Independent Contractor

[Sky]

Hi,

I browsed, but I have not found a recent thread on this subject.

• What is the typical starting pay for independent contractors?
• Are there any benefits at all?

The job description states: "You must own or have the ability to lease a minimum of 2 suitable vehicles from a third party vendor; the ability to hire, train and manage an employee driver."

Do they really expect people to own TWO vehicles? What sort of vehicle is considered "suitable?"

Thank you for the help!

[MrFedEx]

First off...DON"T DO IT!! FedEx is famous for jacking it's "contractors" around. Please do yourself a big favor and research what's been happening at FedEx Ground, including the current legal battles over contractors actually being employees.. They specify what type of vehicle is acceptable, and they will try to rope you into a deal where you buy a new truck that meets their specs. Please also remember that diesel is around $5.00 agallon right now, and you'll be paying for it (along with everything else).

[brady]

Are you talking about FEDEX?

Did it for a year at FEDEX Home delivery. WORST job I ever had! Left at 5am to go to terminal worked till 7pm. Again the same shaft (yes SHAFT) the next day. They do not give a crap how many hours you go over, nor do they care how many pkgs/stops you have. The last straw for me 250 stops with over 375 pkgs, non peak. I actually had to have a manager meet me and give me the 150 pkgs I could not get on the truck at 7am. This is an example of a US sweat shop. AVOID this it's the most lopsided job in the world, all for FEDEX none for you.

[MrFedEx]

Does UPS even have independent contractors? I made the assumption he is talking about FedEx Ground.

[scratch]

No independent contractors in the Parcel Division. During Peak Season, the company can use them to pull Feeder loads when we are short of drivers.

[Sky]

Thanks for the advice. I will gladly stay away from this operation!

As an actual independent contractor with Fed Ex Ground, I will admit that it isn't for everyone. Personally, I love it. Been doing it for 13 years and it has been very profitable for me. It's a little sad to see people like Mr Fed Ex telling people "DON'T DO IT". 13 years ago I was a cab driver making barely 200 dollars a week. To suggest that Fed Ex is the worst possible job is simply an unfair subjective viewpoint. The lawsuits that Mr Fed Ex refers to are actually making life even better for contractors. $5.00 per gallon diesel fuel? Perhaps Mr Fed Ex doesn't know what he is talking about. Or maybe he doesn't want to discuss the complicated (for a second grader) math that goes into the fuel supplement keeping fuel prices at a paltry $1.25 per gallon. Fear mongering is so silly.

[MrFedEx]

I guess you are anonymous for a good reason. Despite your positive experience, FedEx is famous for mistreating it's Ground drivers and passing-off every possible cost to increase the corporation's profits (not the drivers). If you're making a decent profit, it's probably because you pay your drivers about $10.00 per hour. FedEx recently sweetened the deal for it's contractors because it had to, not due to any concern for the welfare of it's contractors and/or drivers. They are trying every evasive maneuver in their legal arsenal, and waited until the last possible moment to make any compensatory changes so they could milk a bit more profit from their "employees". If FedEx Ground is such a great deal, why are they being sued in so many states, and LOSING each and every case brought against them? I'm sorry, but FedEx Ground remains a very bad deal for the vast majority of it's contractors and drivers. They are not an ethical employer.

Ethics? Does UPS pay drivers $26/hr. because they are ethical and care about their people? I've been around this site a little to much to think that's a prevailing viewpoint. About those lawsuits, they seem to have lost alot of steam after the California decision. Anyone signing on to those lawsuits should pay close attention to that decision and Fed Ex's remedy for it. Also, why do the lawyers want these suits to have class action status? Business law 101 will tell any attentive student that it is because class action suits are a cash cow for whom? The plaintiffs? No. The defendants? Certainly not. That's right, the lawyers. So although "Fed Ex Watch" claims to have the best interest of contractors/drivers in mind, who really benefits? Oh, i didn't know i was anonymous. I'm not very computer savvy. I thought bbsam was who I am...or was...lol fun with pronouns. (this is what happens to english majors who never quite finish college.)

[MrFedEx]

It is well known that FedEx Watch is associated with a group of attorneys, so their position is no surprise to anyone but you. The class action suits have merit, otherwise they would not have progressed in each and every state where they have been heard in court. As far as the movement to classify contractors as employees losing ground, why does FedEx continue to lose in court?
I noticed you didn't answer my question regarding what you pay your drivers. You can pull any number you'd like out of your ass, but I doubt it's very much over the $10.00 per hour I estimated. How about their benefits? Oh yeah, they don't have any, nor do you.
My educational resume would make yours look very pale in comparison, so you can keep trying to insult me. I'll just beat you down like the mental flea you are. Go on thinking you've got a great deal going with FedEx Ground and watch FedEx Corporation use you like a cheap whore until there's nothing left of you. Then they'll cut you loose. Good luck!!

lol first fear mongering noy name calling. why so bitter, Mr Fed Ex. if you weren't a senior moderator, you'd probably be moderated. actually i was being self deprecating with the lack of degree. benefits? nope don't have them. I buy health insurance and contribute to a couple roth iras and mutual funds. pay for my drivers runs 13 to 15 per hour. not ups by any stretch, but not dhl either. i do make very good money, far better than any ups driver (i was one of those for a while also). really here in the midwest 13 to 15 is actually fairly good money, at least until ups hires all my drivers away from me. really though mr fred ex, i'm sorry you had such bad experience with fed ex, but in the interest of fairness, most fed ex contractors aren't racing to ups to fill out applications or even to fed ex express for that matter. that is my only point here. i mentioned before that fed ex contracting is not for everyone, merely in contrast that to your assertion that it is not for anyone. there, now beat me down again mr smart guy academic with less earning power than a english major dropout. --ee cummings.

[MrFedEx]

How do you know what position I hold at FedEx? I could be a lot higher in the FedEx pecking order than you think. It's presumptious to say you out-earn either myself or anyone from UPS. I'm glad you're happy with FedEx, but you are absolutely at odds with most Ground employees and/or contractors I know. On the Express side where I work, most people are furious with the way they're being treated. That includes management.

Once again, you've dodged my request to determine what you pay your drivers per hour. Like I said before, it's probably not much, because the Ground contractors I know say they cannot afford to fairly compensate their drivers. $10-$12 per hour (again,with no benefits) is the going rate around here. That qualifies as exploitation in my book. Another contractor tactic is to pay a flat rate salary per week. The poor bastard driver works 65 or 70 hours a week for a flat $650 or $700 per week. Again, pure exploitation. Maybe that's why most of the Ground drivers I see look like derelicts, with scraggly beards, multiple tatoos, untucked shirts, and biker boots that go perfectly with their baggy, ill-fitting shorts. I guess you get what you pay for. Drivers like these really impress the customer, don't they?

You sound just like the kind of contractor Fred wants. You're willing to work the hell out of people, pay them a pittance, and then pocket some "big money" by delaying vehicle maintenance and cutting corners wherever you can in order to turn a minimal profit. I've been around FedEx long enough to know that Ground is a skinflint, second-rate operation full of cretins (look it up) like you who will screw their people into the ground (no pun intended) for a dime.

[MrFedEx]

By the way, I am not a moderator on this site. That is an oversight on the part of the site administrator. UPS people moderate this forum, not me. I've been disciplined plenty of times for what I have to say. And $13 to $15 per hour is not a definitive answer. Is that a range based on experience, or does it vary based on the route? And sorry, that's not good money anywhere in my book. I also doubt that you're being truthful because I live in an expensive region of the country. If $10-$12 per hour flies here, $13-$15 per hour in the Mid-West sounds like BS.

apparently you and i will continue to disagree about the validity of the contractor model at fed ex. that's fine, this is america. that being said, howt sever, why do you stay with fed ex if they are so horrible? do you rail against the machine with your mouth but remain a cog with your labors? one thing i will take issue with in your presumptions is your assertion that i neglect maintenance in search of profit. the mechanic we use here and i work on the arrangement that if something is broken he fixes it. he needn't ask me or a company like "Fleetnet" first. and believe me i have had many cases of sticker shock when i've gotten the bill in the mail, but that's better than having a brake caliper blow or any number of other potential life threatening malfunctions.

i have a 2004 ford freestar registered in the ground system as a delivery vehicle. it runs on regular unleaded fuel and gets twice the mileage as a p-1000. ground determines fuel supplement based on diesel prices. if i drive the freestar out in the wilderness areas as a supplemental vehicle for say 200 miles with a supplement based on $5.00 per gallon with unleaded being closer to $4.00 per gallon.... Yes I am the kind of contractor fred wants, creative.

[MrFedEx]

We can certainly agree to disagree, and I'm glad you appear to be one of the few ethical contractors out there. I stay with FedEx because I have many years invested in the company and would probably have difficulty starting a new career in my late 40's. Maybe you're familiar with the term "loyal opposition", maybe not. I am a "loyal opposer". While I have little respect for upper FedEx management, I still do an outstanding job for them. FedEx Express usd to be a great place to work, until the P-S-P philosophy was replaced with P-P-P (Profit-Profit-Profit). Now it's a lousy place to work, unless you're a pilot.Ironically, Smith had it right the first time around, when he put the employee first, and motivated employees made customers realize that there was a better alternative to the status quo. Now, people are leaving left and right, and the average Express driver isn't very motivated to provide the outstanding customer service that earned FedEx the stellar reputation it no longer deserves.
Smith is famous now for running a stripped-down hollow shell of what an excellent Express division used to be. He ran Ground the same way until the employee vs contractor issue hit the fan recently. Any gains you've received as a contractor come from pressure from the courts, not any desire on the part of Smith to be equitable. They are scrambling to make sure that you appear to be an independent businessman (which you are now), and not the previous contractor model, which saw a lot of individual contractors working about 70 hours per week for about $30-$35,000 per year, with no benefits but all of the responsibilities of a bona fide employee. In other words, they sweetened the deal because they had to.
Sorry to be so antagonistic with you, but I've seen so many Ground guys get screwed over the years that it really makes me angry.

all i have really been trying to say here is that for me, fed ex ground provided an opportunity that few other companies could. i do not claim fed ex any kind of ethical pinnacle of the business world. i am not naive enough to believe that ups dhl express or any other business in the united states aims for anything but the wall street bottom line. nor am i even close to being a "company man". merely one that has found the opportunity profitable. what one does with the opportunity is not only up to the company, but to the individual as well. for instance, the fed ex ground time off program was based in large part on the experience in our terminal with myself as the swing driver covering vacations. it was a need, i and the other contractors in the building filled the need, and the company copied it. after retiring from swing driving, picking up new territory from other contractors was easy because i already knew the area. i have also found that--and i speak only for myself--standing up to management when they were wrong has never brought me negative consequences. the senior manager in my building will however admit that such abuses while not the norm did happen far too often. i am sorry to hear that you feel trapped. i turn 40 this week and couldn't be happier with my termination at ups 15 years ago. a well warranted termination. drug addiction doesn't ups' corporate image of itself.

[nprfl5]

Originally Posted by bbsam

i have a 2004 ford freestar registered in the ground system as a delivery vehicle. it runs on regular unleaded fuel and gets twice the mileage as a p-1000. ground determines fuel supplement based on diesel prices. if i drive the freestar out in the wilderness areas as a supplemental vehicle for say 200 miles with a supplement based on $5.00 per gallon with unleaded being closer to $4.00 per gallon.... Yes I am the kind of contractor fred wants, creative.

fed-ex ground does not pay a fuel supplement on supplemental vehicles

Fedex most certainly does pay a fuel supplement on supplemental vehicles. They began doing so about 5 years ago. I know because i quit running a supplemental for a while until the next contract came out and that was one of the changes they made. Think about it. How could anyone aford a supplemental if they didn't have the fuel supplement? It could never be profitable or even break even without it. And believe me, Fedex loves to utilize supplementals to a fault.

[MrFedEx]

Why don't you join the FedEx Cheerleading Squad too? You'd be great at it. The more brainless and unquestioning you are, the harder you can cheer, and the better Fred likes it. Keep on being a good sheep. You'll really like it when the Teamsters move-in and you become an employee like the rest of us. Wait and see how fairly Smith negotiates. You'll eventually figure it out for yourself.

[sano]

Wow mrfedex, I hope you are a caricature on this site. Hopefully you post with a smile on your face as a joke. I suspect you are actually a UPS employee that used to work at FedEx and is just having fun.

bbsam must not be paying taxes to be claiming he is making a good living at fedex ground.

[edd_tv]

[quote=bbsam;346742]Ethics? Does UPS pay drivers $26/hr. because they are ethical and care about their people?


no they pay us $28/hr


because we DO care about our customers, TRY and go out of our way everyday for them, even when management puts it to us.

[MrFedEx]

Originally Posted by sano

Wow mrfedex, I hope you are a caricature on this site. Hopefully you post with a smile on your face as a joke. I suspect you are actually a UPS employee that used to work at FedEx and is just having fun.

Nope, I'm a real FedEx employee who is tired of being jacked-around by a ruthless and greedy upper management team. Read the recent posts by the driver from FedEx Freight and see if I'm really on the lunatic fringe with what I have to say about the organization. Fred Smith deserves a unionized workforce...I'm trying to give him one. That's it.