stuff up now, what are we going to do with more volume"

Out here, businessess are held up waiting for us to try and get trucks to complete a pickup, some wait as long as 730 PM for us.

PM Dispatch finds itself sending 3 or 4 trucks at various times to compete 1 pickup account, not to mention having these 3 or 4 trucks break off what they are suppose to be doing (delivering) and delaying them till 9pm.

The above paragraphs from your treatise don't really have a bearing on my question but thanks for sharing.

This isnt a simple business Damuck, its complications are plenty and it takes forward looking thinking to be successful.

Fedex will never grow to a point where it will surpass UPS unless UPS allows it to happen.

UPS knows its in full control.

I'd like to see your sources for your claim that DHL is also unprepared. Or was that another assumption?

Peace.

 

[athena]

very , very doubtfull.

Can you define "doubtfull"

 

[diesel96]

Diesel,

While I appreciate your many years of service, I continue to have some difficulties with your positions.

Sorry, I didn't realize I'm suppose to appease you. My bad .

For starters, the doom and gloom you continue to preech about losing volume is one that strikes me the most.

How did you get convinced that this is a genuine scare? Indeed, in any dispute, volume is lost, however, BOTH Fedex and DHL are UNPREPARED to handle the enormous volume that UPS will leave stranded during a strike.

Your continual comparison with your logistical inadequacies out west and area growth issues are not representing the country as a whole. Furthermore, a volume drop may not effect your corridor as much as it would in middle America and areas where economics are not as strong and productive as yours. Your prediction of Fed-Ex and DHL unprepared to handle ALL UPS volume maybe true but a significant percentage chunk can effect us for the life of this contract.(A surplus much higher than 97')Which BTW they are more capable of sustaining and holding our loss volume this time around.

AS a veteran, I find it troubling that you would sell out the younger members just to keep what you have. Yes, over the years you have paid your dues, however, if UPS is allowed to establish a practice of preventing new hires from staying with the company for any length of time, your pension will be worth ZERO.

Who's selling out the younger members and "new hires", your plan of holding out untill they concede to ALL your concessions are addressed spells disaster and dismissal for them.I don't speak for the rest of the country who aren't in such desperation mode as you guys are suffering but I don't feel the issue's being debated here is detrimental enough for a no vote.

Remember this formula, for every $1 dollar taken out by a retiree, you need $1 dollar in contributions to maintain the fund. When the company delays the hiring of new full time drivers (ie: year round helpers..) this is just the first of preventing a new full timer from making a contribution to the fund.

(I'm not in favor of year round helpers) but for every 75 pkgs lost equals 1 UPS job loss. Now if this passes,UPS and Teamsters are responsible for guaranteeing your pension from Jan 1,08'You think they would allow the fund to go bone dry?

Its a slow death of the pension, but look at GM and Ford And Chrysler.

They began to outsource to foreign countries and the company didnt think about the consequences of the actions with respect to pensions. As each new employee became a mexican citizen in mexico, the contributions to the pension began to fall as the number of retiree's began to increase.

How can you compare The big three and the UAW to UPS and the Teamsters. We provide a service not a product.Our outsourcing provides us revenue, in fact the biggest money maker we have,Int'l shipping, Without losing any jobs domestically, in fact it increases jobs.

The Union has pinned us against one another, this is a fact. I dont blame the company for this, in fact I have congratulated the company on this board for doing a good job handling the Teamster leadership.

I hold the Teamster leadership solely responsible for this mess. We should not be argueing with each other and the Union leadership should have consulted with us before it decided to shake the hand of the company.

But it's not a perfect world,and the factions that share your views have been arguing since day one when Hoffa won the slate. Thats when desention orginated.The majority voted him in but the resentment and opposition of our current leadership will persist until the next election.

I dont know about you, but "I" never advised the Union that I wanted them to focus on the CS pension and give back 8 months of my current contract.

They continue to tell us that "the members" asked them to protect our pensions even though only one of them was in trouble. The others are fully funded and in no jeopardy.

The CS problem was and still is a Teamster problem as a whole. Past indecent endeavors created by the Teamsters resulting in a failing pension fund today is a liability we all share because we all are Teamster members. This statement shows your endorsement to sell out CS Pension recipients at the expense to shore up your shortcomings in the LA Corridor.

Now, I dont mean to offend you in any way, I just want to know how you got to the doom and gloom position that you repeatedly post on this board.
Volume loss is a part of business. Why not take a complete 180 and look at it another way??


Being a realist is not doom and gloom, not all of us are suffering bleak outlooks and growing pains as you portray in your area. Why not take a 180 degree turn at look at the overall big picture from the rest of the country. There are many who can't absorb a loss of volume and be adversly effected.

 

[blue efficacy]

A lot of us PTers will vote for a strike from the conversations I've been having! We aren't stupid, we know you FTers are throwing us in front of a moving bus! Having drivers make almost 4 times as much as starting part timers is COMPLETELY unacceptable! We are all teamsters. PTers already only get less than half the hours, that means a Full Timer will make 8X as much as a new hire!

Not cool.

 

[browned out]

Who's selling out the younger members and "new hires", your plan of holding out untill they concede to ALL your concessions are addressed spells disaster and dismissal for them.I don't speak for the rest of the country who aren't in such desperation mode as you guys are suffering but I don't feel the issue's being debated here is detrimental enough for a no vote.



Really, part time coverage drivers will be able to work up to 899 hours at $16.10 and will not become full time.

These part timers could work 899 hours as a part time coverage driver and 1000 hours in their part time inside job and still only receive part time benefits and pension. How can someone work over 1800 hours and still be considered part time?????

IF a driver in progression worked 480 hours, they would be full-time.

The company will work these part time coverage driver instead of progression drivers whenever possible which is anytime they want to.

 

[livinitup]

Well said Blue. What do newer part-timers have to lose? Maybe $200 per week. If I were a newbie I'd go deliver pizzas or flip burgers till the strike was over. Hell if I started workin at In and Out I might not come back. Around here they make $10/hr and get medical.


If the top dogs at UPS were concerned with losing business they should have put up a better offer. Maybe, that was the plan. Let the contract get voted down. Wait for the media to spread the word. Let the stock drop 20% and initiate the buy back. Then offer a better contract that addresses the primary issues. And sit back and watch the stocks skyrocket. That way they get the best outcome no matter what.


At least that's what I'd do. I did see something about a top guy at UPS selling off his shares. Think he's planning on his own buy back?

 

[BrownShark]

Damuck,

isnt this statement below the BIGGEST assumption of all? Hmmm?

I'm curious how you come to this conclusion. FedEx has been ramping up facility capacity throughout their organization since '97 in hopes of and preparation for another opportunity similar to the one they failed to fully take advantage of back then. I'm not sure how well adapted DHL has become in the domestic market as they are or were primarily overseas.

Can you provide us with some facts of how many facilities have been "ramped" up??

Can you provide us with "who" is hoping for another opportunity of a strike at Fedex?

I havent heard Fred S mentioning anything about UPS, in fact, in his latest comments, he's hinted at selling the company to the chinese.

Not sure where your info comes from, so why not provide us some insight.

Peace.

 

[satellitedriver]

Remember this formula, for every $1 dollar taken out by a retiree, you need $1 dollar in contributions to maintain the fund. When the company delays the hiring of new full time drivers (ie: year round helpers..) this is just the first of preventing a new full timer from making a contribution to the fund.


I dont know about you, but "I" never advised the Union that I wanted them to focus on the CS pension and give back 8 months of my current contract.


Peace.

Mr. B.S.,
Not to waste time pointing out all the flaws of logic in your post, I chose these two statements of yours.

The formula is simple. $1.00 put in with compounding interest over the time frame of 25 yrs at a very conservative rate of 9% would grow to $8.62.
The retiree draws from the interest, not the new contribution of a new hire.
Your statement suggests that it is just a piggybank, penny in penny out.
Investment funds do not work that way.
To your second statement, all I can say is that I am glad they did not ask for your advice.
POX

 

[Boku41]

Diesel,

While I appreciate your many years of service, I continue to have some difficulties with your positions.

For starters, the doom and gloom you continue to preech about losing volume is one that strikes me the most.

How did you get convinced that this is a genuine scare? Indeed, in any dispute, volume is lost, however, BOTH Fedex and DHL are UNPREPARED to handle the enormous volume that UPS will leave stranded during a strike.

In 97, ALL the carriers available had to pick and chose what customers they wanted and they could not handle the volume with any efficiency.

In '97, Fedex had no ground service. That was before they bought RPS. I don't know how you could think they wouldn't be able to better take advantage of the boneheaded decisions of our Teamster members if we went on strike. In '97, the German Post Office hadn't begun spending billions of dollars to expand DHL. I have a friend in DHL's exporting department. 3 years ago or so they planned to lose a huge amount of money by undercutting UPS's prices and growing their business. How can you say they wouldn't be prepared to take on more of our business?

Diesel,
AS a veteran, I find it troubling that you would sell out the younger members just to keep what you have.

The younger drivers and PTers are the ones who get hurt the worst in the strike. If we lose 5-15% or more of our business, the bottom 5-15% of the drivers don't work, not those like me in the top 10%. The PTers will have to wait years for us to regain that lost business so they can go full-time.

Diesel,
Remember this formula, for every $1 dollar taken out by a retiree, you need $1 dollar in contributions to maintain the fund. When the company delays the hiring of new full time drivers (ie: year round helpers..) this is just the first of preventing a new full timer from making a contribution to the fund.

Sounds like you have the pension and Social Security confused. You probably were against Pres. Bush trying to fix SS, also. The pension better not be run on the same grounds as the current SS system, or we better not count on any pension being there in a few years.

Diesel,

As for the new hires, in any contract neogiation, there are sacrifices and better to sacrifice those "unborn" rather than those already in the system.

I guess you feel it better to send those unborn to the non-union jobs at DHL and FEDEX. What a moronic statement.

Diesel,
If we strike, yes the "unborn" will be delayed, however, they will be better protected once "born" and those who stayed together to protect them would have done what was necessary to continue the life of our Union and workplace.

Its a proven fact that NO ONE wants a strike, and I dont think there are any posters on this board looking for one.

Reading these posts, how can you say no one wants a strike?

Diesel,
The Union has pinned us against one another, this is a fact. I dont blame the company for this, in fact I have congratulated the company on this board for doing a good job handling the Teamster leadership.

I hold the Teamster leadership solely responsible for this mess. We should not be argueing with each other and the Union leadership should have consulted with us before it decided to shake the hand of the company.

The union didn't consult the members before the '97 stike either. We gave up our right to listen to UPS's offer weeks before the stike deadline. When was the last time the union did what was best for the drivers and not what was best for the union?

Diesel,
I dont know about you, but "I" never advised the Union that I wanted them to focus on the CS pension and give back 8 months of my current contract.

They continue to tell us that "the members" asked them to protect our pensions even though only one of them was in trouble. The others are fully funded and in no jeopardy.

Now, I dont mean to offend you in any way, I just want to know how you got to the doom and gloom position that you repeatedly post on this board.

Volume loss is a part of business. Why not take a complete 180 and look at it another way??

Why not think about taking volume from our competitors?? Why not insist that the company INCREASE or EXPAND its operations and take extra volume from FEDEX or DHL by increasing the number of trucks on the road? Why not aggressively increase the number of trucks in a heavy volume area (like Los Angeles) and put DHL out of business altogether??

Why not force companies to ship with us while you're at it? You don't fill trucks with volume just by adding trucks. I know of no company that thinks they should give us more business just because we bought some more trucks.

Shippers are not going to wait 9 months to see if our contract will get worked out. They got burned in '97 by trusting us to get it resolved. There is no way they will not divert a lot of volume away from us months before the deadline to protect their own necks.

 

[tieguy]

A lot of us PTers will vote for a strike from the conversations I've been having! We aren't stupid, we know you FTers are throwing us in front of a moving bus! Having drivers make almost 4 times as much as starting part timers is COMPLETELY unacceptable! We are all teamsters. PTers already only get less than half the hours, that means a Full Timer will make 8X as much as a new hire!

Not cool.

If only true then you part timers would become the majority and they would be throwing 10 an hour pay raises at you. fact is very few of your majority will show up for the initial meetings and very few of your majority will vote. Don't blame the union nor the company blame your majority that never shows up when its time to count.

 

[BrownShark]

If only true then you part timers would become the majority and they would be throwing 10 an hour pay raises at you. fact is very few of your majority will show up for the initial meetings and very few of your majority will vote. Don't blame the union nor the company blame your majority that never shows up when its time to count.

Finally,

something you and I can agree upon. Now I know you dont have any access to actual numbers as I have, you are correct.

The part timers do have the control if they just organized themselves to do so.

As I have posted before, less than 5% will return a ballot nationwide (statistically) and the majority of ballots will be returned by Feeder Drivers.

Package Drivers are in the middle but dont vote as dedicated as the feeder drivers.

In local elections, the numbers are worse. Take my area. There are over 10.5 K UPS Teamsters in our local, yet only 1.75 % of them actually cast a ballot.

Its our sanitation sector that controls our elections as they have an agressive minority that insures that they all vote.

In total, and my numbers are not current as of this month, we have about 12500K members in total, yet, less than 4500 votes will end up being counted.

Our current slate won with 2700 something votes. Shameful.

Members become complacent with contracts and elections, they let someone else do the voting, then bitch about it when it affects them negatively later down the road.

Glad we found some common ground.

Peace.