Whats going to happen when................ - Brown Cafe

Harley Rider · 11-16-2007, 08:42 PM

the only people left in management have never been in operations or driven a pkg car?

On car supervisor and I were talking the other night after work. He started his UPS career about a year before me and we drove together for a few years before he took the plunge into management. We both came to the agreement that we will be glad that we have retired when this happens.

Don't know how it is in your part of the country but here the only people going into management are right out of college or part time sups off the street. It seems that UPS doesn't want anyone in management anymore that has any actual experience of how the job is done unless you have a four year degree. I haven't seen a driver go into management in years ........ by choice.

I think it will be a sad day when all the experience leaves the company. PAS/EDD will only take the company so far. At least I can talk to a sup now about my problems on the road and he has an inkling of what I am talking about. I'm glad I will be gone in 6 years.

Griff · 11-16-2007, 08:57 PM

Frontline management are the dinosaurs of UPS, just waiting to go extinct. I think they will restructure the management setup in the near future. The days of having a center manager and oncar sups are numbered. The writing is already on the wall, you just have to look around.

Harley Rider · 11-16-2007, 09:13 PM

Yep......... have to agree with you there Griff. Already seeing it happen. There have been CM's go for one reason or another. They haven't been replaced. The center is just added onto another CM's load.

DS · 11-16-2007, 09:23 PM

Harley,looking ahead,the way I see it the job cant change that much except for the technology.The fact is,has,and will always be that you cant get blood out of a stone.As drivers we still have to do the actual delivering,so in a way it doesn't really matter how many stops they cram in your car,nothing changes.Its still thier problem in the end,and each new batch of off the street pt sups will come and go like bad sitcoms.
I have about 10 more years to go,I hope you are wrong.

Hangingon · 11-16-2007, 11:35 PM

Some things change.. We had some drivers fail to make 9.5 on Tuesday. They informed the center they needed help but were told they were dispatched in TSP range so had to make it in by cut off. Guess how many article 7 (pending) suspensions and terminations were handed out the next morning? 1 per driver...

BLACKBOX · 11-17-2007, 12:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hangingon

Some things change.. We had some drivers fail to make 9.5 on Tuesday. They informed the center they needed help but were told they were dispatched in TSP range so had to make it in by cut off. Guess how many article 7 (pending) suspensions and terminations were handed out the next morning? 1 per driver...

Wow.....If people knew the goings on of todays pkg driver! Its no wonder by the end of the day many drivers believe the company spends more time trying to discipline us drivers rather than trying to help us succeed.

SimpleUPSer · 11-17-2007, 12:12 AM

In our district there has actually been an initiative to get some of these newer management folks driving, and it has worked out fairly well. Granted, these types of things are often cyclic, but at least we are injecting some degree of driving experience into management.

As far as the technology, it seems that UPS is taking the long-term acquired skill from management employees. This plays well into the management reduction initiatives and the longevity issues we will have with the newer management folks. As long as the educated new supervisor or manager can run a query and read a report, issues will be highlighted and more easily correctable.

Unsure where this trend will lead or for how long it will continue, but more than likely it is here to stay...

Harley Rider · 11-17-2007, 05:03 AM

One thing that really aggravates me with UPS today is the US vs Them attitude of management nowadays. That wasn't the case years ago. We all worked together to get the job done. This company is totally different on their views towards their employees today.

Personally I think alot of management are as unhappy as hourly are. They are having "numbers" shoved down their throats. The chance to actually make any decisions have been taken away from them. The micro management routine has totally gotten out of control.

I was so close to go into management about 15 years ago. All I had left was talking to the District Manager. I had already been told where I was being transferred to. No doubt in my mind I would have quit or been fired by now. I have the rep for speaking my mind and to letting the cards fall as they may. I'm pretty sure that upper management wouldn't have cared for that too much. If you are not a "Yes Man" these days you don't seem to last too long.

magoo57 · 11-17-2007, 06:30 AM

The scariest part is not thatt these supes do not have driver experience-though that would be enormously helpful. when a 21 years old is made a supervisor, this may be his first time ever being in charge of other human beings in a workforce? You can be a credible manager while never being a driver. You can't when you have never been in charge of other persons before. A true mentoring program for supes for their entire first year as supes is crucial.

Cementups · 11-17-2007, 12:46 PM

You don't need to have driven a package car to look at numbers on paper.

toonertoo · 11-18-2007, 10:23 AM

One thing that impressed me at UPS when I started, was that someone could show me what I had to do, as they had done it before.

Now one thing that is unimpressive is that no one seems to understand the job. Could it be they have forgotten, or just never knew?

I do understand that we have to make the company $$ which is why we get paid as we do, but, No one seems to understand the simple fact, that we are doing nothing different, except we have one of those (and im sure more than one) people in high tier mgmt, saying "well if they can do that, turn it up a notch and they can do this" This many clicks on the clock will make us x amount of dollars. Well thats great, but things have changed, traffic, size and weight being only a few of the things that have changed.
if someone can show me how to do it, better faster, Im all for it, but more times than not, they do not know, have forgot, or never knew. So until such time I will continue to do the best I can with the methods I have learned, try not to get hurt, and service the customer, and dont forget to turn in your sales leads, also!!

tourists24 · 11-18-2007, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hangingon

Some things change.. We had some drivers fail to make 9.5 on Tuesday. They informed the center they needed help but were told they were dispatched in TSP range so had to make it in by cut off. Guess how many article 7 (pending) suspensions and terminations were handed out the next morning? 1 per driver...

What part of the country is this happening? Id be interested to see that case at panel. What was the reason of discipline? Not following instructions? Stealing time?

Sammie · 11-18-2007, 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harley Rider

the only people left in management have never been in operations or driven a pkg car

I think it will be a sad day when all the experience leaves the company.

Harley Rider, I've noticed your topic for a number of years now, in operations and behind the scenes. You've got to wonder if the folks making the major company decisions these days are either dead or on life support.

We are, correct me if I'm wrong, a customer service organization. The public is our customer. In the past, we had layers and layers of well qualified managers and supervisors who knew the company inside and the place ran like clock work. Now, our customers often give up on us and our customer service departments are no longer empowered to help. They've all been outsourced. And an example of our facility here -
Our yard looks like peak week year round; red tags everywhere, feeder drivers spend an hour or so every day looking for their equipment and there is barely enough room to navigate around everything. Our last few feeder managers were transfers from the hub who have yet to set foot in a feeder vehicle.

Finding flaws in the UPS systems and understanding the customer experience has got to be mind boggling for the new leaders who never manned a center let alone delivered a package to a customer. And I don't see any of this getting better, I see it becoming a more severe problem. Sadly enough, it all boils down to letting those with seniority go, all those "bad" people either guilty of following protocol or who became frustrated with questionable practices and policies, and replacing them with folks who will work for a fraction of the pay.

Hangingon · 11-18-2007, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tourists24

What part of the country is this happening? Id be interested to see that case at panel. What was the reason of discipline? Not following instructions? Stealing time?

We're in the Metro DC area, and the reason is not following instructions. We're wondering how close to peak he will continue to push it.

tourists24 · 11-19-2007, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hangingon

We're in the Metro DC area, and the reason is not following instructions. We're wondering how close to peak he will continue to push it.

Ive seen them try this before. I have a feeling you will see these terminations disappear before making it to panel. They have no case here, esp if the drivers were told "no missed stops AND dont miss curfew". Everything has to be shown as to how the driver has performed in the past, not what the computer says you should do

Big Babooba · 11-19-2007, 11:58 PM

What's going to happen when all the people in Atlanta have never been in operations or driven a package car? They will carve this company up into little pieces and sell it to the highest bidders. They will be laughing all the way to the bank.