Fuel Prices

But Benefits Are Great! · 06-26-2008, 07:06 AM

Fuel Costs were up horrendously for the 1st qtr

Fuel 1st Qtr 2007 - $616,000,000
Fuel 1st Qtr 2008 - $950,000,000

feeder53 · 06-26-2008, 07:34 AM

Everyone that uses fuel is affected, and UPS will be one of them. But UPS and all the other package Delivery services will pay the same price.....UPS has the history, reputation and lets hope leadership to pull ahead of the pack

Fnix · 06-26-2008, 07:58 AM

Fuel 1st Qtr 1987 - $16,000,000
Fuel 1st Qtr 2018 - $1,950,000,000

UpstateNYUPSer · 06-26-2008, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fnix

Fuel 1st Qtr 1987 - $16,000,000
Fuel 1st Qtr 2018 - $1,950,000,000

Fuel 1st Qtr 2018 - Zero

Why? UPS will have converted its entire fleet to hydrogen, which has zero emission exhaust (water) and has advanced the technology to the point where each vehicle regenerates its own fuel source throughout the day, which means that each vehicle would only need an initial fill and then would be self-sufficient.

But Benefits Are Great! · 06-26-2008, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UpstateNYUPSer

Fuel 1st Qtr 2018 - Zero

Why? UPS will have converted its entire fleet to hydrogen, which has zero emission exhaust (water) and has advanced the technology to the point where each vehicle regenerates its own fuel source throughout the day, which means that each vehicle would only need an initial fill and then would be self-sufficient.

...groan... That's, uh, not how it works.

The energy needed to seperate water into its' common elements is more than the energy produced by combining (burning) them. Physics, conservation of energy. No such thing as a car that runs on water.

UpstateNYUPSer · 06-26-2008, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by But Benefits Are Great!

...groan... That's, uh, not how it works.

The energy needed to seperate water into its' common elements is more than the energy produced by combining (burning) them. Physics, conservation of energy. No such thing as a car that runs on water.

BBAG, read the entire post then reply.

I said that the vehicles would run on HYDROGEN, whose exhaust is water. The rest was just science fiction stuff I was making up as I was typing but that sounded good.

But Benefits Are Great! · 06-26-2008, 04:31 PM

Oh... Nevermind..

06-26-2008, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by But Benefits Are Great!

...groan... That's, uh, not how it works.

The energy needed to seperate water into its' common elements is more than the energy produced by combining (burning) them. Physics, conservation of energy. No such thing as a car that runs on water.

You're right, just ask ole Teddy Kennedy!

helenofcalifornia · 06-26-2008, 04:36 PM

Is a hydrogen car anywhere near in the future?

UpstateNYUPSer · 06-26-2008, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by helenofcalifornia

Is a hydrogen car anywhere near in the future?

Less than 5 years from what I have read. Only problem will be the refueling stations, or lack of.

But Benefits Are Great! · 06-26-2008, 04:42 PM

Hydrogen will (eventually) be used in fuel cells, which generate electricity, which will run electric hub-motors.. It will never be used to burn in an engine like gasoline is today.

Fuel cells are too expensive. The technology is there now, just no hydrogen infrastructure, plus the cells are more expensive than plutonium.

UpstateNYUPSer · 06-26-2008, 04:45 PM

BBAG, you may want to research the topic a bit more before you reply. A hydrogen prototype has been developed and is being tested and optimistic predictions put intial production and availability at 5 yrs, probably closer to 10.

New Englander · 06-26-2008, 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UpstateNYUPSer

Fuel 1st Qtr 2018 - Zero

Why? UPS will have converted its entire fleet to hydrogen, which has zero emission exhaust (water) and has advanced the technology to the point where each vehicle regenerates its own fuel source throughout the day, which means that each vehicle would only need an initial fill and then would be self-sufficient.

Are you telling me I won't need to pee in a bottle anymore!

UpstateNYUPSer · 06-26-2008, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by New Englander

Are you telling me I won't need to pee in a bottle anymore!

Not unless you really, true want to then, by all means, piss away!!

pkg-king · 06-26-2008, 05:21 PM

Rumor has it we're presently testing a feeder that runs on hydrogen, I'm not at liberty to say where.

Mike Hawk · 06-26-2008, 06:44 PM

So how is hydrogen gathered for mass fuel uses? BBAG brought up a good point it takes a lot of energy to separate hydrogen from water, if those plants were fueled by oil, well that wouldn't help us much.

06-26-2008, 07:06 PM

[quote=But Benefits Are Great!;359581]

Fuel Costs were up horrendously for the 1st qtr

Fuel 1st Qtr 2007 - $616,000,000
Fuel 1st Qtr 2008 - $950,000,000
Not having to pay for the fuel yourself - priceless!!

coldworld · 06-26-2008, 09:45 PM

how about horse and buggy, like on that "carless" island somewhere. How about golfcarts pulling little carts behind them for the tight residential deliveries. Is a battery powered package car so futuristic? What makes this technology so hard to apply?

But Benefits Are Great! · 06-26-2008, 11:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Hawk

So how is hydrogen gathered for mass fuel uses? BBAG brought up a good point it takes a lot of energy to separate hydrogen from water, if those plants were fueled by oil, well that wouldn't help us much.

Using hydrogen will not save money - it is horrendously more expensive to produce, store, transport, than oil. It is "Green", no pollution for the end user, which gives all the environmentalists woodies.

Electrolysis, which takes electricity. Lots of it.

Mike Hawk · 06-27-2008, 01:17 AM

If only we could mine He3 from space...

UpstateNYUPSer · 06-27-2008, 04:05 AM

We have a number of Amish people who live between my center in Plattsburgh and the center in Potsdam and people will often mock their simpler lifestyles but I have to believe that they are having the last laugh as they go about their lives with their horse and buggy. Put a bucket on both the front and rear end of the horse and you are all set.

But Benefits Are Great! · 06-27-2008, 05:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coldworld

how about horse and buggy, like on that "carless" island somewhere. How about golfcarts pulling little carts behind them for the tight residential deliveries. Is a battery powered package car so futuristic? What makes this technology so hard to apply?

Battery technology.

The ability, means are available now. Unfortunately, to get a 150 mile range with meaningful power, you would need (the equivilent of) 120-140 car batteries, which would weigh a ton. Or use lithium Ion/Polymer batteries, which would be much smaller - but then each truck would cost 1.5 million dollars.

You heard it here first: Package cars will be electric, with just a few LiPo batteries, some ultra capacitors, an AC motor system, and a diesel generator. Fuel economy would double.