Which is more harmful to the FedEx brand: Kinkos (Office) or Ground?

[Washu234]

I hate to flood the forums with new topics but I gotta say this one really bugs me.

Of the entire FedEx network there are two brands that stick out for all the wrong reasons, Kinkos (now FedEx Office) and Ground.

On one hand we have the overvalued rushed buy out of a company that has never quite fit and cost the company millions in write-offs.

On the other hand we have the poor integration of a company that has cost the FedEx brand millions in lawsuits and caused much confusion within the company and among its customers.

So - which was a bigger mistake? I know you have stories for both.

[MrFedEx]

Originally Posted by Washu234

I hate to flood the forums with new topics but I gotta say this one really bugs me.

Of the entire FedEx network there are two brands that stick out for all the wrong reasons, Kinkos (now FedEx Office) and Ground.

On one hand we have the overvalued rushed buy out of a company that has never quite fit and cost the company millions in write-offs.

On the other hand we have the poor integration of a company that has cost the FedEx brand millions in lawsuits and caused much confusion within the company and among its customers.

So - which was a bigger mistake? I know you have stories for both.

Kinko's. They've re-branded it twice now (FedEx Kinko's and now Office) and have a problem with unqualified and/or underqualified employees. Whenever I pick one up, it's rare that they've managed to get their end of the paperwork and scans correct. If FedEx would actually pay them decent money that would clear-up a lot of the performance issues.

[bbsam]

Originally Posted by Washu234

I hate to flood the forums with new topics but I gotta say this one really bugs me.

Of the entire FedEx network there are two brands that stick out for all the wrong reasons, Kinkos (now FedEx Office) and Ground.

On one hand we have the overvalued rushed buy out of a company that has never quite fit and cost the company millions in write-offs.

On the other hand we have the poor integration of a company that has cost the FedEx brand millions in lawsuits and caused much confusion within the company and among its customers.

So - which was a bigger mistake? I know you have stories for both.

Ground a mistake? The segment of the company that continues to make money even after the litigation fees? The only way that that Ground can be considered a mistake is from the point of view of couriers afraid that their own employee model is threatened by the contractor model at Ground. It is a fear that I think is well justified, but hardly makes the acquisition of Ground a mistake.

[Testicular Fortitude]

Originally Posted by bbsam

Ground a mistake? The segment of the company that continues to make money even after the litigation fees? The only way that that Ground can be considered a mistake is from the point of view of couriers afraid that their own employee model is threatened by the contractor model at Ground. It is a fear that I think is well justified, but hardly makes the acquisition of Ground a mistake.

They are both big mistakes.The largest litigation has not yet been settled by the court.FDX Ground and Home employees versus Fedex.If FEDEX corporation loses it will cost them over one billion dollars.This could be the end of the Ground and Home divisions.

[bbsam]

Originally Posted by Testicular Fortitude

They are both big mistakes.The largest litigation has not yet been settled by the court.FDX Ground and Home employees versus Fedex.If FEDEX corporation loses it will cost them over one billion dollars.This could be the end of the Ground and Home divisions.

You prove my point. Not until the litigation is settled AND Fedex loses AND the court requires Fedex to abandon the IC model (which no court has yet required) can it be considered a mistake. If on the other hand the court affirms the IC model, look for Express to adopt it in the years to come. I assure you, Fedex Corporation does not see IC's as a mistake in the least.

[MrFedEx]

Originally Posted by bbsam

You prove my point. Not until the litigation is settled AND Fedex loses AND the court requires Fedex to abandon the IC model (which no court has yet required) can it be considered a mistake. If on the other hand the court affirms the IC model, look for Express to adopt it in the years to come. I assure you, Fedex Corporation does not see IC's as a mistake in the least.

If FedEx loses, we'll see your Ground fleet for sale at the local car lot...just like DHL when the feces hit the fan over there. Even if FedEx was forced to abandon the IC model tomorrow, it has been a tremendously profitable venture, so I agree with you that it would never be considered a mistake. And if Fred has to cut you loose, he will...without batting an eye. OK with that?

The IC model would be a big problem at Express because of the higher standards for service and employees. Sorry, but the $13 per hour parolees you've got working for most Ground contractors wouldn't cut it over at Express. In order to attract competent workers Fred would have to pay at least what he does now (not much) and also offer a benefit package, negating much of the IC "advantage" right off the bat. Even in a crappy economy like we have right now, few people are willing to bust their hump the way Express expects you to for Ground wages.

One of these days, perhaps you should visit the Express operation at your local ramp, then go to a DGO station afterwards and observe what goes on. You might learn a great deal.

[capta320]

Originally Posted by bbsam

Ground a mistake? The segment of the company that continues to make money even after the litigation fees? The only way that that Ground can be considered a mistake is from the point of view of couriers afraid that their own employee model is threatened by the contractor model at Ground. It is a fear that I think is well justified, but hardly makes the acquisition of Ground a mistake.

Yup my future I see going down the road at FedEx Express. After 25 years I am being outsourced to a " Contractor ". See more and more Ground and Home Delivery Routes and Express Package volume going into the "Ground" Building more and more Ground Hubs, Home Delivery will begin pickups and working 6 days a week....Thanks Fred.. We built the Company and now tossed aside. Hope all the top Execs enjoyed their $ 8 mil in other compensation last year ( Look at Latest Annual Report)
Many Senior Drivers bailing out and taking early retirement once hit age 55. We should have joined Teamsters 15 years ago. I am afraid its too late for Express. I will be moving on to a company that respects its employees. Cant afford to work only 35 hours a week...Express Div will become a part-time job for college kids. And FedEx image in regard to Ground has been tarnished. Due to bad customer service by Ground. Hope UPS kicks Freds Butt and send him packing to Memphis. Hey maybe Greyhound is hiring.

[The Mayor]

I would definately have to say Fed Ex Kinko's / Office division. We spent 2.3 billion to purchase it, then another $830+ million to buy it's name out to change over to Fed Ex office. In return? All we got was a $800 million dollar write off because of the diluted value of the company from its purchase price. So, in the end when you finally put it all together, we are still looking at the approximately original $2.3 billion that we spent with no return. Call me crazy, but getting no return on an invest to me is a very unwise business decision.

[bbsam]

Originally Posted by MrFedEx

If FedEx loses, we'll see your Ground fleet for sale at the local car lot...just like DHL when the feces hit the fan over there. Even if FedEx was forced to abandon the IC model tomorrow, it has been a tremendously profitable venture, so I agree with you that it would never be considered a mistake. And if Fred has to cut you loose, he will...without batting an eye. OK with that?

The IC model would be a big problem at Express because of the higher standards for service and employees. Sorry, but the $13 per hour parolees you've got working for most Ground contractors wouldn't cut it over at Express. In order to attract competent workers Fred would have to pay at least what he does now (not much) and also offer a benefit package, negating much of the IC "advantage" right off the bat. Even in a crappy economy like we have right now, few people are willing to bust their hump the way Express expects you to for Ground wages.

One of these days, perhaps you should visit the Express operation at your local ramp, then go to a DGO station afterwards and observe what goes on. You might learn a great deal.

With the added revenue from express deliveries I'd easily pay $18/hour. Actually you would be surprised at the competence I can get at $13/hour. Not every time, but more often than not and more and more as the job market tanks. Sometimes it takes creative route structuring, but that's ok.

[MrFedEx]

Originally Posted by bbsam

With the added revenue from express deliveries I'd easily pay $18/hour. Actually you would be surprised at the competence I can get at $13/hour. Not every time, but more often than not and more and more as the job market tanks. Sometimes it takes creative route structuring, but that's ok.

At $18 per hour you might have some takers. IMO the average Express employee today is only about half as competent as the old-school FedExer's. A really good courier is worth paying $30 per hour, something Fred has never managed to figure out. As more and more of them quit or bail at 55, he'll be stuck with the rest. At that point, providing current service levels would be impossible without adding a bunch of routes, which defeats the original penny-pinching premise.

[FedEx courier]

Originally Posted by FedEX 4 Life

You are telling me that you deserve the same pay as a UPS driver?Do you do the same amount of work as a UPS driver.Please answer honestly.

All Couriers deserve fair market pay. Can't speak for Mr.Fedex but all my coworkers take their jobs very seriously and work hard everyday. It's really ridiculous that you get on here and constantly belittle the jobs that we do.

[MrFedEx]

Originally Posted by FedEX 4 Life

How am i belittiling?I am asking a simple question.Do fedex express drivers work as hard as UPS drivers?Yes or No?

You would be the perfect Kinko's employee...you've got all the qualifications. What I said was "an excellent courier is worth $30 per hour" and I stand by that. An outstanding FedEx employee is just as good as his/her UPS equivalent and works just as hard. Most don't...I'm talking about that "7" employee who knows exactly what they are doing and always does an excellent job. There are certainly a lot of swing drivers who are worth that much, and plenty of others. I'm guessing that you are overpaid relative to your contribution.

[FedEx courier]

Originally Posted by FedEX 4 Life

How am i belittiling?I am asking a simple question.Do fedex express drivers work as hard as UPS drivers?Yes or No?

Don't know what kind of Candyland station your claiming to work in but my answer is yes.

[1989]

Originally Posted by FedEX 4 Life

Cant even answer a simple yes or no question.Just as I thought.You are an embarrassment

Look, FDX boy is back!

[MrFedEx]

Originally Posted by FedEX 4 Life

How am i belittiling?I am asking a simple question.Do fedex express drivers work as hard as UPS drivers?Yes or No?

A classic distraction tactic...throw out the old "who works harder" question in the hope that the discussion gets sidetracked into an us vs. them argument. I'll answer when you answer the question I've posed to you so many times now. Why do you post on other sites with the same username and post on this site with different usernames yet use a differing grammatical style each time? Only the pro-FedEx jargon and erratic reasoning stay the same. Question 2; How does a 17 year FedEx "employee" know so little about how his company operates and make so many errors in statements that even the newest employee could answer with ease?

[MrFedEx]

Originally Posted by FedEX 4 Life

Yes or No? Its a simple question. I knew you wouldnt be able to answer.Pathetic.You are a joke.

I will answer the question, and my answer is as follows. It depends on the employee, not the company. There are slugs that work for both companies and there are stars. In general, UPS drivers work harder and deserve higher pay...in general. In no way does that translate to an approximate 35% difference in wages across the board. When you figure pensions (or lack thereof) into the equation, the disparity is even greater.

Now answer my question.

[MrFedEx]

Originally Posted by FedEX 4 Life

I will answer your question.Fedex pays me to post on multiple sites using different methods of diverse communication both in manor and disposition.

They are certainly getting their money's worth, arent they?

[DOWNTRODDEN IN TEXAS]

Originally Posted by MrFedEx

You would be the perfect Kinko's employee...you've got all the qualifications. What I said was "an excellent courier is worth $30 per hour" and I stand by that. An outstanding FedEx employee is just as good as his/her UPS equivalent and works just as hard. Most don't...I'm talking about that "7" employee who knows exactly what they are doing and always does an excellent job. There are certainly a lot of swing drivers who are worth that much, and plenty of others. I'm guessing that you are overpaid relative to your contribution.

I wouldn't say that I'm "excellent" per se...maybe WICKED FREAKIN' AWESOME, but not "excellent...lol

And yes, I do work just as hard as my brown brethren, but I do a bulk route (when I get to go out...)so I think I deserve the pay that is due to me.

[DOWNTRODDEN IN TEXAS]

Originally Posted by FedEX 4 Life

I will answer your question.Fedex pays me to post on multiple sites using different methods of diverse communication both in manor and disposition.

Holy cow Batman , the truth finally comes out, and no, they're not getting their money's worth...lol

[Washu234]

Ha. Awesome. Now I'm the only person who's ok with FedEx. How do I get a paycheck for being positive?

I gotta say MrFedEx you called that one.

[Sleeve_meet_Heart]

out of curiousity - how many stops and packages does the AVERAGE full-time FedEx route driver deliver per day? Be honest, here.

[DOWNTRODDEN IN TEXAS]

Originally Posted by Sleeve_meet_Heart

out of curiousity - how many stops and packages does the AVERAGE full-time FedEx route driver deliver per day? Be honest, here.

Ok, at my station in a large market, the average is about 24-30 P1's and about 90-100 P2's.

[DOWNTRODDEN IN TEXAS]

Originally Posted by FedEX 4 Life

Depends on station.My station id say average is 60-90 stops for a full timer.Part timer 30's.
Im assuming its the same at UPS since everyone says its the same job just different trucks.
Pickup couriers average 30 stops per day in my station.Ive heard stories of upstate couriers doing like 10-15 stops a day but driving over 100 miles.

We have one route that averages 60 stops total with about 350 miles driving PER DAY. The first stop is over an hour and 40 minutes away from the station. Must be nice to average 60-90 total stops...

[olcc]

Originally Posted by FedEX 4 Life

Depends on station.My station id say average is 60-90 stops for a full timer.Part timer 30's.
Im assuming its the same at UPS since everyone says its the same job just different trucks.
Pickup couriers average 30 stops per day in my station.Ive heard stories of upstate couriers doing like 10-15 stops a day but driving over 100 miles.

I have worked at four different stations as a swing driver and in my real, non-imaginary experience, a typical day is 150+ pieces, about 30% of which are docs. The general expectation for all-day routes is at least 100 stops per day, although with the new SPH goals, at least 110. This is hitting your first stop (theoretically) between 845 and 900 and returning to the building before 1800. And with a mandatory one hour (at least) lunch.

[UpstateNYUPSer]

Originally Posted by FedEX 4 Life

Ive heard stories of upstate couriers doing like 10-15 stops a day but driving over 100 miles.

This upstate courier averages 120-140 stops, 350-450 pkgs, 28 P/U stops with 200-300 P/U pkgs, 50-55 miles and am usually punched out and gone by 1830.