Anybody Else Get Paid the Triple Time 9.5 Penalty Yet?

[raceanoncr]

tripinkl,
You responded, criticized, rebutted, castigated me in my insistance on running trace. Fine! I don't care or get offended.

I still question why you responded with the statement that building up miles is the only thing they can gig you on, then state that it was taken out of context, it, being an incorrect statement. I say running up miles, going off trace could be contrued as being dishonest. ME saying it's dishonest? NO! The COMPANY saying it's dishonest. I say again, as I have many times on the Cafe, that this company may be morons when it comes to dispatch but experts when it comes to espionage and deceit. On this issue, the miles, I was merely saying, "Be careful, they can gig you on anything they want"!

You say you have extensive experience to make service (as in United Parcel SERVICE)? Well, don't we all? I would like to think so. The question most times, tho, is this: "Do you want me to make service or do you want me to work as directed?" Most times anymore, you can't do both. Correct?

In answer to my question from management, "You know what a 9.5 dispatch is"?, you stated that you know how to make SERVICE on packages and that you never read in the contract that you are responsible for dispatch, you are responsible for SERVICE. I say, TRUE, the contract does NOT make you responsible for dispatch but it certainly makes you responsible for WORKING AS DIRECTED, does it not? My bid sheet says that exact thing. As I stated before, I would LOVE to give the best service possible, but for some strange reason, the company does not want to do this. Example: FDX a couple yrs ago opened up a so-called fast lane in the middle of the states. UPS vaulted into action (following FDX, of course) and launched their own "fast-lane" in the same area, matching service, adding many sleeper runs to compensate. When asked why we couldn't do that in our lane, some miles north, a major corridor for shipping, our CM stated, and I heard this directly, "Because FDX hasn't done it yet"! How shocking!

We could very easily institute over night service from many more areas than we do now but just won't. Why? It cost too much for one, but mainly because FDX ain't done it yet. So, I know how to give SERVICE too but just CAN'T. Oh, I could take it upon myself to keep on driving, by-passing my meet point and drive directly to the trailer destination, if my hours would allow, then when I'm fired I can claim I was making service but how would THAT fly? Sure, it's an exageration. Don't ding me on THIS now!

You also dinged me a couple times ("maybe you should stick to feeder questions and suggestions") and ("No wonder you went into feeders") and I admit I may not have your package car edymacation but I DID spend more time there than I ever wanted or would want to again and have contact with some of my old friends there and read this when my GED coach lets me and can help me wif the big words.

Again, I point out the title of this thread, "Anybody else get paid...". The question originally was about winning grievances on this 9.5 issue. I say, go for it but don't expect miracles. You ever been in these hearings where the company nitpiks about every little nuance of your job? I'm sure you have. So have I! I know what they're capable of. That's why I say, "Give SERVICE all you want, skip your lunch, go off trace, run across the yards, jumb off the docks, sign the DIAD yourself, do everything it takes to make SERVICE but don't file a grievance on your lunch, breaking your leg stepping in a resi gopher hole, sprain your back jumping off a dock, etc.". AND, running off trace. You think you're gonna win? I hope you do, but I don't think so.

I could go on and on about SERVICE, as you so keenly loved to throw out in this rebuttal. You talk about it taking more time to call dispatch than it does to actually MAKE service. I say, probably true. But what are the instructions? You go off trace to make service a couple miles away. What happens if you have an accident? How is the company gonna stand behind you on THIS one? No verbal answer needed here, I already know.

Lastly, I DO NOT condone sacrificing SERVICE just to win grievances. BUT, by golly, you file a grievance on an issue, you better be able to back it up! OR be prepared to lose. Notice, now, (and I can see you blasting me here along with others), I said BE PREPARED to lose. Maybe you'll win but in cases I have seen here, you make ONE misstep, you WILL lose.

Again, thanks for the kind words and will look forward to the next issue of, "Let's Make RACEANONCR look like an idiot"!

[trplnkl]

Originally Posted by raceanoncr

tripinkl,
You responded, criticized, rebutted, castigated me in my insistance on running trace. Fine! I don't care or get offended.
You were doing a fair amount of castigating yourself there. I was doing my best to answer your claims/questions about trace. I can understand how going off trace in feeders could/might be considered a really big deal. However, at least in our center, it's not that big of a deal. Especially since Pas has been implemented there are many routes that are not in an order that trace can be followed and service be made.

I still question why you responded with the statement that building up miles is the only thing they can gig you on, then state that it was taken out of context, it, being an incorrect statement. I say running up miles, going off trace could be contrued as being dishonest.
Breaking trace does not always mean running up miles. You said yourself that many of the drivers you know are running more miles than they were before. Breaking trace can in effect, reduce miles.
ME saying it's dishonest? NO! The COMPANY saying it's dishonest. I say again, as I have many times on the Cafe, that this company may be morons when it comes to dispatch but experts when it comes to espionage and deceit. On this issue, the miles, I was merely saying, "Be careful, they can gig you on anything they want"!
You've been around UPS long enough to know that everything they try to gig you on doesn't stick.

You say you have extensive experience to make service (as in United Parcel SERVICE)? Well, don't we all? I would like to think so. The question most times, tho, is this: "Do you want me to make service or do you want me to work as directed?" Most times anymore, you can't do both. Correct?
I believe I said that in the last two lines of my castigating, criticizing, rebuttal.

In answer to my question from management, "You know what a 9.5 dispatch is"?, you stated that you know how to make SERVICE on packages and that you never read in the contract that you are responsible for dispatch, you are responsible for SERVICE.
Again I was merely answering your "management" question. I may have not given the correct answer. I never said I was a genius. And quite possibly, given more time to think of another answer I may not answer in that way.
I say, TRUE, the contract does NOT make you responsible for dispatch but it certainly makes you responsible for WORKING AS DIRECTED, does it not?
Am I NOT directed to make service on all packages if possible?
My bid sheet says that exact thing. As I stated before, I would LOVE to give the best service possible, but for some strange reason, the company does not want to do this. Example: FDX a couple yrs ago opened up a so-called fast lane in the middle of the states. UPS vaulted into action (following FDX, of course) and launched their own "fast-lane" in the same area, matching service, adding many sleeper runs to compensate. When asked why we couldn't do that in our lane, some miles north, a major corridor for shipping, our CM stated, and I heard this directly, "Because FDX hasn't done it yet"! How shocking!

We could very easily institute over night service from many more areas than we do now but just won't. Why? It cost too much for one, but mainly because FDX ain't done it yet. So, I know how to give SERVICE too but just CAN'T. Oh, I could take it upon myself to keep on driving, by-passing my meet point and drive directly to the trailer destination, if my hours would allow, then when I'm fired I can claim I was making service but how would THAT fly? Sure, it's an exageration. Don't ding me on THIS now!
Well, ...never mind.

You also dinged me a couple times ("maybe you should stick to feeder questions and suggestions") and ("No wonder you went into feeders") and I admit I may not have your package car edymacation but I DID spend more time there than I ever wanted or would want to again and have contact with some of my old friends there and read this when my GED coach lets me and can help me wif the big words.
I'm not sure I understand what you are implying here. Your last sentence in the above paragraph makes absolutely not sense, as it applies to nothing I said.
My dinging you about going into feeders was merely trying to say that things probably have changed since you were a PC driver. The sentence about "no wonder you went into feeders" was in response the impression you gave me that you thought staying on trace is more important than making service on packages. When BOTH are "work as directed" matters. Well, again lately, staying on trace may not be a "work as directed "matter.

Again, I point out the title of this thread, "Anybody else get paid...". The question originally was about winning grievances on this 9.5 issue. I say, go for it but don't expect miracles. You ever been in these hearings where the company nitpiks about every little nuance of your job? I'm sure you have. So have I! I know what they're capable of. That's why I say, "Give SERVICE all you want, skip your lunch, go off trace, run across the yards, jumb off the docks, sign the DIAD yourself, do everything it takes to make SERVICE but don't file a grievance on your lunch, breaking your leg stepping in a resi gopher hole, sprain your back jumping off a dock, etc.". AND, running off trace. You think you're gonna win? I hope you do, but I don't think so.
I guess we will see at some point in time.

I could go on and on about SERVICE, as you so keenly loved to throw out in this rebuttal. You talk about it taking more time to call dispatch than it does to actually MAKE service. I say, probably true. But what are the instructions?
My instructions everyday is to make service attempts on all packages. I have not heard a PCM on staying on trace in years. if ever.
You go off trace to make service a couple miles away. What happens if you have an accident? How is the company gonna stand behind you on THIS one? No verbal answer needed here, I already know.
I'll give an answer anyway. If I have a reason for being where I am, when I am there, the company should stand behind me. But we all know that if I have an accident, it aint gonna be pretty in any case.

Lastly, I DO NOT condone sacrificing SERVICE just to win grievances. BUT, by golly, you file a grievance on an issue, you better be able to back it up! OR be prepared to lose. Notice, now, (and I can see you blasting me here along with others), I said BE PREPARED to lose. Maybe you'll win but in cases I have seen here, you make ONE misstep, you WILL lose.
I do understand what you are saying.

Again, thanks for the kind words and will look forward to the next issue of, "Let's Make RACEANONCR look like an idiot"!
I never tried to make you or anyone else look like an idiot, in fact I don't think I made you look like an idiot. If indeed you looked like an idiot, it was your own doing, not mine.

[toonertoo]

I am working as directed, I get in my truck,at start time, try to find stuff and deliver it all. There is no trace, and no pas, as no one can tell me how to best run the diarhea they throw in. If someone can come out and show me how to run it better, jump in. I would buy lunch. I am a b car that is a junk car. I am in a 1000 and if it fits, Im expected to do it. I do, It may not be pretty, but its done. Got 10.5 tonite, and this week I file, Im not doing this all summer. And if I have to I will call it hazard pay. My work is on a car that isnt in my loop, and my loop partner goes 15 miles to the opposite end of town. The car with my work gets 10 and runs 2 hrs early. Love the guy, but if he wants the OT, he can deliver the crap that doesnt belong on my car. I want my work back. I do not know how to make this happen, Ive tried talking, no one wants to listen. If the dispatch sup thinks I need "more work" instead of using charts, he tells the loader to give me the 0-300 work, and he throws it on four different shelves. 1000 numbers apart in sequence. miles apart. No one wants to file, I dont want to file, but Im getting the crap because I dont speak up. I just want to do a fair day and go home. If I have 10 I have never cared, but I think it should be divided equally, and it isnt. Its a case of "we will do it til she gets all fired up". Then we will screw someone else for a while.

[outta hours]

Tooner it was told to me directly by my CM that the work is dispatched and leveled per the driver not the area. He said that it was "just good business to load up the horses that will run". I am sure you work safely and probably harder than most and the second part of that is what is getting you more work. I would encourage you to file 9.5 every chance you can, that way it is documented that you will not allow yourself to be taken advantage of by them. They signed and agreed to the language in the contract just like we did. Time away from this place is too valuable not to fight for it. Three or more over 9.5's worked per week equals a grievance. Wait until the following Monday to file it add up everyday you worked over 9.5 multiply the hrs.X 1 1/2 your hourly rate and put the total on the grievance for penalty pay. And don't forget to add any comments made to you by them on the 2nd sheet for your BA to review with the labor mgr. It may take a while as it did for me but the work will come off and you can enjoy your evenings at home again.

[gumbybros]

Don't know if it's true, but I've heard that the company wants to renegotiate the 9.5 language. Supposedly, they say it's so confusing nobody can agree on what is meant, and they won't be bound by it as it is written. Obviously, from some of the prior posts, they are still paying out on it. Maybe it's a district thing. Maybe it's just plain b.s. Our opt out list was never posted, and when I pushed it, the center mgr said the company and union are working together on the "proper form" to post. The union business agent backed them up and said that was correct. Seems to me that it shouldn't be that difficult to do, so something must be up. The contract says you can file for double pay if they "CONTINUALLY" cause you to work over 9.5 hrs. more that 2 times in a week. Does anyone win a grievance if it happens a week here, a week there?

[toonertoo]

I hate to have to do this. I do not like to cause havoc. I wouldnt even care if someone would listen, but they just blow me off, and someone else has a lesser problem and comes and bends an ear when I am trying to discuss like a professional what the problem is. They know Im soft and easy, we will fix it tomorrow yada yada. here I am stressing and I dont want to. There has just been so much gunfire, and killings in the last four days, I just really dont want to be there. I dont want to die at work. I know its going to get worse this summer, heck in the last four days. I never bid on a route that had this work, I never would have. It just got stuck on me, they move one section, then 2, then three, now four every darn day. And take nothing off. I did nothing, nothing but commercial til 4, then I hurried and slung pkgs, for the ghetto, and barely got to my pickups. Im not going there after 5. People are getting shot at 10 am every darn day. What happens when I bring the work back? I dont care. I have asked what the protocol is for these dangerous areas, duh, no answer, except yes its bad and getting worse. Im thinking a letter to corporate? dont want to but will. Ive done it before and got results on other issues, better than a grievance, as it isnt about money, its about safety. Yes I know DOK, hazardous mats, yada yada, how will that save me from a bullet? Got all the safety people there for a week, maybe I should get there early and ask about real safety concerns since no one else will listen. Excuse my rant, I feel better now

[dilligaf]

Tooner, considering the circumstances I think you have every right to rant and be scared too. I would. Along with what you said I would add that maybe you should call the 800#. It is to bad that anyone should have to work in those types of situations, but I would start playing the seniority card and do whatever it takes to get out of that area. I would be screaming at the top of my lungs to get out of there. I pray for a satisfactory end to this, good luck.

[DS]

tooner,Ihope you do send off a letter to corporate,because we dont want you to die.
Its funny what you said about the junk car.if I'm heavy I give 10-15 resis to the guy 2 cars down,and I feel guilty because he has all the crap stops,like walmart, home depot, business depot, etc...and my car only has 160 pkgs in it,but he is usually back before me,and complains more than me.

[toonertoo]

If anyone thinks Im exagerating, just go to www.wfmj.com. every shooting and robbery is on the area, they keep giving me. I tried to copy and paste but it would not work.

Thanks for the advice, but I already know something has to change, It is not worth 28 bucks an hour. Ill work my arse off, but this isnt right for any employee with any seniority, to have to handle when mgmt doesnt live here and doesnt have a clue.

[trplnkl]

Originally Posted by toonertoo

If anyone thinks Im exagerating, just go to www.wfmj.com. every shooting and robbery is on the area, they keep giving me. I tried to copy and paste but it would not work.

Thanks for the advice, but I already know something has to change, It is not worth 28 bucks an hour. Ill work my arse off, but this isnt right for any employee with any seniority, to have to handle when mgmt doesnt live here and doesnt have a clue.

It's workin.

[mattwtrs]

Tooner & friends: Youngstown Police Search for Sunday Shooting Suspect
Youngstown police are now investigating this weekend's shooting on the city's south side as a homicide.
Eighteen-year-old Terrell Roland of East Avondale was rushed to St. Elizabeth's Hospital Sunday after he was found unconscious in his driveway and shot twice in the stomach.
He was pronounced dead earlier this morning. A witness told police he saw the suspect shoot the victim and then speed off in a black four door buick regal.

Police Investigate Youngstown Shooting
Another shooting in Youngstown - this one in the middle of the day on Hilton Avenue, near Cottage Grove. Police say a man was taken to Saint Elizabeth hospital in critical condition after being shot several times. Investigators say two men in a blue Chevy Cobalt opened fire on him as he was driving. More than 20 bullets and shell casings were found in the street, and police say the victim's car was struck at least 16 times. Although police would not release the victim's name, they do tell us they're familiar with him. He was shot at last summer in this same neighborhood.

How can management ignore these Safety Issues??

[toonertoo]

All my area, now.
I was told for safety I could call 911, geez why didnt I think of that? And then call the center.
And I can put my route up for bid and go swinging again. Which doesnt eliminate the problem, someone has to be there.
But I was told that was the answer from the head of safety.

[brownmonster]

Another safety issue ignored. Safety first. I can't imagine working in some of these areas. My kid goes to college in Milwaukee and we fear for her safety. It's the urban jungle. It's only going to get worse as the economy weakens and more low end labor goes overseas.

[toonertoo]

And as the weather gets warmer.
Hot summer nights in the hood, the smell of gunfire in the air, MMMMMMMM.
Safety a big joke.
I hope, and I know they wont ever ask me to attend a safety meeting again.
Ill be fine. Im hood trained now.
I just fear for others as it gets worse, and worse.
Make sure your daughter is street smart, Im sure you have taught her.
They are going to institute zero tolerance program again, and a new program called cease fire. Later this month for a few days, duh.

[DS]

Tooner,its only a matter of time till some creep with a gun decides your truck has something in it he wants.YOU should have a gun.

[toonertoo]

Its not worth the trouble. Me having a gun would be like taking a knife to a gunfight.
And besides, safety would never allow it. They care about our safety, remember that.

[Griff]

Originally Posted by toonertoo

If anyone thinks Im exagerating, just go to www.wfmj.com. every shooting and robbery is on the area, they keep giving me. I tried to copy and paste but it would not work.

Thanks for the advice, but I already know something has to change, It is not worth 28 bucks an hour. Ill work my arse off, but this isnt right for any employee with any seniority, to have to handle when mgmt doesnt live here and doesnt have a clue.

Ever think about wearing a vest into work? You can get one for $300-500. Can't put a price tag on your life and it could save it. I'm sure you'll get someones attention when you stroll in the building like that. I wouldn't even think twice about wearing one if I was in your shoes.

[toonertoo]

The kid on Avondale had a vest on, it didnt help him. They all wear vests. Under their hoodies. They actually put the witness in the back seat and when they got him to the hospital, he told police he had a loaded gun he put under the back seat of the cruiser, when they found it they arrested him also, and he had a vest on also. The cop could have got shot in the back of the head, keystone cops. Seems to be the attire for the area. A vest doesnt protect the head either. Its a great idea, but Im not dressing like that. Although for the price it would be fun to make a statement. I just wrote up a few pkgs as animals in the area, soon enough I'll get fired for it. I have made the decision to leave if it doesnt calm down or things dont change. Soon. My CM will be back Monday, Ill see what he will do. It only involves giving me my work back, and not keeping me buried til 8. It involves not giving me 5 streets. And giving me the ability to keep my commercial down when I absolutely positively have to have the work. So I can do them before the thugs rise. I was told it isnt my work its UPS's work, and they will send it where it needs to go. Thanks for all the advice and for caring.
Oh and one small thing, one of these 15 is my loader, erghhhhhhh!!!!!!!! And he had to leave a little early today for court.
Suspects Charged in Local Theft Ring Appear in Court






Suspects charged in a sophisticated local theft ring appeared in court this morning.
Fifteen people face a total of 68 charges including racketeering, breaking and entering, and receiving stolen property.
The theft ring stretched as far as Cleveland and Western Pennsylvania and dates back to 2004.
Police say the thieves stole big screen t-v's, motorcycles, and other highly sought items, then sold them for as much as 85 percent less than the retail price.