Supervisors working grievance

[bdmiz]

When you file your sups working grievance, what type of format do you use? Do you put exact time worked? Where it was? Who it was? etc etc

Also, im in local 952, southwest region. Who gets paid on grievances? Lets say for example I file one for my immediate supervisor working on my belt and I'm second in seniority. Do I get paid because I'm filing it or does the highest seniority worker get paid. How about if I file on a supervisor thats not on my belt?

I researched my contract and wasn't able to find answers these questions.

Input appreciated!

[dillweed]

Hi - glad to hear you're upholding the contract by grieving.

Our union reps have forms that are filled out. There is an area for you to describe the situation. We just keep track of how much time they are spending and write it down.
ex: On such and such date pt sup dillweed spent 90 minutes sorting pkgs and doing tape-ups.

pt sup bdmiz spent 40 minutes unloading.

There's no need to say "pt sup sorted from 5:30 - 6:30" and so forth. We just tally up the minutes.

The form has areas for what article of the contract has been violated, your center, your ID number and so forth - union rep can help you fill that out.

If you're second in seniority and the first in seniority also files, I believe he will get the bucks. If he doesn't file, you should get it. Yes, you can grieve a sup outside your own area if you actually see them working. For example, from my perch on the sort aisle I can see a couple of the preload belts. If those sups are working within my sight I can grieve it and again, if I'm high seniority, I'll get the bucks.

One thing I'm not sure of is if you grieve another area and someone in that specific area also grieves.

Also not sure that your center union reps operate the same as ours.

Someone who knows more detail will probably come in and clear this up for you. Take care and good luck!

[dilligaf]

BDMIZ Dillweed has it right. Talk to your steward, he can help you fill the grievance out. The language is under Art. 3 sect 7 in the National Master. Also, your steward will investigate the times and talk to the sup. Most sups, when confronted by the steward, will tell them what they want to know. Don't be shy about asking a sup why they are handling pkgs. You have every right to ask. They will either stop doing it or give you a reason (sometimes legitimate, sometimes not) why.

Originally Posted by dillweed

Hi - glad to hear you're upholding the contract by grieving.

Our union reps have forms that are filled out. There is an area for you to describe the situation. We just keep track of how much time they are spending and write it down.
ex: On such and such date pt sup dillweed spent 90 minutes sorting pkgs and doing tape-ups.

pt sup bdmiz spent 40 minutes unloading.

There's no need to say "pt sup sorted from 5:30 - 6:30" and so forth. We just tally up the minutes.

The form has areas for what article of the contract has been violated, your center, your ID number and so forth - union rep can help you fill that out.

If you're second in seniority and the first in seniority also files, I believe he will get the bucks. If he doesn't file, you should get it. Yes, you can grieve a sup outside your own area if you actually see them working. For example, from my perch on the sort aisle I can see a couple of the preload belts. If those sups are working within my sight I can grieve it and again, if I'm high seniority, I'll get the bucks.

One thing I'm not sure of is if you grieve another area and someone in that specific area also grieves.

Also not sure that your center union reps operate the same as ours.

Someone who knows more detail will probably come in and clear this up for you. Take care and good luck!

[bubsdad]

Originally Posted by dilligaf

BDMIZ Dillweed has it right. Talk to your steward, he can help you fill the grievance out. The language is under Art. 3 sect 7 in the National Master. Also, your steward will investigate the times and talk to the sup. Most sups, when confronted by the steward, will tell them what they want to know. Don't be shy about asking a sup why they are handling pkgs. You have every right to ask. They will either stop doing it or give you a reason (sometimes legitimate, sometimes not) why.

There are only 2 legitimate reasons; 1.Supe was clearing the egress. 2. Supe had an hourly employee watching him. Anytime service is advanced and either of these are not a factor it is grievable.

[dilligaf]

Originally Posted by bubsdad

There are only 2 legitimate reasons; 1.Supe was clearing the egress. 2. Supe had an hourly employee watching him. Anytime service is advanced and either of these are not a factor it is grievable.

Yep, you pretty much covered it!

[raceanoncr]

Originally Posted by dillweed

If you're second in seniority and the first in seniority also files, I believe he will get the bucks. If he doesn't file, you should get it.

Hmmm...not so here. And notice I said, HERE!

Few years ago, we had train derailment passing through. UPS pups and railboxes laying all over. I had feeder laydown run and got back on Sun morn. The only brown tractor that shoulda been working on Sun. Saw feeder tractors coming into yard as I was leaving. Found out later that all supes with CDLs were called in to run trailers to site and back. No hourlies were called. Had names, times, numbers, the works. Asked all senior drivers that had hours available if they wanted to file. Well, guess what? Nobody wanted to. Too scared. So I did!

Won the grievance. But, you know what? The top senior drivers got paid! Me? NADA!

You know what else what? I don't file on these things any more. Sorry, bad attitude here. I know I should, but I don't. If you ain't got enuff stones to stand up for yourself, then I ain't gonna do your work. I ain't no steward.

[dilligaf]

That's not right Race. No one else filed no one else should have been paid. I can certainly understand your lack of enthusiasm on filing.

[705red]

Originally Posted by bubsdad

There are only 2 legitimate reasons; 1.Supe was clearing the egress. 2. Supe had an hourly employee watching him. Anytime service is advanced and either of these are not a factor it is grievable.

Number 1 is not allowed, if the sup was doing his/her job in the first place the egress ahould not get blocked. If they are not doing their job and this happens it is a grievance, at least here. We do not have the emergency condition language that allows sups to work.

The person filing the grievance is the grievant in most cases.

[Sleeve_meet_Heart]

Originally Posted by bubsdad

There are only 2 legitimate reasons; 1.Supe was clearing the egress. 2. Supe had an hourly employee watching him. Anytime service is advanced and either of these are not a factor it is grievable.

There are more than that.

[Solidarity413]

Originally Posted by Sleeve_meet_Heart

There are more than that.

I don't have my contract next to me, but doesn't the contract only state three? One is to demonstrate safety, to train an employee, or the newly added 'act of god'? Not sure if I'm right or not, but I think that's all the contract states.

[Sleeve_meet_Heart]

Originally Posted by Solidarity413

I don't have my contract next to me, but doesn't the contract only state three? One is to demonstrate safety, to train an employee, or the newly added 'act of god'? Not sure if I'm right or not, but I think that's all the contract states.

Yes, and bubsdad did not state 3, which is why I said "there are more than that".

Back in February there was an accident on the highway before our midnight shift. All of the supervisors were covering employees who were going to be late. this is a good example of the "act of God" language.

[deathracer]

i never file on these since most of the time the sups are helping me out since there stuff that im still learning to do they teach me how to do it so i dont get tired or tricks they learned. when they do work it might be cause of heavy flow so only work for 5 minutes or so unless a lot of ppl are missing.
but most of the time we can talk to their supervisor and he will handle it.

[Solidarity413]

Originally Posted by Sleeve_meet_Heart

Yes, and bubsdad did not state 3, which is why I said "there are more than that".

Back in February there was an accident on the highway before our midnight shift. All of the supervisors were covering employees who were going to be late. this is a good example of the "act of God" language.

Yeah, I hear ya. Gotta love that act of god language. Wonder if we could still file and say they should've expected the unexpected. Someone should try it. It is their methods

[slater929]

I filed 2 grievances last week for supervisors working. I was told I would get paid and I'm near the bottom of the seniority list. Nobody else filed that I am aware of. They cut a few positions out of our sort, we can't make pull times, so supervisors were working trying to make those pull times. I will continue to file as long as they work.

[upser_J]

Originally Posted by dilligaf

That's not right Race. No one else filed no one else should have been paid. I can certainly understand your lack of enthusiasm on filing.

not right but it happens occassionally... his grievance might have been settled with a bunch of other grievances and awarded to someone else as the settlement...also they could have just forgotten to pay him, too bad he didn't follow up on it

[upser_J]

Originally Posted by Solidarity413

Yeah, I hear ya. Gotta love that act of god language. Wonder if we could still file and say they should've expected the unexpected. Someone should try it. It is their methods

I recall one night during peak on the twi when one coordinator yelled at us saying that the supervisor of the area could work... it was "emergency conditions!" hahaha it was a good time, cuz i thought he was gonna have a heart attack right there cuz he was so angry haha!

[City Driver]

Originally Posted by slater929

I filed 2 grievances last week for supervisors working. I was told I would get paid and I'm near the bottom of the seniority list. Nobody else filed that I am aware of. They cut a few positions out of our sort, we can't make pull times, so supervisors were working trying to make those pull times. I will continue to file as long as they work.

yup, just keep filing

if you all consistantly cant do the work in the time they give you, that does not mean they have exhausted all reasonable resources to get the job done by teamsters

it means they need to hire more workers, or bring other teamsters over to your area


file file file

[SupraFast]

Supervisors can work in the following conditions from my understanding:

1. Employee goes to the bathroom and nobody is available to cover.
2. Too many employees have no call no shows and not enough employees to cover.
3. To clear egress situations.
4. To train an employee.
5. An employee leaves the work area without notifying a supervisor and there is nobody available to cover.

I am a part-time supervisor in a sort isle. The typical situations where I find myself working are when an employee has to use the bathroom and when there are boxes on the floor in the sort isle.

I usually have a PF sorter (PF is the name of the recycle belts that come from a boxline). This sorter is the extra guy I have in the sort isle that runs the recycle belts, scans the packages without labels with the ispa, and does tape ups. I would usually have him cover a guy who needs to use the bathroom. Sometimes he's not available to use. For example, if a package car backs up and he's my extra guy to sort that bay. If he's already covering someone who is in the bathroom and someone else needs to go to the bathroom. If the recycle belts are really heavy and he needs to sit on them.

What I find myself doing during the day with respect to working is just clearing up egress. I will pick boxes up off the floor and put them back on the belt for the sorters to sort, or move them to one side of the sort isle, or just sort the boxes myself off the floor that have labels. It really just depends on the egress situation. If it's blocking a stairwell, I will never hesitate to move the box away through any means necessary.

I take egress seriously. I too want to work in a safe as can be work environment. I don't want to have to climb over boxes and etc. So yes, I'm going to take the liberty to clear boxes off the floor and from the stairwell.

[SupraFast]

Originally Posted by 705red

Number 1 is not allowed, if the sup was doing his/her job in the first place the egress ahould not get blocked. If they are not doing their job and this happens it is a grievance, at least here. We do not have the emergency condition language that allows sups to work.

Negative. Let's be real here. Supervisors are responsible for the work area, yes. It is the employees who create the egress situations and choose not to clear it. I too am an employee of UPS and want to work in a safe work enviornment. If I see something unsafe, I'm going to correct the situation immediately.

If I disciplined every employee for creating a egress situation and not following my instructions to clear it up, we would not have many long term employees at UPS.

The truth is, some things need to be over looked and certain scenarios need to be taking into consideration. If you have a guy sorting at a bay and a few of his boxes fall on the floor, he's not going to care if you pick it up for him. He would much rather have that little bit of assistance rather than having to bend down and pick it up off the floor himself. If I instructed him to stop his bay and clear that minor egress situation, he's not going to be very happy with me. So it works both ways. Management and Union Employees need to work with each other in certain scenarios.

Samething with heavy packages. I get plenty of employees who ask for my assistance in helping them sort a heavy package.

Basically the issue is, if a Supervisor is doing minor things such as this, it's not really grounds for a grievance and nobody really cares. If you have a Supervisor actually performing a Union job for a consistent amount of time, then yes, it is questionable and grounds for a grievance based on the reason the Supervisor is working.

[Sleeve_meet_Heart]

Originally Posted by SupraFast

Negative. Let's be real here. Supervisors are responsible for the work area, yes. It is the employees who create the egress situations and choose not to clear it. I too am an employee of UPS and want to work in a safe work enviornment. If I see something unsafe, I'm going to correct the situation immediately.

If I disciplined every employee for creating a egress situation and not following my instructions to clear it up, we would not have many long term employees at UPS.

The truth is, some things need to be over looked and certain scenarios need to be taking into consideration. If you have a guy sorting at a bay and a few of his boxes fall on the floor, he's not going to care if you pick it up for him. He would much rather have that little bit of assistance rather than having to bend down and pick it up off the floor himself. If I instructed him to stop his bay and clear that minor egress situation, he's not going to be very happy with me. So it works both ways. Management and Union Employees need to work with each other in certain scenarios.

Samething with heavy packages. I get plenty of employees who ask for my assistance in helping them sort a heavy package.

Basically the issue is, if a Supervisor is doing minor things such as this, it's not really grounds for a grievance and nobody really cares. If you have a Supervisor actually performing a Union job for a consistent amount of time, then yes, it is questionable and grounds for a grievance based on the reason the Supervisor is working.

A P/T sup does not discpline or fire anyone, so your fairy tale sounds noble and very team-oriented ( clearing egress) but it is not very honest with yourself.

[Sleeve_meet_Heart]

Originally Posted by upser_J

I recall one night during peak on the twi when one coordinator yelled at us saying that the supervisor of the area could work... it was "emergency conditions!" hahaha it was a good time, cuz i thought he was gonna have a heart attack right there cuz he was so angry haha!

For whatever reason in CHEMA sups are allowed to work during peak. The union does not care at all, which is not surprising since they are in bed with management all the way. Interestingly, in the other buildings ive worked, it is much more subdued with sups working during peak. Seems like an unspoken side deal (unadvertised may be a better fit) between union and mgmnt in this case.

[SupraFast]

Originally Posted by Sleeve_meet_Heart

A P/T sup does not discpline or fire anyone, so your fairy tale sounds noble and very team-oriented ( clearing egress) but it is not very honest with yourself.

Lol what are you talking about? I do discipline all of the time. Employee termination would happen after all of the disciplinary steps have been taken and after HR steps in. I have never personally got someone fired, but I have done discpline plenty of times. What's not being honest with myself? I haven't said anything that isn't true. Please elaborate if you're going to put up an argument. Discpline occurs due to attendance and not following any supervisors instruction. If I tell you to clear up your egress situation and you refuse, that is grounds for discipline. I would never waste my time discplining for something like that though. It's understood that proper egress needs to be maintained by all employees. When you see an unsafe condition, you correct it immediately if it's within your capacity.

[Sleeve_meet_Heart]

Originally Posted by SupraFast

Lol what are you talking about? I do discipline all of the time. Employee termination happens after all of the disciplinary steps have been taken and after HR steps in. What's not being honest with myself? I haven't said anything that isn't true. Please elaborate if you're going to put up an argument. Discpline occurs due to attendance and not following any supervisors instruction. If I tell you to clear up your egress situation and you refuse, that is grounds for discipline. I would never waste my time discplining for something like that though. It's understood that proper egress needs to be maintained by all employees. When you see an unsafe condition, you correct it immediately if it's within your capacity.

I didn't realize that P/T sups have the authority to hire and fire people. Either you are special or I have no clue what i'm talking about.

[SupraFast]

Originally Posted by Sleeve_meet_Heart

I didn't realize that P/T sups have the authority to hire and fire people. Either you are special or I have no clue what i'm talking about.

Part-time Supervisors can perform discpline. If all the disciplinary steps have taken place and there is nothing left but HR, yes it can result in an employee termination due to a Part-time Supervisor. Of course a Full-Time Supervisor is going to want to know why because it is his operation as well and he has more experience in management.

Part-time Supervisors have more say than you think, at least in my building. I definitely could prevent someone from being hired (before making book), and take the necessary actions to get someone terminated if I really wanted to.

That isn't my goal as a supervisor though. All I try to do is keep the operation running. It's the people who refuse to show up or work that cause the issues...which is a minority but they do exisit. Most of my employees are a good group of guys.

[Sleeve_meet_Heart]

Originally Posted by SupraFast

Part-time Supervisors can perform discpline. If all the disciplinary steps have taken place and there is nothing left but HR, yes it can result in an employee termination due to a Part-time Supervisor.

That is my point. You can discipline employees to high heaven, yet you have no authority beyond that, period.

"If I disciplined every employee for creating a egress situation and not following my instructions to clear it up, we would not have many long term employees at UPS"