Driver terminated using gps info - Page 2 - Brown Cafe

trplnkl · 02-23-2008, 08:10 AM

Thanks for the reply, I'm not trying to erase the drivers responsibility, just wanting to understand how he/she thought they could get away with that kind of recording. To your knowledge was any NDA to that address delivered on time that day?

brownmonster · 02-23-2008, 08:30 AM

Here's an idea. Go back to 8 or 8:10 start times instead of 9. I'm not skipping a 100 piece dump stop to get some clowns resi NDA letter off. Give us the time to serve the damn customer. All of them.

barnyard · 02-23-2008, 08:34 AM

It was multiple days that it happened. It happened for at least a month, my wife did not have the time to check back any further, but when they were late, they were late with everything.

Since it has happened all the people in her office check the progress of NDAs to make sure they are delivered on time. This is the biggest issue, because now, this group of people do not trust us to do the honest thing. UPS took an integrity hit in that office and it will take a while, if ever, to build that back.

Another concern that I have is that now, instead of the building that was delivered late, another area is being delivered late instead of having air drivers insure that all NDAa are delivered on time. In that respect, I almost wish my wife had called it in and made it an official concern.

This is getting to be the norm, unfortunately. The same company tried Fedex and they sheeted packages one day and delivered them the next. DHL had either damage issues or late issues or lost issues with 25-30% of the volume that they shipped with them. Right now, it appears that UPS is the one that lies the least.

That's disappointing to me.

TB

brownmonster · 02-23-2008, 09:01 AM

And all 3 companies push their drivers to go out and drum up more business. Start proving you can handle the volume and serve the customers you have and maybe we'll look for more.

Ghost in the Darkness · 02-23-2008, 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UpstateNYUPSer

Just curious as to why you would have to type a stop in manually, even after deleting the pkg from EDD as "not found". As long as you have a stop left in EDD, you can go back to a stop that you have deleted simply by scanning the pkg. However, if your EDD is complete, then, yes, you would have to enter it manually.

That is why I said type it in manually. Unfortunately we have preloaders who can't read and supervisors who forget (?) to move splits in EDD so its not all that uncommon to get packages in the load that aren't in EDD. I also am one who gets sent to help out other drivers and its normally after I'm done with my work. I'm just mentioning it because its something I've observed... not because its a way to buck their system. Its just a reminder to me that most of us drivers are smarter and more reliable than their PAS system and their GPS. Essentially its flaws in their new system that I take as compliments that I'm good at what I do... like an unspoken pat on the back

.

over9five · 02-23-2008, 09:15 AM

We had a driver here who was expecting an urgent EAM he needed to get before he left for work. Didn't come, so when he got in, he tracked it.
Came up "need directions" at 7:50, then delivered at 8:10. (He lives on a main street). He was Bravo Sierra! Went straight to the center and yelled at a sup that this was dishonest and he was going to report it when he demanded his refund. The sup went into the computer and changed it so it would show late.

I don't know what happened to the air driver who was dishonest. Hopefully, he got taught a lesson.

brownnblue · 02-23-2008, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeddySS98

As far as the GPS tracking... I have stops every day where i'm at the right place and the diad will go nuts with the 'winnin slot machine tune' it plays when your 'out of area' Is the Diad area and the GPS one in the same or are they different systems?

Same with my E-brake, I can set it at every stop but the dash still lights up reminding me i need to set the ebrake and plays the ongoing beep beep beep

Good points here, especially if disciplinary action can now occur with this new technology.

Just how accurate is this GPS? I did the lat/long check by hitting 8 in the communication screen one day while waiting for late air. I then did it with another driver's DIAD, and the numbers were not even remotely close.

My e-brake light on the dash goes off when the e-brake is applied, this happens at every stop. Sometimes when I return to the truck after completing the stop it is still going off.

Same thing with the seat belt light. My seat belt is always engaged, but the light on the dash is on. (this does not happen as often as the e-brake light)

rod · 02-23-2008, 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by barnyard

It is a 1 stop office. Packages are delivered through the front door (office building) to the receptionist.

It would have been nice to hear what they had to do to resolve this. My wife said that when the sales guy was in, he made a point to stop by her cube and let her know that he took care of it.

TB

Won't happen again until the next time some beatup UPS driver gets fed up with being yelled at constantly for late air after being ignored when he warns them he can't get his air off in time. Many times I would tell the preload sup that a few of my airs would be late only to have him turn around and walk away yelling "just do it".

tourists24 · 02-23-2008, 09:38 AM

[quote=rod;306233 Many times I would tell the preload sup that a few of my airs would be late only to have him turn around and walk away yelling "just do it".[/quote]

good thing about this is that your butt is covered once you've told them you will have late. Let em get mad but if you cant cover them then you cant cover them. Some around here get threatened disciplined if they arent off on time, but as long as you run air only, there is no argument for them

barnyard · 02-23-2008, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rod

Won't happen again until the next time some beatup UPS driver gets fed up with being yelled at constantly for late air after being ignored when he warns them he can't get his air off in time. Many times I would tell the preload sup that a few of my airs would be late only to have him turn around and walk away yelling "just do it".

I have had the same thing happen. I then send a message via the diad and wait for the response. I have asked to have diad messages printed up for a particular day, so they know I am CMA. Once I started doing that, I was hassled less.

TB

tieguy · 02-23-2008, 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IDoLessWorkThanMost

....based on data solely attained through GPS data.....GPS data plus something else, diff story. This new contract is not something to be proud of..

There is nothing wrong with the new contract if you having nothing to hide.

tieguy · 02-23-2008, 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FedexExEmployee

Sure, she falsified, but what about the managers who falsify on a daily basis to make their numbers look good?

and those managers would say and what about the other managers or the divison managers that falsify their numbers.

Better to not get yourself caught up in that bag of excuses.

trplnkl · 02-23-2008, 10:14 AM

I do agree that Honesty is the best policy, no bout adoubt it. I do, however, see it as very ironic that some managers stress integrity to the lengths of using it to fire someone, when they, themselves, are the worst offenders. Maybe not as ironic as hypocritical.

IDoLessWorkThanMost · 02-23-2008, 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tieguy

There is nothing wrong with the new contract if you having nothing to hide.

It's not what is IN the contract, but what was failed to be addressed. the language is very weak; any employee is not to be disciplined due to information gathered by GPS only....so, GPS plus a managers word, versus employee IS good enough? It's really sad that this work process and technology has come to this point in a way. Most drivers are honest, hard working people and could still face unnecessary discipline because of the vague language.

mikestrek · 02-23-2008, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeddySS98

I've Scanned a NDA before the 10:30 mark, but i've never released the package prior to getting there...I "THINK" your okay if you just scan it...and then release it once you get there.

As far as the GPS tracking... I have stops every day where i'm at the right place and the diad will go nuts with the 'winnin slot machine tune' it plays when your 'out of area' Is the Diad area and the GPS one in the same or are they different systems?

Same with my E-brake, I can set it at every stop but the dash still lights up reminding me i need to set the ebrake and plays the ongoing beep beep beep

LEDDY, I wouldn't count on that. I believe when you push "stop complete". That promps the time stamp for that stop. Just like if you pre-record a NDA and forget about it until after the commit time. When you stop complete it, even though you scaned it earlier. It will promp for a reason delivered late.

over9five · 02-23-2008, 10:23 AM

I don't understand why a driver would want to cheat our customers by scanning before you get there. They paid for 10:30 delivery, if it's not in their hands at 10:30 they deserve a refund.

Nothing will ever get fixed if people continue to cheat the system (and our customers).

trplnkl · 02-23-2008, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by over9five

I don't understand why a driver would want to cheat our customers by scanning before you get there. They paid for 10:30 delivery, if it's not in their hands at 10:30 they deserve a refund.

Nothing will ever get fixed if people continue to cheat the system (and our customers).

Tell me something, ever deliver a NDA to a resi , no one home only to return later in the day with ground and the NDA is still where you left it? what deference could it make if the NDA was there by 10:30 or not? I know that one would have no way of knowing if someone is home or not but it is still frustrating to bust your butt for nothing.

I agree the customer deserves to get what they pay for. Here's a novel idea, how about UP$ giving the driver a chance to succeed rather than shootin' 'em in the foot and blaming 'em for limping.

paidslave · 02-23-2008, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by over9five

I don't understand why a driver would want to cheat our customers by scanning before you get there. They paid for 10:30 delivery, if it's not in their hands at 10:30 they deserve a refund.

Nothing will ever get fixed if people continue to cheat the system (and our customers).

The reason why this is done because these drivers don't want to answer to managment if one is late since that will be there fault once again. So it is never ending. These drivers do forget that the customer is paying for this service. I don't condone this behavior but some times you can't blame them entirely because of the fear and intimdation by management!

UPS has there own freight department, feeder department, air department.....Maybe it is time UPS has air drivers to deal with this. Regular package car drivers have way to many stops as it is. Go back to 12:00 and lower the air rates. I think this problem will be resolved!

Lots of drivers were hired before this 10;30 comitment and are being threatened and imtimidated because UPS dropped the ball way back regarding service!

barnyard · 02-23-2008, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by paidslave

Go back to 12:00 and lower the air rates. I think this problem will be resolved!

My day would go sooooo much better with 12:00 commits. I would be able to deliver 90% of my regular air on trace.

TB

MrFedEx · 02-23-2008, 11:00 AM

What a double-standard both FedEx and UPS have on the falsification issue. I see management falsification all the time on various reports, yet when an hourly falsifies anything it's time for the cross and nails to come out so they can be terminated with a vengeance.
The pressure to not have lates is intense, and so is the temptation to cheat the system. We have managers who actually try and beat the system by encouraging drivers to enter "delay" codes for certain customers who have guard gates or other security issues that could potentially cause a package to be late. The problem is that drivers wind up "abusing" the code and then are fired by the same manager(s)that advised using it in the first place.
When all of this comes-up during the inevitable GFT hearing the manager is inevitably absolved of any responsibility for the falsification. We suspect that our GPS is being used to exactly pinpoint driver location at the time of data entry to make the case for termination absolutely concrete. That's what I call a double standard.

barnyard · 02-23-2008, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrFedEx

What a double-standard both FedEx and UPS have on the falsification issue.

The Fedex guy that delivers in my area says that everyday he gets to decide who gets late air and who gets it on time. The ground guy says that he routinely sheets stuff delivered and then delivers it the next day.

At some point, a group of shippers should get together and file a class action suit, fraud is being committed.

TB

MrFedEx · 02-23-2008, 11:11 AM

Ground drivers are held to a much lower standard than Express drivers. If everyone who received late air shipments with FedEx Express held them to their 10:30 "on-time or it's free" guarantee, we'd be out of business. FedEx has so much fine print attached to it that we have an excuse for almost anything that is late.

dannyboy · 02-23-2008, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Tell me something, ever deliver a NDA to a resi , no one home only to return later in the day with ground and the NDA is still where you left it? what deference could it make if the NDA was there by 10:30 or not?

Well while you are using that excuse, why no the guy who states "why did they send that next day air, I dont need it till next week".

The bottom line is this. Either the reciever or the shipper felt like it needed to be there overnight by a certain time. And they paid the price we promised to get it there by. That is all the driver needs to know. Anything else in the discussion is just mud in the water. If the shipment is to be delivered by 10:30, get it there. If you have a 500 package bulk stop that has to wait, to bad. If your sup dispatches you with the air, its your job to deliver it.

As for the dishonest actions, sure, management does things that are dishonest. But does that make dishonest acts by the driver any less dishonest? Wrong is wrong, I dont care how you color it.

In our center, almost half of the air is late almost every day. When it gets bad enough, things will change. A start time of 8:50 and a left building time of 9:45 and the first stop off at 10:15 with 22 air stops to be delivered by 10:30.......who's problem is that?

Do things by the book. A sup screaming and ranting over late air is childs play when compared to a calm voice telling you do no longer have a job because of dishonesty.

d

filthpig · 02-23-2008, 12:05 PM

I can tell you this much: if you tell your supe you have too much air to get off, they can only discipline you for being late if you ran ground pkgs with it. The trick is to tell them you need help and if they don't give it to you, run ONLY airs.

tieguy · 02-23-2008, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IDoLessWorkThanMost

It's not what is IN the contract, but what was failed to be addressed. the language is very weak; any employee is not to be disciplined due to information gathered by GPS only....so, GPS plus a managers word, versus employee IS good enough? It's really sad that this work process and technology has come to this point in a way. Most drivers are honest, hard working people and could still face unnecessary discipline because of the vague language.

Does not change anything . GPS should show them running their route and doing their job. Its language that should never be needed if everyone does the job the way they were trained.