Ethics and personal responsibilty

[dilligaf]

Originally Posted by dannyboy

Its been a hard day, can you tell?d

Ya, I can tell. LOL

Originally Posted by tieguy

I'll keep my argument simple for now. Some people do a terrific job of gaining good treatment. Others seem to make theirselves victims all the time. Why is that? What makes one different from the other.

Please expound on this, I am interested in your theory. Seriously, Tie, I am interested.

Originally Posted by UPS Lifer

It is rare that I disagree with you but on this case I would put forth another premise that you may understand more clearly.

With any position in management comes some power and as you go up the ladder the more power that person has. Power can be used to intimidate even the most courageous individuals.

As a management person we have a personal, moral and ethical responsibility to our people to make sure we adhere to the highest standards. Unfortunately, this is not always the case. I have personally known management people who will do whatever it takes out of greed and want of more power. We have a recognize this and take responsibility to minimize the affects of people like this for the good of our people and our company. We do that by training, coaching, counseling, and managing conflict. This is power used in an ethical and moral way.

The more I read your posts the more sure I am that I would have enjoyed working for you. I have been at this ctr for a little better than 3 yrs and not once have I had a mgt team (from the lowliest of sups up to and including DM's) that has shown any moral or ethical responsibility towards their employees.

Originally Posted by UPS Lifer

just to add to your wonderful take on life - For me, it started with an awakening about 10 years before retirement. All to often we walk around in a fog of me and mine. I call it a lack of consciousness or being unconscious.
We need to be more conscious of the people around us and what affect we have. We have to be conscious of people in need and of our environment in which we live and work in every minute of every day. We will never be perfect but we must strive for perfection because it is the right thing to do.

I have said this before - If you live your life as if the most important person in your life is sitting on your shoulder observing every move you make, you will always do what is right and just.

Same as above.

Originally Posted by Channahon

This quoted out of UPS's "Code of Business Conduct". Before Tie jumps in here and claims something like I hate the man and there is no mistreatment by mgt of employees (LOL), no I don't hate the man (although there are days when that is very difficult for me to say) and yes there is absolutely mistreatment by mgt. Some are very fortunate to have great mgt teams. It's to bad that not every center within this company has the same fortune

Let's not forget the mistreatment of management by hourly employees as well. Life at UPS is a two way street, we are all working for UPS by choice, so ideally, mutual respect for UPS and our customers should be our common goal, along with making a good living and providing for our families.

You are right Chan. I do have to say that it is more dicey to mistreat mgt when they hold your pink slip.

It is hard to give respect when it is not given. I have always had a very good work ethic. My ethics and respect are for my customer at this point in time as my mgt team does not deserve any. I do not trust my mgt team and I have made this perfectly clear to my CM. I told him.

[dilligaf]

Originally Posted by tieguy

I'll keep my argument simple for now. Some people do a terrific job of gaining good treatment. Others seem to make theirselves victims all the time. Why is that? What makes one different from the other.

Tie, I don't always agree with everything that you say and I know you don't always agree with me. For all I know you have me on ignore. On my part it has never been personal.

I would like to know more about your theory. I am open to learning. One of the things that I like about BC is that everyone has different experiences and thoughts. If I can learn something from your theory that would improve my ability to deal with the bs at work, I will happily. And I would, happily, give you the credit for that.

So please, clarify your statement.

[UPS Lifer]

Originally Posted by Baba gounj

I haven't shined my shoes since I bought them 2 yrs ago.
All my shirt are wrinkled and pants too.
Yet they make me drive everyday.

I have to agree with Pretzel-man. You state they MAKE you drive. Again, it sounds like you don't want to do it. I am sure there are many other folks that would be chomping at the bit to get behind the wheel. Let your boss know you don't want to drive or at least take some pride in yourself and look like a pro behind the wheel!

And..... Shame on your supervisor for allowing you to go looking like you slept in your uniform!

[toonertoo]

Im all for appearance guidelines. None of the guys at my center ever look bad. Occasionally one will come in with a wrinkled shirt or forgot to shave, but nothing big, and they get told.
But I seriously gotta ask, what the heck does management think we look like beating on doors at 8pm, when its 90 or zero out. Is that ethical? How professional can we look? We look like idiots for being out at that hour, IMO. First they tell us to be safe, yet on the hottest and coldest days of the year, no adjustment is made for our safety. Then they tell us to look out for bad weather but our radios if we still have them are in the back and we cant hear them. I think everyone was more ethical and responsible when we could get home at a decent hour. I think UPS had more ethics on how to treat people when they actually cared and we all, including management werent just numbers. And the job got done with the right amount of people. That would be ethical. And when the car wash was allowed to do their job, and take pride in their work also, instead of leaving our cars looking like a 4yr old washed them, because they also are not allowed to do a good job in a fair amount of time. How proffesional does that look? Just another rant. JMHO

[soberups]

I do my part to maintain a professional appearance by shining my shoes and ironing my uniforms....but it is frustrating to me when UPS fails to uphold the same standards they hold me accountable for. My truck is consistently filthy...and the uniforms that are provided to me do NOT fit properly and are of poor quality. Unwashed vehicles, missing buttons, torn seams and visible butt-cracks and bellies make for a very unprofessional appearance, whether the shoes are shined or not.
It was stated in an earlier post that "when the little things are taken care of, the big things fall in line." I wish that were the case at UPS, but unfortunately it is not.

[soberups]

Originally Posted by UPS Lifer

Soberups - You just don't get it. It is not YOUR definition of what is reasonable.... It is UPS's definition of what is reasonable....
A "Grandfather Clause" indicates entitlement - When it comes to appearance (barring religious and personal health) there is no entitlement.

We have a driver who was hired 18 years ago with a tattoo on his arm. At no time was he ever told that tattoos were not allowed. One day, out of the clear blue, some new CM arbitrarily decided that the tattoo was "not reasonable" and he instructed this driver to wear a long sleeved shirt to cover it...even in the middle of summer.
UPS has the right to define what "reasonable" is....but they cannot arbitrarily change it based upon the whims and personal biases of some center manager. "Reasonable" means just that....consistent, fair, justifiable. It is not in any way reasonable to retroactively change a rule regarding tattoos 18 years after hiring somebody who was allowed to have one under the policies that were in place and agreed upon at that time.

[brownman15]

Originally Posted by toonertoo

But I seriously gotta ask, what the heck does management think we look like beating on doors at 8pm, when its 90 or zero out. Is that ethical? How professional can we look? We look like idiots for being out at that hour, IMO. First they tell us to be safe, yet on the hottest and coldest days of the year, no adjustment is made for our safety. Then they tell us to look out for bad weather but our radios if we still have them are in the back and we cant hear them. I think everyone was more ethical and responsible when we could get home at a decent hour. I think UPS had more ethics on how to treat people when they actually cared and we all, including management werent just numbers. And the job got done with the right amount of people. That would be ethical. And when the car wash was allowed to do their job, and take pride in their work also, instead of leaving our cars looking like a 4yr old washed them, because they also are not allowed to do a good job in a fair amount of time. How proffesional does that look? Just another rant. JMHO

on my route we are losing business because i have apartment complexes that close at 6pm and i am del them at 7 or 8pm. wind up sending most pkgs back after 3 attempts. get complaints just about everyday.

[UpstateNYUPSer]

Originally Posted by brownman15

on my route we are losing business because i have apartment complexes that close at 6pm and i am del them at 7 or 8pm. wind up sending most pkgs back after 3 attempts. get complaints just about everyday.

When you say close at 6pm does that mean that they are a gated community? If so, may I suggest you get to know one of the residents who frequently gets pkgs and ask them for the entry code. I would think leaving would not be an issue, just getting in.

[New Englander]

Originally Posted by UpstateNYUPSer

When you say close at 6pm does that mean that they are a gated community? If so, may I suggest you get to know one of the residents who frequently gets pkgs and ask them for the entry code. I would think leaving would not be an issue, just getting in.

Upstates correct. Most places like this will give us access via a key or combo. Once inside a normally locked apartment we can release at the correct doors.

[dannyboy]

I think what he is talking about is not access, but the ability to leave packages for the residents at the office.

I delivered several large appartment complexes like that. Had it not been for the office taking the packages, I would have had 15 or more sendagains just from those areas. And they did close at 5, So I always tried to get there before then.

99% of the neighbors would not take them either.

IMHO, since you deliver there after the office closes, they should be shown as missed. Even though you attempted delivery, you could have delivered them to the office had you been there during regular business hours.

But EDD knows best.

d

[brownmonster]

Our appearance to the customer gets worse each year, and it has nothing to do with uniforms or shoes.

[dilligaf]

Isn't that the truth!!!!!!!!!

[john346]

Originally Posted by UpstateNYUPSer

When you say close at 6pm does that mean that they are a gated community? If so, may I suggest you get to know one of the residents who frequently gets pkgs and ask them for the entry code. I would think leaving would not be an issue, just getting in.

I agree, and do the similar, I have lock codes for gates, and businesses, I also have a key chain that would choke a rhino. But it is with a careful understanding between the customer and me that if I enter a gated area, and get confronted by anyone other than who allowed me access, I will make my best explaination, but if they don't seem to like it, then the game is over.
Should ANYONE'S home within the community be burgularized, I do not want to be on the short list of possibilities. This has happened twice in my 24 years. One was a community of affluent Sun Valley transplants, one woman wanted her stuff, the rest of the people had bought way into the country to seperate themselves from the sights of UPS vans. One confrontation from another resident, I tried to explain that she had a package, I had to get it off of the car, none of you have telephones where I can contact for an alternate. What would you do? "Send the mother*#@^er back!" The next am, I received a concern that should I be spotted within the gate again he would press tresspassing charges. Of course the CM wanted me to call the guy and apologize, but dang the luck, the fellow whom I presume was named Dick, didn't have a telephone that I could call. I dropped her key in an envelope, with an explination and a copy of the complaint, and left all future packages for her with her friends. Two weeks later, you guessed it, she complained about the non-service!
Might as well love it, because hating it dosen't do any good.

[dilligaf]

Daniel, I never expected this to turn out the way it has. It has been a great thread and your initial post started it all. Well kinda.

This thread has run the gambit of personal responsibility, to company ethics and responsibility and morals. Everything from tats and personal appearance has been covered.

Now lets change it up a little. I Pm'd Daniel. After having had a really bad week I needed some input. I was pulled into the office for going over 9.5 on Monday. DM said he needed to 'micro-manage' my time. His words not mine. That was just one of the things that happened, and they sure as hell don't worry about me going over on thurs and fri. That happens 90% of the time. On thurs they broke out my bidded rte and forced me over 9.5. I had an 8 hr request for thurs, which was conviently lost. I didn't clock out until 9pm.

I asked Daniel how he did it for 33 yrs. I had lost focus last week (and actually for much longer than just last week). So I asked him for some guidance. Basically his responce was 'one day at a time'. Now it's everyone elses turn. Tie made a statement and it's obvious that he is going to ignore my request to clarify his statement. Since Tie is not going to respond, does anyone have any idea where he was going with his statement?

"I'll keep my argument simple for now. Some people do a terrific job of gaining good treatment. Others seem to make theirselves victims all the time. Why is that? What makes one different from the other."

IMHO, I don't think his argument holds any water. I think he was speaking of violating the contract to gain preferential treatment. I choose not to do this. I have a contract and I hold the company accountable to that contract. Tie, you seem to post more in Labor Relations than in Discussions. Since you seem to know so much about the contract then you will be familiar with Art. 37 Sect 1a.

[dannyboy]

Dill

Since you were the catylist for the thread, you actually deserve the Kudos I got for expressing it.

As for the subject you just brought up, hows about we start another thread, and I will Give you my take.

d

[dilligaf]

Originally Posted by dannyboy

Dill

Since you were the catylist for the thread, you actually deserve the Kudos I got for expressing it.

As for the subject you just brought up, hows about we start another thread, and I will Give you my take.

d

Lead on oh most thoughtful master!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[brownman15]

Originally Posted by UpstateNYUPSer

When you say close at 6pm does that mean that they are a gated community? If so, may I suggest you get to know one of the residents who frequently gets pkgs and ask them for the entry code. I would think leaving would not be an issue, just getting in.

apartment office closes at 6pm residents want pkgs del 2 office but since i am del after office closes people are diverting 2 other carriers

[UPS Lifer]

Originally Posted by john346

I agree, and do the similar, I have lock codes for gates, and businesses, I also have a key chain that would choke a rhino. But it is with a careful understanding between the customer and me that if I enter a gated area, and get confronted by anyone other than who allowed me access, I will make my best explaination, but if they don't seem to like it, then the game is over. ...

Might as well love it, because hating it dosen't do any good.

I guess I am confused on this. One of the residents has given you permission to enter a gated community. I do not think that any resident can tell you that you are trespassing. I would bet that the CC&Rs indicate that delivery or service personnel if given permission are able to enter the community.

I can't see how you could get in trouble for that. ????