new hires / please come to work :)

[paco]

Originally Posted by disneyworld

The tuition reimbursement isn't even worth it now. It has to be paid back if you leave within two years of completing your degree.

Nope, no such thing.

[20_smoke]

I am sick of people complaining about P/T turn over and people not coming to work. It's not about the pay,its about the P/T and F/T supervisors they work for. I was always told people do not quit UPS, they quit there supervisor. Turn over this year in my building is around 15% that is because it starts with orientation, all full time supervisors on our shift stop by the class everyday. We tell them what they are really getting into. Also, we do not have our newest P/T supervisors training new hires, we have our senior P/T sups training. I guess we are doing something right we also have zero injuries so far this year. Its about how you talk, treat and understand the people that work for you. It is not always about the packages and the operation, take time to sit down with one of your employees outside or when the belts are not running, you will be surprised what you can get accomplished.

[disneyworld]

Originally Posted by paco

Nope, no such thing.

Whadda ya mean,"no such thing"

[Adino]

Originally Posted by paco

P.S: It is very easy to go from 8:50/hr to 10/hr, all you gotta do is work for 90 days and pass the sort test.

Yes that is the case here, and I for one never had to do a sort test.

[Hangingon]

We've had 100% turnover in our PT sups in the last 6 months. The ones we now have have never done the jobs they are supervising and as a consequence there is no training of any type that goes on here. Unloaders are put on the sort aisle and told to ask other sorters where things go and loaders are just handed the charts. Several of our PTers have quit and one of the main reasons cited has been frustration at not knowing how to do the job but being yelled at for not doing it correctly or in a timely fashion.

[danlin]

Originally Posted by Cezanne

The whole work environment has changed, part timers are not what they used to be for the most part they were college students, young , healthy, single and male. Might not sound today as politically correct but that were the kids that UPS only hired in the 70's, 80's and 90's. The Health coverage was basically not needed, because alot of these college kids were covered also with their parents benefits. Today the only and I mean only advantage to work for UPS would be health coverage for a married or aging workforce, it just isn't worth it for the average college kid to maintain the standards of employment that UPS is committed too. This 8.50 per hour deal to start out with minus the union dues, lousy start times and a pretty physical warehouse workload kills any ambition for the new employee to hang around. The tutition reimbursement offered only helps with you are capable of maintaining a full college schedule and grade average and still find the time to show up five days a week, working physically harder than most average employees do in a 12 hour shift.

This whole pension fiasco and the possibility of the average full timer hanging around till 65 or older is also taking affect. The long term employee is basically pissed off with the answers that we are getting about any future retirement with our bodies still in working order, the smart ones are working at a pace to prevent any injury that may prevent them from collected that pension, working smarter not harder would be the term. Any kind of standards are a thing of the past, if they really ever existed. Also the long term employee generally has a history of past offenses and some pretty abusive treatment by bad management practices and we really never trust the company to do the right thing, they created the monster now they have to live with it.

Now on the management level, that carrot of UPS stock is being prolonged and is not as tasty as it once was. The old time management is still hanging around, most are multi-millionaires and resentment is building with the younger management types. The will never be in the situation with the UPS stock that occured when it went public in the early 90's, that promise of living comfortable and having the ability to retire in the mid 50's is disappearing. Anybody who has worked for UPS has noticed the "pecking order concept" management works under, the control that upper management has over the lower types is pretty frightening. This creates alot of enuchs who cower to the whims of those in charge of their careers, any creative thought out there is suppressed by the system in place.

Anybody remember the dire straits song "Industrial disease", guessing we are not alone in this, go to any major corporation and probadly find the same situation.

Excellent post I could not of said it better myself. Cezanne you and your career sound like a mirror image of me-mine. Also the song ITS JUST A GAME by Triumph sums up UPS pretty well

[paco]

Originally Posted by disneyworld

Whadda ya mean,"no such thing"

"Earn and learn" program which allows you upto $15000 ($3000 yearly) for PT hub workers, is unrestricted money. There is a consern loan which allows you to borrow upto $8000, which UPS will pay if you stay with them for 5 years (other than the interest). So your assertion that you have to pay it back to UPS is nonsense.

But if you are talking about reimbursement for other class of employees, I apologize. However, for PT hourlies and sups, what I mentioned above applies.

[paco]

Originally Posted by Adino

Yes that is the case here, and I for one never had to do a sort test.

In colorado, it's 8.50 for 90 days, then you get a raise of .50. In the meantime, you can pass the sort test, which entitles you to an extra dollar so, 8.50+1.00+0.5 =$10. I don't know how it breaks down for your area. But officially that's how you'd do it.

Originally Posted by Cezanne

The whole work environment has changed, part timers are not what they used to be for the most part they were college students, young , healthy, single and male. Might not sound today as politically correct but that were the kids that UPS only hired in the 70's, 80's and 90's. The Health coverage was basically not needed, because alot of these college kids were covered also with their parents benefits. Today the only and I mean only advantage to work for UPS would be health coverage for a married or aging workforce, it just isn't worth it for the average college kid to maintain the standards of employment that UPS is committed too. This 8.50 per hour deal to start out with minus the union dues, lousy start times and a pretty physical warehouse workload kills any ambition for the new employee to hang around. The tutition reimbursement offered only helps with you are capable of maintaining a full college schedule and grade average and still find the time to show up five days a week, working physically harder than most average employees do in a 12 hour shift.

This whole pension fiasco and the possibility of the average full timer hanging around till 65 or older is also taking affect. The long term employee is basically pissed off with the answers that we are getting about any future retirement with our bodies still in working order, the smart ones are working at a pace to prevent any injury that may prevent them from collected that pension, working smarter not harder would be the term. Any kind of standards are a thing of the past, if they really ever existed. Also the long term employee generally has a history of past offenses and some pretty abusive treatment by bad management practices and we really never trust the company to do the right thing, they created the monster now they have to live with it.

Now on the management level, that carrot of UPS stock is being prolonged and is not as tasty as it once was. The old time management is still hanging around, most are multi-millionaires and resentment is building with the younger management types. The will never be in the situation with the UPS stock that occured when it went public in the early 90's, that promise of living comfortable and having the ability to retire in the mid 50's is disappearing. Anybody who has worked for UPS has noticed the "pecking order concept" management works under, the control that upper management has over the lower types is pretty frightening. This creates alot of enuchs who cower to the whims of those in charge of their careers, any creative thought out there is suppressed by the system in place.

Anybody remember the dire straits song "Industrial disease", guessing we are not alone in this, go to any major corporation and probadly find the same situation.

Without a doubt, this is the BEST post I have ever seen on this board, but i have to add just one comment that I hope really makes up my fellow teamster brothers! The workforce WAS young, male and college kids in the past. They drew little if anything from the medical benefits needed. NOW the company, which pays a basiclly lump sum to the Teamsters to admin and oversee benefits can FLOOD the system by hiring older employees to try to do the job with several dependants to draw from the benefit coffers. Sure its not politically correct but lets be honest, ON A WHOLE AND OF COURSE THERE ARE COUNTLESS EXCEPTIONS but can a 20 year old male more easily meet the challenges of the job than a 40 year old female? But hey great maybe the 40 year old female can gain enough seniority to become a driver by her 50th birthday! Swing driver for a golden birthday present YIPEE!!!! Wake up and help tend the lawn Atlanta!!!! The seeds to our destruction are being planted on YOUR watch! (or nap)

[rngri4]

Originally Posted by mittam

When I loaded it was over 1200 per day before pass we were held to + and - 5 on stop count ,no air inload, haz pkgs on floor, tag pulled to pouch,all of which we could get warning letters or fired if we didn't follow up correctly.Last 2 weeks I have had 25 misloads(off area) 2 haz packages on top shelf,air inload 2 of them off area, a 105 lb on top back shelf,preload center manager said she would address this in next weeks safety pcm .Let's see between 3 of us we have had 8 haz pkgs on top shelves no tags pulled yah let's wait till next week.My thought is keep complaining about pt sup not properly traing and having no accoutability.Does it seem elsewhere that only drivers are held accountable? NO representation has helped us on these matters.. my suggestion...... join the APWA these are serious matters they are going to address,these should be dealt with immediatly not " oh next week when we have a safety pcm" managers need to be accountable now

Ok, not to be stupid or ignorant here, but I am in management, and 25 misloads and haz-mat packages on shelves is totally unacceptable, that cannot be blamed on any part time sup, that is a loaders fault 100%. DMS, which is used for dispatching does not show whether packages are overweight or hazmat, it just show the package, the software will one day be upgraded, but the loader still has to think with a clear head and do their job. I hate to say it, but you would've been given a letter of termination on our preload after just ten misloads or at least a warning letter.

[Hangingon]

This is completly the PT sups fault. It's called lack of training.

[toonertoo]

Originally Posted by Hangingon

This is completly the PT sups fault. It's called lack of training.

I agree, BUT, the trainer must be given the time to train...........and they are usually loading themselves...........

[rngri4]

Originally Posted by Hangingon

This is completly the PT sups fault. It's called lack of training.

How is it the PT Sup's fault? They aren't the ones loading the packages in the wrong trucks. Yes, I will agree I have seen inadequate training by PT Sup's but you can't blame them when aren't loading the trucks. In our building there are enough PT Sup's where one stays with a trainee all day, never leaving their side for the first two weeks, other building I have been to don't have that luxury, but I get tired of hearing people all the time blaming someone else for their mistakes. I used to be a pt oms, and I ended up working the preload a lot, training, so I know what training is, and how to do it, but I will agree that not all PT Sup's do, but they can't always be the blame.

[disneyworld]

Originally Posted by paco

"Earn and learn" program which allows you upto $15000 ($3000 yearly) for PT hub workers, is unrestricted money. There is a consern loan which allows you to borrow upto $8000, which UPS will pay if you stay with them for 5 years (other than the interest). So your assertion that you have to pay it back to UPS is nonsense.

But if you are talking about reimbursement for other class of employees, I apologize. However, for PT hourlies and sups, what I mentioned above applies.

Did I miss something? I don't remember writing anything about earn and learn!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[bear123]

25yrvet

i myself will be here 29 years. it used to be when i started that if you were a no call no show, you had better have one hell of an excuse why you didnt come to work that day. if you couldn't come up with any excuse you were gone and it was almost impossible to get your job back. i too remember that there would be lines 50 deep waiting to be interviewed.
now they have gone to highschools to recruit,
there was one gal who had been here 20 years and she simply walked out. the company called her two days later and asked her to come back and she did. 20 years ago, if she would have done that the company would have said, "you're leaving? fine dont let the door hit you in the ass.

[bear123]

Originally Posted by cashmen

How can a pt timer complain when they get full medical benefits for you and your family after 180 days.........hell, I dont know of any pt jobs that give full medical benefits....it is why i stuck around UPS for so long as a part timer......medical benefits make a hell of a lot of difference when ya have a family!
I know that 8 an hour is not alot nowadays, but that is just starting pay, you can get raises by taking a sort test and drive on Saturdays and not to mention Full Medical benefits for you and your family!
I just think that kids nowadays dont want to work anymore and want the high paying office job right away instead of working for it!

There is only one problem with your logic, cashman, It's the 8.00 an hour clause. You can get the same jobs working at McD's in air conditioning and working your own hours. True they could have gone to McD's instead of UPS but they didn't know the difference until they worked at UPS. When a worker realizes the type of work that is involved at UPS, i.e. working your ass off in a hot truck, getting dirty and grimy, getting yelled at by a supervisor because you didn't catch a salt, etc, etc, etc. All for 8.00 an hour. But hey at least you have great benefits, huh. I gurantee you when he does jump ship at UPS, he will be heading to McD's.
And then you wonder why there is a high turn over rate?
What really infuriates me is when UPS pats themselves on the back when they are getting raves because they are considered one of the most admired companies to work for. Are you kidding me? if the poll takers want to get an accurate reading on what it is like to work for at UPS how about interviewing the people who actually do the work. I am not talking about mgmt, I am talking about the hourlys, especially the pt's who only get 8.00 an hour.
This has to change on the next contract. But it wont, especially if Hoffa stays in office.
One other thing cashman (hey I am on a roll here) You said that is why you stuck around here, because of the medical benefits, i have a feeling when you started, you were getting paid a lot more--pre 1982--. I have been here going on 29 years next month. Yes the medical benefits were good but so was the pay. As far more money for being a sorter, when PAS goes national, sort pay will be obsolete. Because the PAS tells you were to sort a package, hense you dont have to take a sort test, that means all sorters will be unskilled. As far as medical benefits for new hires, as someone said on this board, most of them are covered by their parents. they could care less of medical benefits.

[rngri4]

Originally Posted by bear123

There is only one problem with your logic, cashman, It's the 8.00 an hour clause. You can get the same jobs working at McD's in air conditioning and working your own hours. True they could have gone to McD's instead of UPS but they didn't know the difference until they worked at UPS. When a worker realizes the type of work that is involved at UPS, i.e. working your ass off in a hot truck, getting dirty and grimy, getting yelled at by a supervisor because you didn't catch a salt, etc, etc, etc. All for 8.00 an hour. But hey at least you have great benefits, huh. I gurantee you when he does jump ship at UPS, he will be heading to McD's.
And then you wonder why there is a high turn over rate?
What really infuriates me is when UPS pats themselves on the back when they are getting raves because they are considered one of the most admired companies to work for. Are you kidding me? if the poll takers want to get an accurate reading on what it is like to work for at UPS how about interviewing the people who actually do the work. I am not talking about mgmt, I am talking about the hourlys, especially the pt's who only get 8.00 an hour.
This has to change on the next contract. But it wont, especially if Hoffa stays in office.
One other thing cashman (hey I am on a roll here) You said that is why you stuck around here, because of the medical benefits, i have a feeling when you started, you were getting paid a lot more--pre 1982--. I have been here going on 29 years next month. Yes the medical benefits were good but so was the pay. As far more money for being a sorter, when PAS goes national, sort pay will be obsolete. Because the PAS tells you were to sort a package, hense you dont have to take a sort test, that means all sorters will be unskilled. As far as medical benefits for new hires, as someone said on this board, most of them are covered by their parents. they could care less of medical benefits.

Great post...I am in management, and I agree 100 percent with this one. My brother worked at the beach least year, and got to look at women with bikini's etc all day, and made ten dollars an hour. Why would somone want to come to UPS for eight an hour and to work their butt off? I started at ten an hour when I was hourly, but that has been a time ago, but PAS has changed all that, changing skilled to un-skilled etc. We can't keep preloaders for this very reason, they go to Mickey D's or someplace else, they still get benefits, college etc, and don't have to work so dadblamed hard!

[browniehound]

Originally Posted by rngri4

Yes, I will agree I have seen inadequate training by PT Sup's but you can't blame them when aren't loading the trucks. .

HA! They ARE the ones loading the trucks in our building!

Just been invited over here by one of yours (I usually get banned from the postalnews.com site for all but 30 minutes a week.) Nobody wants to hear the truth. You guys seem to have standards in your hirings. The PO hires any warm body, especially if you are a relative of management. No reading skills required! Still, we've been extremely short for a few years now. Seems a big difference in direction. Apathy reigns supreme. Anyway, for laughs, go take a look at the postalnews.com site sometimes. Good for you to check out your competition (???)

[25yrvet]

Bear123--
You may remember the ol' days--- I was P/T in '81 making 11.87$ an hour

[disneyworld]

Originally Posted by browniehound

HA! They ARE the ones loading the trucks in our building!

You must work in Chema

[over9five]

Hmmm......Chema.....Do I kno u???

[disneyworld]

Originally Posted by over9five

Hmmm......Chema.....Do I kno u???

You might,but I'll never tell.A superhero never reveals his secret identity!!!!!!!! Where is your route?

[over9five]

That is top secret. I could tell you, but.....

[disneyworld]

Originally Posted by over9five

That is top secret. I could tell you, but.....

Very well then.......